Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

[Behindshadows]

I wanted to share a blog I just created of decline in 2k baseball!

We can all agree or disagree that 2k7 was the last great 2k baseball game. I wanted to share my thoughts along with a video recorded today.

watch in 720p and really appreciate the details and leave your honest thought...

DECLINE IN 2k BASEBALL BLOG

3/14/2012 added HD Images of 2k7

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

Given 2K11 was a very good game -- arguably the best baseball game on the market from a "fun factor" perspective -- and that 2K12 is proportedly even better, it's hard to understand your comment here. The series is definitely on the upswing, both from a playability and QA perspective.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

The only thing that has improved in this series is the gameplay and commentary. Swingstick is much improved and much more responsive, commentators are more informative and really like a broadcast.

But graphically, the models went straight down hill after 2k7, that's why I said in Quality! Graphics are hideous and worse, players look like themselves, player models proportions are worse, jersey cloth details, colors and even lighting got worse....

Youtube just compressed the death out of my video and made it look worse...so I'm uploading the larger HD file to a different host. Just to get a real look!

I own them all so I'm not just bad mouthing them for my health! I just think they went backwards in the art department! I agree 2k12 is a fun game and I play it daily...

I just don't understand why the graphics got worse each year and still remain worse..

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

I own them all so I'm not just bad mouthing them for my health!

Nobody is accusing you of badmouthing the series, I'm simply saying I completely disagree. The series the past few years was a mess, and each version of the game was unplayable due to terrible gameplay and horrible QA. 2K11 was the first game in years that was actually playable and enjoyable, and 2K12 is supposed to be even better.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

Nobody is accusing you of badmouthing the series, I'm simply saying I completely disagree. The series the past few years was a mess, and each version of the game was unplayable due to terrible gameplay and horrible QA. 2K11 was the first game in years that was actually playable and enjoyable, and 2K12 is supposed to be even better.

I agree with you 100% on the gameplay aspects, it's playable and it's sometimes extremely fun.

But faults of ugliness lied so deep in 2k11 from stuttering running animations to glitches from head to toe, player models look like mannequins instead of humans and when they moved they was stiff and almost like they were gliding.

It plays well and controls are great I'm not denying that..I appreciate the efforts, but when I'm playing a Current Generation game, I want it to look the part, not look worse and outdated....that's where I don't understand.

How the gameplay got better and the art got worse and declined in quality!

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

But faults of ugliness lied so deep in 2k11 from stuttering running animations to glitches from head to toe

IMO, the animations and QA are both greatly improved in 2K11. Whereas previous versions of the game were so ugly from an animation perspective that I honestly couldn't bear to play the game and have to look at it while in motion. I'd say the only thing that previous versions had that were better, were player model/uniform graphics and hi-rez grass. Which resulted in frame rate issues that made the game close to unplayable.

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

I'll add that I'm not much of a graphics person. I recognize that 2K11 looks a lot like a video game from the mid-2000s from a graphics perspective. But that's fine with me. Where the series has without a doubt taken a major step backwards is in the options department. Sliders and hitting options have been removed, and the game has basically been dumbed down for the casual gamer. But again, if the end result is a game that plays well and is fun, then even that can been seen as progress and improvement on some level.

[Tomba]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

MLB 2K7 was probably 3 years ahead of its time with what it was doing. the dev team disbanded BADLY and new one was in place of it that dint know the tech or the code of waht was done in 2K7 so they just started back up with something more"doable". At the time MVP producer Bowman came in and had his heart set on gameplay and literally invented the the whole pitching mechanic we see still today UNCHANGED.

There's history as to why this happened and its all because of budgets.MLB 2k7 didnt sell well enough had no competition and was a company gamble.

The tech inside MLB 2k7 was amazing for the time. The sense of wind has never EVER been beaten with the way the cloth physics work and past for a few ppl's complaints of it being overly done it was about 95% right in some way. Also player uniforms were beautifully BAGGY as opposed to the pasted on look we have in MLB 212 and The Show.

So I agree the graphics took a huge step down. But it's not really a huge step down it's more like a complete 360 on the 360 after only one year. Seeing MLB 2k8 made me CRY physically it was gut wrenching and i swore up and down and cursed the ground Bowman walked on for the whole year and bit my tongue from being overly mean about him.

This isnt an issue of gameplay as the game plays marginally the same because 2k bases its gameplay off of animation triggering and one look at the above video shows the same animations still prevalent in MLB 2k12 so this is really a graphics issue we have to buy into...

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

for a few ppl's complaints of it being overly done it was about 95% right in some way.

The cloth physics, while impressive, were in fact completely overdone. Between unis flapping like flags in the wind to the 2XXXX baggy pants on most players, the game looked laughable and ridiculous. Meanwhile the rest of the game programming got zero upgrades and attention.

