Re: 42

[JBH3]

Re: 42

I dont like it. I totally respect what Jackie Robinson did but I dont like this #42 thing.

Yea. It's ridiculous isn't it...

I mean a whole month where we have to recognize a certain people. Forcibly having to take a day off to recognize the sacrifices made by our veterans (veterans day), having to recognize Martin Luther King day, having to recognize Washington's birthday...

I hate how they make ME remember all of this stuff. I'm going to tell my boss that I don't want to take Memorial Day off because I hate it's obligatory nature.



It's one day of wearing a number that represents so much more than just a number and a person. It's a very VERY good thing.

Take your ideals somewhere else. This is a very important value for MLB, and is especially important given the low population of black American ballplayers.

[shnuskis]

Re: 42

Yea. It's ridiculous isn't it...

I mean a whole month where we have to recognize a certain people. Forcibly having to take a day off to recognize the sacrifices made by our veterans (veterans day), having to recognize Martin Luther King day, having to recognize Washington's birthday...

I hate how they make ME remember all of this stuff. I'm going to tell my boss that I don't want to take Memorial Day off because I hate it's obligatory nature.



It's one day of wearing a number that represents so much more than just a number and a person. It's a very VERY good thing.

Take your ideals somewhere else. This is a very important value for MLB, and is especially important given the low population of black American ballplayers.

Here you are forced to take Veteran's Day off, and I am a veteran and need to take a vacation day if I am even able to.

As far as Jackie Robinson day goes, I understand the importance of remembering him and what it meant. It went beyond the playing field and made a statement to a society.

I also understand the point made of too many rememberence days. After a while it becomes diluted. Look at Memorial Day. It has become more of a three day weekend holiday to most people than a day to remember the people who have died in military service. I think what he is saying is every 10 years would have greater impact.

I am not choosing sides, but both sides have valid points.

Oh, people do take Memorial Day off and have protests because they don't agree with its obligatory nature.

[JBH3]

Re: 42

Here you are forced to take Veteran's Day off, and I am a veteran and need to take a vacation day if I am even able to.

As far as Jackie Robinson day goes, I understand the importance of remembering him and what it meant. It went beyond the playing field and made a statement to a society.

I also understand the point made of too many rememberence days. After a while it becomes diluted. Look at Memorial Day. It has become more of a three day weekend holiday to most people than a day to remember the people who have died in military service. I think what he is saying is every 10 years would have greater impact.

I am not choosing sides, but both sides have valid points.

Oh, people do take Memorial Day off and have protests because they don't agree with its obligatory nature.

I'm a vet too, and love, recognize, and have an appreciation for all our Federal holidays.

The point isn't whether or not it's diluted, or if a few old grumps are tired of the 24 hr media coverage or it's "obligatory" nature.

Every 10 yrs would be ABSOLUTELY ridiculous, horrendous, proposterous (a la Jackie Chiles :wink.

The POINT of it is to draw awareness EVERY year for every young mind/young baseball fan who sits down w/ their father/parents, and watches a baseball game, recognizes every player wearing the same #, and asks why.

As adults it would be nice for ALL to reflect on this in a positive way rather than have people come out w/ their idealistic view on things, and have this ACLU-like representation for players and their 'feelings' about mandatorily wearing a different uniform for one freaking day.

But...I guess that would be too perfect a world.

It's suppose to symbolize that WE ALL as a people want to move past racisim and into equality, and to acknowledge a great martyr for this movement.

[yvesdereuter]

Re: 42

well, I find the origional post "reckless" I mean why make a Jackie Robinson thread and throw in how you still dont have a fair shot at your dreams, then he followed it up with his yssa boss comments,etc.

Its funny you ignore those posts and cling to the post that says MLB players shouldnt be billboards or used to further MLB politics.

What he meant was, all MLB players wore 42. It wasnt an option for them, therefore how "good" can it be? While its good they respect what JR did, they didnt do it cause they respect him, they did it cause selig told them to do it, which is messed up when you look at it like that. This is what he was saying, or at least that is my understanding of it.

