Brian Giles to Angels??

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  • griffy97
    *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
    • May 2003
    • 364

    #31
    Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

    As usual, Pitt and I seem to be on the same page.

    Okay, here's my logic behind this trade (and, no, this trade has NOT been rumored, other than the Angels interest in Giles. I put this trade together):

    Brian Giles vs. Darin Erstad
    Advantage:ANGELS

    Contract status: Giles

    2004: $9.5 mil; 2005: $9.5 mil; 2006: $10 mil

    If this is slightly incorrect, my bad. My source has Giles signed through '06.

    Erstad's contract:

    2004: $7.5 mil; 2005: $8m; 2006: $8.5m

    While Giles is slightly more expensive than Erstad, he is much more value-priced for his production. Granted, Erstad is a nice player that makes good contact, hits for decent power, plus brings speed and defense. However, Giles is a more productive hitter. Erstad would fit PNC Park quite nicely.

    Kris Benson vs. Aaron Sele
    Advantage: EVEN

    Benson 2004 $6.1 mil. Sele 2004 $8.5 mil.
    Both are free agents after the 2004 season.

    The Pirates, on the surface, are dealing a 28-year old former #1 pick for a soon-to-be 34-year old veteran curveballer coming off surgery. Bad deal? Not so fast.

    First, Benson WILL NEVER RE-SIGN with the Pirates, especially after how he's been grilled from everyone inside and outside the organization. Even though he has one year left on paper, he's effectively finished here now. So, a change of scenery surely wouldn't hurt. Second, Benson is yet another over-hyped, under-producing Pirate prospect that is below .500 for his career and has a "soft" tag, fair or not. Third, while Sele is older and more expensive, he is also much more accomplished and would fit the niche Jeff Suppan served very well here. Plus, the Pirates would clean his contract off the books at season's end.

    Jason Kendall vs. Benji Molina
    Advantage: PIRATES

    This IS the key to the deal. Take a VERY CLOSE look at Kendall's deal and you'll see why Kevin Towers wanted more time to digest even half of it:

    2004: $8 million
    2005: $10 million
    2006: $11 million
    2007: $13 million

    All punctuated with a COMPLETE NO-TRADE CLAUSE!!!

    Ugggh!! That's ugly! So is Kendall in catcher's gear. It's a shame he busted his ankle in 1999 because that injury essentially sapped his speed and, while he's never been great defensively, he's even poorer now. Now, look at Molina's deal, who at 29, is the same age as Kendall, is superior defensively by a wide margin, and hits for more power:

    2004: $1.9 million
    2005: Team option @ $3 million or $100k buyout.

    The Pirates could easily exercise the option and still be getting a steal!

    The sad thing is, the Angels would probably ask the Pirates to eat part of JK's deal as well, since they're inexplicably munching on $12 million of Kevin Appier's contract for NEXT year.

    When you're taking back the contracts of Erstad and Sele, its hardly a salary dump. Nor, would the fan base think of it as that. These guys are all name players, with the possible exception of Molina. But, trust me, Molina's a good catcher. Ask an Angels fan.

    You know, the more you look at the obscene numbers on Kendall's deal, plus the fact Cam Bonifay signed him to a 6 year / $60 million contract AFTER the ankle injury, plus the 3-year extension given to Pat Meares after one MONTH in a Pirates' uniform, plus the multi-year deal donated to Derek Bell, its no wonder McClatchy's lost $30 million. I can actually see this being true. So, who's worse? Kevin McClatchy or Cam Bonifay.

    I just love how the media loves second-guessing Dave Littlefield. As far as I'm concerned, unless we deal Giles to Anaheim for the Rally Monkey and Jeff DeVanon, there is no way he'll ever be worse than Bonifay!

    Comment

    • dieselboy
      --------------
      • Dec 2002
      • 18040

      #32
      Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

      </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
      griffy97 said:
      </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
      Karlos05 said:
      I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

      <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

      Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

      What don't you like about it?

