WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

**imported_Administrator** · 01-24-2003, 11:16 AM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

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as nintendo's first party games destroy xbox's(microsoft didn't make halo)

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Nintendo's own first party gem Metroid Prime was outsold by a third part Xbox game Splinter Cell over the holidays. Even IGN's own Editor made a post about this crying over what is wrong with Nintendo.

And last I checked Microsoft OWNS Bungie. So yes a Microsoft owned developer made Halo.

**K_Mosley** · 01-24-2003, 01:04 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

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not a big deal, many other baseball games will be out for GC, that just makes the choice easier. Whoever said nintendo is doomed, lol. Why do you think they can already confim there next console. PROFIT. They are making a profit on gamecube and a INSANE profit on the gameboy advance. Microsoft is losing billions slashing prices, bundling, etc.. just to creep there way into second place. Nintendo may not "win", but microsoft sure isn't either and is in the same boat as nintendo, kissing sony's feet. If nintendo buckles down and makes some competent hardware and lets those liscening fees dip for a change microsoft won't have a chance, as nintendo's first party games destroy xbox's(microsoft didn't make halo). By the way, I like, have, and enjoy xbox and it's new convienent features and affordability, but I just don't like microsoft as a company, it's obvious they are trying to go for the monopoly with there insane price reductions.

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Yeah, it definitely sucks to get your money's worth. We'll show those bastards at MS they can't do this to us.

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LOL @ fat pitcher...

Everyone's chasing Sony in this generation of consoles, primarily because Sony had a year's head start! It will be interesting in the next cycle of consoles, if they're all released at the same time, who will "win" that round of the "console wars." On even ground, I think that MS, Sony, and Nintendo can all stake claims on the entertainment dollars in the video game biz. MS may be selling it's soul to get the Xbox more market share; but that is so they can position themselves for round two. If the Xbox flopped, there would be no round two, and no chance to turn a profit in their video games division.

I say the more the merrier... The more choices, the more competition, the lower the prices and the better the games!

Kevin

**K_Mosley** · 01-24-2003, 01:04 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
not a big deal, many other baseball games will be out for GC, that just makes the choice easier. Whoever said nintendo is doomed, lol. Why do you think they can already confim there next console. PROFIT. They are making a profit on gamecube and a INSANE profit on the gameboy advance. Microsoft is losing billions slashing prices, bundling, etc.. just to creep there way into second place. Nintendo may not "win", but microsoft sure isn't either and is in the same boat as nintendo, kissing sony's feet. If nintendo buckles down and makes some competent hardware and lets those liscening fees dip for a change microsoft won't have a chance, as nintendo's first party games destroy xbox's(microsoft didn't make halo). By the way, I like, have, and enjoy xbox and it's new convienent features and affordability, but I just don't like microsoft as a company, it's obvious they are trying to go for the monopoly with there insane price reductions.

<hr /></blockquote>

Yeah, it definitely sucks to get your money's worth. We'll show those bastards at MS they can't do this to us.

<hr /></blockquote>

LOL @ fat pitcher...

Everyone's chasing Sony in this generation of consoles, primarily because Sony had a year's head start! It will be interesting in the next cycle of consoles, if they're all released at the same time, who will "win" that round of the "console wars." On even ground, I think that MS, Sony, and Nintendo can all stake claims on the entertainment dollars in the video game biz. MS may be selling it's soul to get the Xbox more market share; but that is so they can position themselves for round two. If the Xbox flopped, there would be no round two, and no chance to turn a profit in their video games division.

I say the more the merrier... The more choices, the more competition, the lower the prices and the better the games!

Kevin

**Erv** · 01-24-2003, 01:30 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

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Man, I admire your optimism. But I have to say, not being able to purchase what may well end up being the best baseball title this year does not make it easier.

<hr /></blockquote>

well i didn't see EA wasn't supporting GC here this time.(keep in mind EA is more partial to nintendo than microsoft, you never know if MVP is made for gc next year.) So the selection is paltry, especially since nintendo had the exclusive all-star 64 franchise. But will it matter, no, as High heat and all-star baseball gives you a in-betweener, a sim, and even all out arcade in slugfest. say what you want but as of now 3do has been uping sega in the non-technical areas lately.

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A few things. Nintendo is certainly not making profit on the Cube. They way the business works, every company loses money on the consoles themselves and makes money on the software. They ARE making a lot of money off of Gameboy Advance software sales, but the GameCube is not bringing in much money.