Thats one aspect of it. The other point kind of goes along with that. And thats that MLB shouldnt be able to use players to make political statements however harmless or well-intended. These guys are paid to play baseball not be vehicles for MLBs political messages. And like you said, if theyd like to do something, they should be able to do so on their terms, otherwise it diminishes the meaning. Either way, this should not be forced on the players.

[yvesdereuter]

Re: 42

Yea. It's ridiculous isn't it...

I mean a whole month where we have to recognize a certain people. Forcibly having to take a day off to recognize the sacrifices made by our veterans (veterans day), having to recognize Martin Luther King day, having to recognize Washington's birthday...

I hate how they make ME remember all of this stuff. I'm going to tell my boss that I don't want to take Memorial Day off because I hate it's obligatory nature.

This is really a flailing attempt to make a point. What you mentioned isnt really comparable.

It's one day of wearing a number that represents so much more than just a number and a person. It's a very VERY good thing.

Take your ideals somewhere else. This is a very important value for MLB, and is especially important given the low population of black American ballplayers.

You have no idea what my values are. And, as I said, there are largere principles that should be in play.

[JBH3]

Re: 42

This is really a flailing attempt to make a point. What you mentioned isnt really comparable.

Not comparable? The concept remains the same.

As the days I mentioned are rich in American history, so is Jackie Robinson day, and the history of this day is not only important to American history but equally important to baseball's history.

Would you celebrate MLK day every 10 years?
Would you celebrate Memorial Day every 10 years?

Why is celebrating Jackie Robinson day any different?

Even if most don't recognize MLK, Memorial, Veteran's, or another Federal holiday they still more than likely enjoy the day off. Sure there are people who might refuse to acknowledge these days, but thats a small % of people.

You have no idea what my values are. And, as I said, there are largere principles that should be in play.

I wasn't questioning your values. Merely stating that going against 42 day for the reasons you put it were too idealistic.

I mean the players having to mandatorily wear a jersey and that infringing upon their rights?

BS.

Playing in the majors is a privlege not a right. My employer requires me to dress a certain way. Wearing Jackie Robinson's #42 is the required UNIFORM OF THE DAY.

There's no politics involved, it's recognizing a MOST important player and influential person, and he did for a race and a league and as an American.

As for these so-called politics you feel MLB brings into play, what are they? Are you trying to say they exploit Jackie Robinson for profit? What is it you're trying to say? What politics? I'm no way on board w/ Bud Selig, but I don't understand AT ALL anything wrong w/ Jackie Robinson day. Regardless the good outweighs the bad in whatever 'Bad' you see in this celebration.

What about the kids like I posted in response to Shnuskis?

[jake44np]

Re: 42

So when will MLB start having a Roberto Clemente day and make every player wear #21?
You know its coming, Roberto was just a great humanitarian and should get his own day too!

[EWRMETS]

Re: 42

I don't think Jackie Robinson belongs in a class above Larry Doby and Satchel Paige. Doby debuted a few months after Robinson and nobody ever talks about him. I think all the great Negro League players deserve to be honored.

[yvesdereuter]

Re: 42

Not comparable? The concept remains the same.

As the days I mentioned are rich in American history, so is Jackie Robinson day, and the history of this day is not only important to American history but equally important to baseball's history.

Would you celebrate MLK day every 10 years?
Would you celebrate Memorial Day every 10 years?

Why is celebrating Jackie Robinson day any different?

Even if most don't recognize MLK, Memorial, Veteran's, or another Federal holiday they still more than likely enjoy the day off. Sure there are people who might refuse to acknowledge these days, but thats a small % of people.

Again, comparing federal holidays isnt really comparable at all. People are allowed to celebrate/observe them as they wish. Theyre not required to be an advocate in anyway by virtue of being forced to wear something. Not even close.

I wasn't questioning your values. Merely stating that going against 42 day for the reasons you put it were too idealistic.

I mean the players having to mandatorily wear a jersey and that infringing upon their rights?

BS.

Playing in the majors is a privlege not a right. My employer requires me to dress a certain way. Wearing Jackie Robinson's #42 is the required UNIFORM OF THE DAY.

