Best Pitcher in the Majors

[Misfit]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

I'm more interested in the innings per start. Halladay is over 7 innings per start while Santana is under. I want my ace to give me 7 each night, and he's doing it in the AL East. His pitches per start are also noticeably higher. In 8 starts this year alone he has not failed to complete 7 innings, has completed 8 three times, and gone the distance once. Santana has completed 7 four times and failed to complete 6 on one occassion against a weaker league.

[snepp]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

I'm more interested in the innings per start. Halladay is over 7 innings per start while Santana is under.

It's a difference of one out per start, hardly the dramatic difference you're playing it up to be.

[Misfit]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

It's a difference of one out per start, hardly the dramatic difference you're playing it up to be.

Leading to a difference of 12 innings a year ago. You don't think the 2008 Mets and their horrible bullpen would have liked another 12 innings out of Johan Santana?

[SPTO]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

The thing about Doc is that strikeouts don't matter too much to him. That's why last offseason I was dismayed by fantasy previews saying Doc was on the decline because clearly he's not. He used to be a guy that wanted to get the strikeout all the time but has become a masterful "pitch to contact" guy. Yes that sometimes leads to more runs then he'd like but when the chips are down and he needs to shut down the opposition he can do it.

Last year (especially before Cito came back) when the offense was dreadful Doc had to change his approach a bit and go back to more of a strikeout mentality because runs were at a premium and he had one of his best strikeout years.

[GeneralManager]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

this is really a no-dobt-about-er....Johan Santana

[YuNgWuN]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

this is really a no-dobt-about-er....Johan Santana

Have to go with the Doc.

[JBH3]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

Leading to a difference of 12 innings a year ago. You don't think the 2008 Mets and their horrible bullpen would have liked another 12 innings out of Johan Santana?

Yea...that would've definitely mattered the last 2 years since the NL East was decided by one game both years. Johan won't sniff 8 innings/gm this year w/ that inning being reserved for JJ Putz and the NY BP.

And on the subject of K rate... look at Halladay's GB/FB ratio, AND how many DPs Halladay's induced vs Johan.

Much of Johan's success depends on the K, while Halladay can rely on his sinker to get him outs just as effectively. Johan can go the distance too, but I like Halladay given he can keep the ball on the ground.

[Sportsforever]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

One way of answering this question is to ask yourself if you had ONE game to win and you had to pick your starting pitcher, who would it be? For me, it would be Johan Santana.

I love Doc and I think he's a fantastic pitcher, but when they are both on their games Santana is better. I'd much rather have a pitcher who strikes out the opposition than relies on "pitching to contact", seeing as a pitcher has little control over BABIP.

[ClutchCity]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

WOW NO ONE MENTIONS ONE OF THE HIGHEST PAID PITCHERS CURRENTLY IN THE MAJORS SMH.

Plain and simple im going to say the Southpaw C.C. Sabathia Hands
down.This guy has played well, ever since he made his debut in 2001. I don't think there is just one best pitcher in the majors, but C.C. is in the top 5. This guy can strikeout batters with the best of them, and he's gets wins.

[JBH3]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

WOW NO ONE MENTIONS ONE OF THE HIGHEST PAID PITCHERS CURRENTLY IN THE MAJORS SMH.

Plain and simple im going to say the Southpaw C.C. Sabathia Hands
down.This guy has played well, ever since he made his debut in 2001. I don't think there is just one best pitcher in the majors, but C.C. is in the top 5. This guy can strikeout batters with the best of them, and he's gets wins.

*clears throat* Postseason *clears throat*

[Kearnzo]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

WOW NO ONE MENTIONS ONE OF THE HIGHEST PAID PITCHERS CURRENTLY IN THE MAJORS SMH.

Plain and simple im going to say the Southpaw C.C. Sabathia Hands
down.This guy has played well, ever since he made his debut in 2001. I don't think there is just one best pitcher in the majors, but C.C. is in the top 5. This guy can strikeout batters with the best of them, and he's gets wins.

If CC were as consistent as guys like Johan and Doc, then yeah, he might be the runaway favorite. Problem is, he doesn't have the head on his shoulders that Johan and Doc do, and he can go from one dominant CG SO, to getting ripped in his next start. If CC could just stay focused all year (as he did the second half of last year), then he could be absurdly dominant. As it is, yeah, he's probably top 5, but he doesn't touch Johan or Halladay.