Microsoft IS losing money on the XBox, but it is not billions. They are not the only one's to slash prices either - last time I checked, both Nintendo and Sony had done the same. Moreover, Microsoft, with it gadzoinks of money, understands that the videogame war will take place over two or three consoles and isn't going into a panic, which is nice.

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Last time I checked, nintendo was had a profit at about .65 billion dollars, which would say to me they have more money then ever, so why would they become a developer and turn out like sega. On the price cutting, what I am implying is that Microsoft is making consoles(with software included in bundle) at a almost $200(could be more, but I assume productions costs are down, but maybe not if they are in the red with xbox) loss, no one has done that before ever. The gamecube is at a price where they aren't losing much at all if any, since it is a game console. I also recall Xbox was the first to begin cutting, sony or nintendo were not planning on price reductions until microsoft started it.(paper ad's confirmed it)

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Every company is going for the win. Considering Nintendo slashed the price of GC with Mario Sunshine and a memory card to 129.99, I'd say their measures have been more drastic than anybody elses.

Hey, I love the GameCube, I have one and play MEtroid and Mario to death. But as a major platform, the system is doomed.

I had a Dreamcast, and they even had more thrid party support than Nintendo currently does. And while I agree Nintendo's games are on the whole better than Microsofts, I also understand that StarFox(Rare) and Metriod weren't made by Nintendo(Retro Studios) and that MS has a few good titles (Mech Assault) of their own without evening seeing Rare titles come through the pipeline yet. Rare is a major aquisition for Microsoft.

Ths isn't a "system" wars debate, I'm looking at it from a business perspective. But when a company like Sega pulls out and other third party titles are coming to a trickle, I can see the writing on the wall.

Nintendo has now had trouble with 2 straight consoles, the N64 and GC. I say they take one more shot if that, and then go thr route of developer

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your first paragraph is completly false, it retails for $189, a common practice by almost any console maker. Next, while Rare is great, gamecube is getting support from people like square as well. If you didn't hear any info by this time, I wouldn't hold my breath for any rare titles any time soon. The only pull-out that is official is WSB 2K3, sega recently has released sonic collection, pso 1/2, super monkey ball 2, skies of arcadia legends, and beach spikers. Yes but mechassault is more or less building on the pc side, otherwise all i see is MS slapping there names on games like blinx, kajuto chojin, quantum redshift, azurik, sneakers, almost all crap besides halo, pgr, and mech. while nintendo publishes ed, animal crossing, mario, super smash, and has really only missed with luigis and wave race. A tad close but nintendo still has the quality race won. nintendo just REitterated there commitment to consoles, check gamespot. Even though nintendo NEEDS to try and pick it up(and yes they are price cutting a little too), but they will have a little advantage back again when zelda and final fantasy, both which will be huge.

**Erv** · 01-24-2003, 01:30 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Man, I admire your optimism. But I have to say, not being able to purchase what may well end up being the best baseball title this year does not make it easier.

<hr /></blockquote>

well i didn't see EA wasn't supporting GC here this time.(keep in mind EA is more partial to nintendo than microsoft, you never know if MVP is made for gc next year.) So the selection is paltry, especially since nintendo had the exclusive all-star 64 franchise. But will it matter, no, as High heat and all-star baseball gives you a in-betweener, a sim, and even all out arcade in slugfest. say what you want but as of now 3do has been uping sega in the non-technical areas lately.

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
A few things. Nintendo is certainly not making profit on the Cube. They way the business works, every company loses money on the consoles themselves and makes money on the software. They ARE making a lot of money off of Gameboy Advance software sales, but the GameCube is not bringing in much money.

Microsoft IS losing money on the XBox, but it is not billions. They are not the only one's to slash prices either - last time I checked, both Nintendo and Sony had done the same. Moreover, Microsoft, with it gadzoinks of money, understands that the videogame war will take place over two or three consoles and isn't going into a panic, which is nice.

<hr /></blockquote>

Last time I checked, nintendo was had a profit at about .65 billion dollars, which would say to me they have more money then ever, so why would they become a developer and turn out like sega. On the price cutting, what I am implying is that Microsoft is making consoles(with software included in bundle) at a almost $200(could be more, but I assume productions costs are down, but maybe not if they are in the red with xbox) loss, no one has done that before ever. The gamecube is at a price where they aren't losing much at all if any, since it is a game console. I also recall Xbox was the first to begin cutting, sony or nintendo were not planning on price reductions until microsoft started it.(paper ad's confirmed it)

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Every company is going for the win. Considering Nintendo slashed the price of GC with Mario Sunshine and a memory card to 129.99, I'd say their measures have been more drastic than anybody elses.