      <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

      Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

      Comment

      • dieselboy
        --------------
        • Dec 2002
        • 18040

        #33
        Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

        </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
        griffy97 said:
        </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
        Karlos05 said:
        I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

        <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

        Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

        What don't you like about it?

        <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

        Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

        Comment

        • dieselboy
          --------------
          • Dec 2002
          • 18040

          #34
          Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

          </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
          griffy97 said:
          </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
          Karlos05 said:
          I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

          <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

          Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

          What don't you like about it?

          <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

          Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

          Comment

          • griffy97
            *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
            • May 2003
            • 364

            #35
            Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
            dieselboy said:
            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
            griffy97 said:
            </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
            Karlos05 said:
            I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

            Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

            What don't you like about it?

            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

            Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

            <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

            I didn't make up a rumor, nor did I say this deal was a rumor.

            I said "Expect the Angels to be a player for Giles this off-season". Then, I suggested a trade. What's wrong with that?

            You always like to jump in and make snide comments. Read the whole post before being critical.

            Comment

            • griffy97
              *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
              • May 2003
              • 364

              #36
              Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
              dieselboy said:
              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
              griffy97 said:
              </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
              Karlos05 said:
              I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

              Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

              What don't you like about it?

              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

              Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

              <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

              I didn't make up a rumor, nor did I say this deal was a rumor.

              I said "Expect the Angels to be a player for Giles this off-season". Then, I suggested a trade. What's wrong with that?

              You always like to jump in and make snide comments. Read the whole post before being critical.

              Comment

              • griffy97
                *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                • May 2003
                • 364

                #37
                Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                dieselboy said:
                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                griffy97 said:
                </font><blockquote><font class="small">Quote:</font><hr />
                Karlos05 said:
                I dont like this deal one bit........ Something about this, I definatly like the one with San Diego better.

                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                Karlos, I know you know your Pirates very well.

                What don't you like about it?

                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                Terrible trade. I hate it when people just make up rumors.

                <hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

                I didn't make up a rumor, nor did I say this deal was a rumor.

                I said "Expect the Angels to be a player for Giles this off-season". Then, I suggested a trade. What's wrong with that?

                You always like to jump in and make snide comments. Read the whole post before being critical.

                Comment

                • rsox
                  All Star
                  • Feb 2003
                  • 6309

                  #38
                  Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                  I dont see it happening because i dont see the Angels adding
                  payroll in the offseason, nor do i see the Pirates taking on those contracts, the idea behind trading Giles and Kendall is a cost cutting move, it's not like there going to take Phil Nevin's contract or Ryan Klesko's contract,
                  besides the Angels still have to pay Kevin Appier next season, although supposedly the Angels may make a run at trying to get Alex Rodriguez from Texas, to do so they would have to clear payroll, i think that is just rumor.

                  Comment

                  • rsox
                    All Star
                    • Feb 2003
                    • 6309

                    #39
                    Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                    I dont see it happening because i dont see the Angels adding
                    payroll in the offseason, nor do i see the Pirates taking on those contracts, the idea behind trading Giles and Kendall is a cost cutting move, it's not like there going to take Phil Nevin's contract or Ryan Klesko's contract,
                    besides the Angels still have to pay Kevin Appier next season, although supposedly the Angels may make a run at trying to get Alex Rodriguez from Texas, to do so they would have to clear payroll, i think that is just rumor.

                    Comment

                    • rsox
                      All Star
                      • Feb 2003
                      • 6309

                      #40
                      Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                      I dont see it happening because i dont see the Angels adding
                      payroll in the offseason, nor do i see the Pirates taking on those contracts, the idea behind trading Giles and Kendall is a cost cutting move, it's not like there going to take Phil Nevin's contract or Ryan Klesko's contract,
                      besides the Angels still have to pay Kevin Appier next season, although supposedly the Angels may make a run at trying to get Alex Rodriguez from Texas, to do so they would have to clear payroll, i think that is just rumor.