This isnt an issue of gameplay as the game plays marginally the same

Not the case. The game from a gameplay and AI (and lack of bugs and glitches) perspective plays 2-3 times better than those abominations 2K released from 2K5 to 2K10. Hitting in 2K baseball up until last year consisted of nothing but fly balls and screaming line drives. Wasn't even close to how real baseball plays. They've finally started to get that right beginning with 2K11.

[JBH3]

This thread/blog/whatever is about 5 yrs too late. 2K7 was an utter disaster. Everything up to 2K11 was an unplayable piece of junk that most of us still played anyways by default of owning one console, a 360.

I loved 2K11....the game played great and challenged me. The pitching/hitting interface is/was fun an intuitive.

The dynamic ratings and injury slider + fatigue gave the manager of a franchise hurdles and challenges to deal with yr in and yr out.

2K12 I believe only builds on 2K11s success....

For crying out loud, they didn't even have take-out slides in the gm until like 2K10!

[Money99]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

This thread/blog/whatever is about 5 yrs too late. 2K7 was an utter disaster. Everything up to 2K11 was an unplayable piece of junk that most of us still played anyways by default of owning one console, a 360.

I loved 2K11....the game played great and challenged me. The pitching/hitting interface is/was fun an intuitive.

The dynamic ratings and injury slider + fatigue gave the manager of a franchise hurdles and challenges to deal with yr in and yr out.

2K12 I believe only builds on 2K11s success....

For crying out loud, they didn't even have take-out slides in the gm until like 2K10!

Terrific post.
Being an Xbox owner, it sucked not having any options until last year.
VC took the reigns and cleaned up a colossal mess. It just stinks that they inherited not only bugs and gameplay deficiencies but really poor player models.
So you've got to pick your battles and I think VC took the proper route by cleaning up gameplay and bugs.
2K12 is a tonne of fun. I can't say enough positive things about the gesture-pitching mechanic. It's the first baseball game where I couldn't wait to pitch.

Unfortunately, the player models are still lacking. If 2K looked like The Show (graphically), this game gets a lot more credit than it does.
I hope for the next-gen boxes they can rebuild the models from the ground up. In fact, a lot of 2K's games don't have nice models; NHL2K, NBA2K12 and MLB. All 3 leave something to be desired.

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

This thread/blog/whatever is about 5 yrs too late.

That, or the blog title should be changed to: 2K Baseball... FINALLY playable, just what took them so long?!

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

2K7 was the prettiest game, but IMO, it was by no means the best in terms of game play. I don't remember who it was (KushGamer), but one of the dev's admitted that the outcome of a hit was completely 100% a role of the dice meaning that the user had almost no control of the outcome of a hit. Pitches that were several inches outside could be pulled for HR's with ease.

For classic control fans, the controls were...well...classic. They did have a few options for pitching that I thought were solid and produced great results (I can't for the life of me remember what they were called).

And from what I remember, the gameplay on line was a lag-filled nightmare. You pretty much had to commit to swinging or not swinging when the ball left the pitchers hand with almost no time to actually identify pitch-type and location.

IMO, a huge part of the decline in quality has to do with the decline of options and over simplification of the game. Previous iterations over time have brought great ideas to the table that have been either scrapped or dumbed down without ever leaving the original idea behind as an option (Three step pitching became two step pitching, zone hitting was scrapped, step influence was scrapped, the throw meter was dumbed down to take out user control over missed direction). These are all things that added another level of realism to the game, that were all taken away from the user.

The majority of the "decline" IMO has to do with my assumption that the people creating this game have and have always had very little true baseball experience. Baseball fans maybe, but not baseball players...at least not at higher levels where the small details of the game are of great importance.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

literally invented the the whole pitching mechanic we see still today UNCHANGED.

It was changed, though. In 2K8, it was a three step progression (quality, effort and location) that was then simplified to the current two step system, which I guess combines quality and effort

It was direction 1- Hold, movement/gesture to direction 2- Hold and then a timed release.

Also, for what it's worth, it was Brinkman (not Bowman)

[Yeats]

Re: Decline in Quality of MLB 2k Baseball

IMO, a huge part of the decline in quality has to do with the decline of options and over simplification of the game. Previous iterations over time have brought great ideas to the table that have been either scrapped or dumbed down without ever leaving the original idea behind as an option (Three step pitching became two step pitching, zone hitting was scrapped, step influence was scrapped, the throw meter was dumbed down to take out user control over missed direction). These are all things that added another level of realism to the game, that were all taken away from the user.

Well put, absolutely agree. People can debate the importance of graphics when discussing where this series has been and where it is going. But IMO, the above has contributed far more to any decline this series has seen the past few years. 2K11 is fun, but it's a game designed specifically for casual gamers, no question. 2K's devs even said as much. That was their way of trying to win back gamers. Unfortunately it comes at a cost to those of us who prefer more reallism and more of a challenge, especially in the hitting dept.