Hey, I love the GameCube, I have one and play MEtroid and Mario to death. But as a major platform, the system is doomed.

I had a Dreamcast, and they even had more thrid party support than Nintendo currently does. And while I agree Nintendo's games are on the whole better than Microsofts, I also understand that StarFox(Rare) and Metriod weren't made by Nintendo(Retro Studios) and that MS has a few good titles (Mech Assault) of their own without evening seeing Rare titles come through the pipeline yet. Rare is a major aquisition for Microsoft.

Ths isn't a "system" wars debate, I'm looking at it from a business perspective. But when a company like Sega pulls out and other third party titles are coming to a trickle, I can see the writing on the wall.

Nintendo has now had trouble with 2 straight consoles, the N64 and GC. I say they take one more shot if that, and then go thr route of developer

<hr /></blockquote>

your first paragraph is completly false, it retails for $189, a common practice by almost any console maker. Next, while Rare is great, gamecube is getting support from people like square as well. If you didn't hear any info by this time, I wouldn't hold my breath for any rare titles any time soon. The only pull-out that is official is WSB 2K3, sega recently has released sonic collection, pso 1/2, super monkey ball 2, skies of arcadia legends, and beach spikers. Yes but mechassault is more or less building on the pc side, otherwise all i see is MS slapping there names on games like blinx, kajuto chojin, quantum redshift, azurik, sneakers, almost all crap besides halo, pgr, and mech. while nintendo publishes ed, animal crossing, mario, super smash, and has really only missed with luigis and wave race. A tad close but nintendo still has the quality race won. nintendo just REitterated there commitment to consoles, check gamespot. Even though nintendo NEEDS to try and pick it up(and yes they are price cutting a little too), but they will have a little advantage back again when zelda and final fantasy, both which will be huge.

**Erv** · 01-24-2003, 01:38 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Yea that makes alot of sense

No EA, no Sega baseball and I am just counting the days until Trip @ 3DO realizes that sports games on Nintendo systems don't sell. I mean he is using his own money now.

Out goes WSB and in comes...

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i understand where you are coming from. In fact it's weird for nintendo to not have an exclusive A baseball series(all-star/ken griffey's, but then realize 3do was pc, sega 3rd party, and ea total sony). This year now there is no baseball coming from second parties/exclusive, but there is still just as high quality as there was before.

Splinter Cell may have won now, i think i'd put my money on metroid having the endurance to stay high all year, something NOW known third party game couldn't do.

**Erv** · 01-24-2003, 01:38 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
Yea that makes alot of sense

No EA, no Sega baseball and I am just counting the days until Trip @ 3DO realizes that sports games on Nintendo systems don't sell. I mean he is using his own money now.

Out goes WSB and in comes...

<hr /></blockquote>

i understand where you are coming from. In fact it's weird for nintendo to not have an exclusive A baseball series(all-star/ken griffey's, but then realize 3do was pc, sega 3rd party, and ea total sony). This year now there is no baseball coming from second parties/exclusive, but there is still just as high quality as there was before.

Splinter Cell may have won now, i think i'd put my money on metroid having the endurance to stay high all year, something NOW known third party game couldn't do.

**ThatCanadianGuy** · 01-24-2003, 03:48 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

Why are they slashing prices and bundling????? To get consoles into homes. They are the new kid on the block, they have to get a share of the market somehow.

Look at all the companies Sony bought when they entered the console biz, Nintendo has bought companies, you act like they are squeaky clean. They aren't. MS needs some good in house stuff so buying Rare and that french company is what they needed.

Of course if Nintendo would buy Capcom that would be ok right? Since it's not MS. When Sony pretty much bought the GTA series, Soul Reaver series and the Icog team that was ok right? Since it's not MS.

Just enjoy the games and stop hating on a certain company.

Now apologize to little Billy!

**ThatCanadianGuy** · 01-24-2003, 03:48 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

Why are they slashing prices and bundling????? To get consoles into homes. They are the new kid on the block, they have to get a share of the market somehow.

Look at all the companies Sony bought when they entered the console biz, Nintendo has bought companies, you act like they are squeaky clean. They aren't. MS needs some good in house stuff so buying Rare and that french company is what they needed.