There's no politics involved, it's recognizing a MOST important player and influential person, and he did for a race and a league and as an American.

As for these so-called politics you feel MLB brings into play, what are they? Are you trying to say they exploit Jackie Robinson for profit? What is it you're trying to say? What politics? I'm no way on board w/ Bud Selig, but I don't understand AT ALL anything wrong w/ Jackie Robinson day. Regardless the good outweighs the bad in whatever 'Bad' you see in this celebration.

I had a longer more elaborate reply typed up for this but I timed out. Im not going to recreate that but I will say that there is a larger issue in play and its that the players are being forced to do it which diminishes the sincerity of it and also that they should not be forced to be billboards for political, social, or commercial messages.

I think if people were to work at a place that was bought out by muslims and were in turn forced to wear pro-Islam clothing the tone would be different. The same principle that protects people from that also says that ballplayers shouldnt be forced to participate in this. I know MLB is well-intended but, still, theres a larger principle that should be adhered to.

What about the kids like I posted in response to Shnuskis?

I have no idea what this means.

[EWRMETS]

Re: 42

I think if people were to work at a place that was bought out by muslims and were in turn forced to wear pro-Islam clothing the tone would be different. The same principle that protects people from that also says that ballplayers shouldnt be forced to participate in this. I know MLB is well-intended but, still, theres a larger principle that should be adhered to.

This is a pretty far out there comparison. Based on your logic, the MLB shouldn't require players to wear a standarized uniform because this is like a company forcing people to wear Islamic clothing. Your post also borders on anti-Islam.

[o_capone]

Re: 42

unless the players are racist i doubt they would have any objection... i can't imagine any players boycotting wearing the number... so when you say they shouldn't be "forced" are you saing they should be given an option? if given an option how many players do you think would refuse? i doubt anyone would refuse...

[yvesdereuter]

Re: 42

unless the players are racist i doubt they would have any objection... i can't imagine any players boycotting wearing the number... so when you say they shouldn't be "forced" are you saing they should be given an option? if given an option how many players do you think would refuse? i doubt anyone would refuse...

First of all, the fact that they are required to wear it, is being forced...even if they agree with it. But secondly, lets say they are "racist"? They shouldnt be required to wear it. Also, the person wouldnt have to be a racist to object. The person could object to the principle and possibly worry about a slippery slope. Either way, the players, as it is now, are put on the spot where they look like a jerk if they object to it when they shouldnt even be in that position to begin with.

[yvesdereuter]

Re: 42

This is a pretty far out there comparison. Based on your logic, the MLB shouldn't require players to wear a standarized uniform because this is like a company forcing people to wear Islamic clothing. Your post also borders on anti-Islam.

It doesnt border on anything. Im not anti-Islam but I recognize that many would probably have a problem with the scenario I described. And like I said, the same principle that says this should not be allowed, is the same principle that says players are there to play and not be billboards or have advocacy forced on them. Its not far out there at all. I can see why someone would say that if they believe that causes become acceptable only if they agree with them.

[CMH]

Re: 42

The only reason it's being enforced is because MLB grew a brain.

For years players kept asking to wear 42 on Jackie Robinson Day. At first, it was basically a first come, first serve on-basis approval. Then more players asked and MLB just let them do it.

This year, MLB realized that so many guys want to honor Jackie by wearing the number that it would make more sense to just have every player wear it and honor Jackie country wide.

This is not politics. This is smart. It's right.

[o_capone]

Re: 42

as professional atheletes it would not be great for your career to be publicly racist... i'm sure there are plenty racist who play pro sports but they keep it to themselves... so you are right they would look like a jerk, they would lose fans, they would lose endorsements... they would alienate themselves from their team and end their career... but that still does not make what the mlb is doing wrong... and as far as someone "objecting to the principle" i just don't see that happening... they are not only honoring jackie robinson, not only honoring african-americans, they are honoring the diversity of america... baseball is "america's game" and this #42 thing is just one more thing that helps rebuild america's tarnished image... this country has a pretty embarassing past, things like this will help move past those times...