                      Comment

                      • griffy97
                        *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                        • May 2003
                        • 364

                        #41
                        Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                        To clear up any confusion:

                        A Pittsburgh media outlet (I believe it was WPXI) mentioned the Angels interest in Giles a week or so ago. Erstad's name was also mentioned.

                        Was that a rumor? Yes. Did I make it up? No.

                        I took that and filled in the additional players in a deal I thought made sense and wanted to get some feedback.

                        Is that wrong? I hope not.

                        We Pirate fans need something to talk about after 11 straight losing seasons. Diesel, you make a lot of good points on the boards and have 1000 more posts than I do, so I respect that.


                        But, I don't want anyone to think I make up rumors and try to pass them on as fact. I don't do that. If I confused anyone, I apologize. I thought I stated it in such a way that that was understood.

                        Comment

                        • griffy97
                          *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                          • May 2003
                          • 364

                          #42
                          Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                          To clear up any confusion:

                          A Pittsburgh media outlet (I believe it was WPXI) mentioned the Angels interest in Giles a week or so ago. Erstad's name was also mentioned.

                          Was that a rumor? Yes. Did I make it up? No.

                          I took that and filled in the additional players in a deal I thought made sense and wanted to get some feedback.

                          Is that wrong? I hope not.

                          We Pirate fans need something to talk about after 11 straight losing seasons. Diesel, you make a lot of good points on the boards and have 1000 more posts than I do, so I respect that.


                          But, I don't want anyone to think I make up rumors and try to pass them on as fact. I don't do that. If I confused anyone, I apologize. I thought I stated it in such a way that that was understood.

                          Comment

                          • griffy97
                            *t's * 'B*rgh Th*ng!
                            • May 2003
                            • 364

                            #43
                            Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                            To clear up any confusion:

                            A Pittsburgh media outlet (I believe it was WPXI) mentioned the Angels interest in Giles a week or so ago. Erstad's name was also mentioned.

                            Was that a rumor? Yes. Did I make it up? No.

                            I took that and filled in the additional players in a deal I thought made sense and wanted to get some feedback.

                            Is that wrong? I hope not.

                            We Pirate fans need something to talk about after 11 straight losing seasons. Diesel, you make a lot of good points on the boards and have 1000 more posts than I do, so I respect that.


                            But, I don't want anyone to think I make up rumors and try to pass them on as fact. I don't do that. If I confused anyone, I apologize. I thought I stated it in such a way that that was understood.

                            Comment

                            • Karlos05
                              -
                              • Mar 2003
                              • 5814

                              #44
                              Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                              It seems that this deal would do what the Pirates were trying to do and thats to cut payroll. After that nice break down by griffey I see that the Pirates acually cut a nice chuck of payroll of Kendalls contract.

                              The thing that bothers me though is Giles for Erstad. Yes the Pirates do save some money but giving up Giles for Erstad, I dont want to see that happen.

                              As for Benson I didn't relieze that Sele was also in the last year of his contract. It seems to even out, but I still have faith in Benson. Someday he will turn it around, it wont be with the Pirates but someday he'll be good.

                              Comment

                              • Karlos05
                                -
                                • Mar 2003
                                • 5814

                                #45
                                Re: Brian Giles to Angels??

                                It seems that this deal would do what the Pirates were trying to do and thats to cut payroll. After that nice break down by griffey I see that the Pirates acually cut a nice chuck of payroll of Kendalls contract.

                                The thing that bothers me though is Giles for Erstad. Yes the Pirates do save some money but giving up Giles for Erstad, I dont want to see that happen.

                                As for Benson I didn't relieze that Sele was also in the last year of his contract. It seems to even out, but I still have faith in Benson. Someday he will turn it around, it wont be with the Pirates but someday he'll be good.

                                Comment

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