Of course if Nintendo would buy Capcom that would be ok right? Since it's not MS. When Sony pretty much bought the GTA series, Soul Reaver series and the Icog team that was ok right? Since it's not MS.

Just enjoy the games and stop hating on a certain company.

Now apologize to little Billy!

**Maddenplyr** · 01-24-2003, 04:37 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
as nintendo's first party games destroy xbox's(microsoft didn't make halo)

<hr /></blockquote>

Nintendo's own first party gem Metroid Prime was outsold by a third part Xbox game Splinter Cell over the holidays. Even IGN's own Editor made a post about this crying over what is wrong with Nintendo.

And last I checked Microsoft OWNS Bungie. So yes a Microsoft owned developer made Halo.

<hr /></blockquote>

Microsoft bought Bungie well into the development cycle, because originally it was supposed to come to PS2 and XBOX because it was not exclusive to a console.

**Maddenplyr** · 01-24-2003, 04:37 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
as nintendo's first party games destroy xbox's(microsoft didn't make halo)

<hr /></blockquote>

Nintendo's own first party gem Metroid Prime was outsold by a third part Xbox game Splinter Cell over the holidays. Even IGN's own Editor made a post about this crying over what is wrong with Nintendo.

And last I checked Microsoft OWNS Bungie. So yes a Microsoft owned developer made Halo.

<hr /></blockquote>

Microsoft bought Bungie well into the development cycle, because originally it was supposed to come to PS2 and XBOX because it was not exclusive to a console.

**brendanrfoley** · 01-24-2003, 06:57 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

Erv, I'm not trying to back you against a wall, but I do (for the sake of conversation, of course) have to disagree with you.

Every manafacturer loses money on a console, no matter how much they sell it for. And despite my misreporting of the Mario bundle, Nintendo is still losing money on the GC console itself.

The reason the big N has so much money in the bank is because of its stellar software and the GameBoy Advance. Nintendo games are incredible and it is the sole reason I own a GC.

But what I'm trying to say is from the perspective of a third party - a company like Sega, EA, Konami, etc, is that the GC is not an attractive plattform. Non Nintendo titles sell poorly and the GC is starting to fall well into third place in the console race. IT looks like the Dreamcast all over again - worth it for the first part titles, but go else where for thrid party titles.

My predicition on Nintendo turing to software is predicating on two things: Primarily, Nintendo will need to fail with their next system in the same context it has failed with the GC and N64. Secondly, their removal from the console market, with this failure, would still be 5 years away at the earliest - so what they say now is moot.

Nintendo has made two crucial mistakes that have sealed their fate, in my opinion. Breaking off their relationship with Sony in the early 90's is the first. The left Sony at the alter and forgot to ask for their CD system back.

Secondly? Their arogance in going with cartridges with the N64. It pushed countless developers away, such as Square, who are just now sneaking back in. If the N64 had gone with a disc, Square would have remained, FFVII would have remained Nintendo exclusive, and the rest would be history.

**brendanrfoley** · 01-24-2003, 06:57 PM

Re: WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

Erv, I'm not trying to back you against a wall, but I do (for the sake of conversation, of course) have to disagree with you.

Every manafacturer loses money on a console, no matter how much they sell it for. And despite my misreporting of the Mario bundle, Nintendo is still losing money on the GC console itself.

The reason the big N has so much money in the bank is because of its stellar software and the GameBoy Advance. Nintendo games are incredible and it is the sole reason I own a GC.

But what I'm trying to say is from the perspective of a third party - a company like Sega, EA, Konami, etc, is that the GC is not an attractive plattform. Non Nintendo titles sell poorly and the GC is starting to fall well into third place in the console race. IT looks like the Dreamcast all over again - worth it for the first part titles, but go else where for thrid party titles.

My predicition on Nintendo turing to software is predicating on two things: Primarily, Nintendo will need to fail with their next system in the same context it has failed with the GC and N64. Secondly, their removal from the console market, with this failure, would still be 5 years away at the earliest - so what they say now is moot.

Nintendo has made two crucial mistakes that have sealed their fate, in my opinion. Breaking off their relationship with Sony in the early 90's is the first. The left Sony at the alter and forgot to ask for their CD system back.

Secondly? Their arogance in going with cartridges with the N64. It pushed countless developers away, such as Square, who are just now sneaking back in. If the N64 had gone with a disc, Square would have remained, FFVII would have remained Nintendo exclusive, and the rest would be history.

WSB 2K3 cancelled for the GC:

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