[ClutchCity]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

If CC were as consistent as guys like Johan and Doc, then yeah, he might be the runaway favorite. Problem is, he doesn't have the head on his shoulders that Johan and Doc do, and he can go from one dominant CG SO, to getting ripped in his next start. If CC could just stay focused all year (as he did the second half of last year), then he could be absurdly dominant. As it is, yeah, he's probably top 5, but he doesn't touch Johan or Halladay.

Now Correct me of im wrong, but I don't remember seeing Halladay pitching in ONE SINGLE POST-SEASON GAME Sabathia has more strikeouts and is more durable than Halladay. Halladay is a great pitcher no doubt, but not better than Sabathia. Sabathia is 28, In his prime and has more strikeouts than Halladay. And if he continues the way he plays he will have more wins than Halladay when both career's are done. Obviously the Yankees signed this guy to that Fat Contract for a reason.

[Kearnzo]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

Now Correct me of im wrong, but I don't remember seeing Halladay pitching in ONE SINGLE POST-SEASON GAME Sabathia has more strikeouts and is more durable than Halladay. Halladay is a great pitcher no doubt, but not better than Sabathia. Sabathia is 28, In his prime and has more strikeouts than Halladay. And if he continues the way he plays he will have more wins than Halladay when both career's are done. Obviously the Yankees signed this guy to that Fat Contract for a reason.

Oy...

Who says you need strikeouts to be a great pitcher? I don't recall guys like Greg Maddux ringing up a lot of K's, yet he is likely one of the top 10 pitchers of all time. And it's Halladays fault how that he hasn't pitched a postseason game? He's always done his part during the season to try and get the Jays there, but the rest of the team has let him down.

The postseason argument is a terrible one BTW, seeing how Sabathia has been hot garbage in the postseason.

[ClutchCity]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

Oy...

Who says you need strikeouts to be a great pitcher? I don't recall guys like Greg Maddux ringing up a lot of K's, yet he is likely one of the top 10 pitchers of all time. And it's Halladays fault how that he hasn't pitched a postseason game? He's always done his part during the season to try and get the Jays there, but the rest of the team has let him down.

The postseason argument is a terrible one BTW, seeing how Sabathia has been hot garbage in the postseason.

Well all of us baseball fans can't RATE Roy Halladay's Postseason play, seeing that He's never BEEN THERE. And it does take strikeouts to be a great pitcher. HAVING STRIKEOUTS is a huge factor in being an ACE or one of the greatest pitchers. By the way smarty Greg Maddux is 10th ALL-TIME in strikeouts.Thats more than Cy Young. Yeah, the guy who's name is on the AWARD that is has been given to the pitcher who has a outstanding pitching year. YES , GREG MADDUX HAS MORE K'S THAN CY YOUNG. Like I said Roy Halladay is a good pitcher and if he keeps it up he maybe get a couple more Cy young awards, and maybe a chance to play in the Postseason when he's umm like 40 . lol While C.C Sabathia has at least 2 World Series Titles. That's the diffrence between Doc and C.C.

[Kearnzo]

Re: Best Pitcher in the Majors

Well all of us baseball fans can't RATE Roy Halladay's Postseason play, seeing that He's never BEEN THERE. And it does take strikeouts to be a great pitcher. HAVING STRIKEOUTS is a huge factor in being an ACE or one of the greatest pitchers. By the way smarty Greg Maddux is 10th ALL-TIME in strikeouts.Thats more than Cy Young. Yeah, the guy who's name is on the AWARD that is has been given to the pitcher who has a outstanding pitching year. YES , GREG MADDUX HAS MORE K'S THAN CY YOUNG. Like I said Roy Halladay is a good pitcher and if he keeps it up he maybe get a couple more Cy young awards, and maybe a chance to play in the Postseason when he's umm like 40 . lol While C.C Sabathia has at least 2 World Series Titles. That's the diffrence between Doc and C.C.

Cy Young's K/9 was a WHOPPING 3.43 throughout his career, so maybe, just maybe, ya think he might not have been a strikeout pitcher? Maddux only sits at a little over 6 K/9, so he wasn't a huge strikeout pitcher either. Yes, he had more than Cy Young, but that really doesn't take much. And if you consider how long both guys played, Maddux having a lot of strikeouts isn't that hard to figure out.

I should have figured from your first post this wasn't even worth arguing, and I guess I was right. Now go root for CC and his 2 imaginary World Series rings you think he'll have.