2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

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  • TeixeiraFanatic
    Pro
    • Feb 2008
    • 925

    #301
    Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

    Originally posted by AC
    I went ahead and ran the regressions (the piece will be posted at 9:30 AM on a different site tomorrow). Valencia's regressed to a .344 wOBA and Kratz a .317 wOBA. When you see the amount of value Kratz generates from his framing, though... you're gonna see why I'm so upset about this trade, lol.
    Fair points, however I see why the Jays made the trade. They obviously do not see (or value) Kratz' pitch framing for what it may be. And since they do not, how much good would he do on the bench and catching just once a week?

    To the regression to the mean statement, I feel it's more likely that Valencia holds his value against left-handed pitching than Kratz suddenly becoming a well above-average hitter to make up for his sub-par year-to-date performance. I understand that platoon splits normalize around 1,000 at-bats and it may very well be that Valencia's previous success against opposite-hand pitching is a fluke. However, even if he regresses a little I think his value combined with his expected playing time (as compared to Kratz') will outweigh what Kratz' brings as a pitch-framer.

    Plus Kratz is 34 (I know catchers actually maintain their value at a better rate than most positions) but decline is still to come.

    Now, I'm just a novice when it comes to Statistical theory but I'm trying to learn. So if I'm off-base with my assumptions, I'd love to understand why.
    MLB: St. Louis Cardinals
    NBA: New York Knicks
    NFL: Houston Texans, St. Louis Rams
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    • AC
      Win the East
      • Sep 2010
      • 14951

      #302
      Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

      Originally posted by TeixeiraFanatic
      Fair points, however I see why the Jays made the trade. They obviously do not see (or value) Kratz' pitch framing for what it may be. And since they do not, how much good would he do on the bench and catching just once a week?

      To the regression to the mean statement, I feel it's more likely that Valencia holds his value against left-handed pitching than Kratz suddenly becoming a well above-average hitter to make up for his sub-par year-to-date performance. I understand that platoon splits normalize around 1,000 at-bats and it may very well be that Valencia's previous success against opposite-hand pitching is a fluke. However, even if he regresses a little I think his value combined with his expected playing time (as compared to Kratz') will outweigh what Kratz' brings as a pitch-framer.

      Plus Kratz is 34 (I know catchers actually maintain their value at a better rate than most positions) but decline is still to come.

      Now, I'm just a novice when it comes to Statistical theory but I'm trying to learn. So if I'm off-base with my assumptions, I'd love to understand why.
      That's the problem. That they don't see the value even though it's right in front of them.

      It's actually 2200 plate appearances. What either of them really doesn't matter as much as you think it might. Kratz's sample is like 6.8% of the way to mattering and Valencia's is like 22.6% of the way to mattering. That's why we regress. So that we don't have to go off of our gut feeling, which is swayed by bias. And trust me lol, there isn't a lot that can outweigh Kratz as a pitch framer. Just.. wow.

      Kratz's skillset should age pretty well though. Look at Jose Molina. He's still framing and calling great games.
      "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

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      • AC
        Win the East
        • Sep 2010
        • 14951

        #303
        Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

        Here's the latest from Bob Nightengale of USA Today, who provides several interesting trade market updates: The Dodgers recently inquired about Phillies …

        The Rays face a tough decision on Price: they would face serious internal repercussions for moving him at this point, but are tantalized by the possibilities of a return. Nightengales suggests that Tampa has reason to believe it could pry Oscar Taveras, Shelby Miller, and a 2015 first-round compensation pick from the Cardinals in a swap involving Price.
        Good God.
        "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

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        • elTodd
          Little Big Puig
          • Feb 2004
          • 1333

          #304
          Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

          The only piece in that deal that I would mind losing is Taveras.

          I'm so fed up with the Cardinals mindset this year. Matheny's refusal to trust young players and his quick leash when they don't perform is infuriating.

          Between that and his terrible management of the bullpen, I don't know what to think or expect anymore.

          Comment

          • AC
            Win the East
            • Sep 2010
            • 14951

            #305
            Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

            You guys will be fine, you're the best org in the league, lol.
            "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

            Comment

            • SPTO
              binging
              • Feb 2003
              • 68046

              #306
              Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

              If i'm the Rays I seriously contemplate making the deal if that's the offer on the table. In the history of baseball most trades that involve highly touted prospects, the team that moves the prospect either outright wins said trade or it's a neutral result.

              Anyways, there's some crazy talk that the Jays could pull off a surprise and acquire Lester and Miller....I highly doubt that happening but it's intriguing as Lester would be the classic gun for hire.
              Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

              "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

              Comment

              • AC
                Win the East
                • Sep 2010
                • 14951

                #307
                Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                More like Lester and Uehara.
                "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

                Comment

                • TheMatrix31
                  RF
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 52917

                  #308
                  Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                  Lester scratched from his start tomorrow.

                  Comment

                  • SPTO
                    binging
                    • Feb 2003
                    • 68046

                    #309
                    Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                    Originally posted by AC
                    More like Lester and Uehara.
                    I had heard Miller but either way, I still doubt this unless Beeston can convince the tightwads at Rogers to pay Lester's pro rated salary for the rest of the year.
                    Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                    "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

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                    • AC
                      Win the East
                      • Sep 2010
                      • 14951

                      #310
                      Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                      Originally posted by TheMatrix31
                      Lester scratched from his start tomorrow.
                      Oh no. I have a bad feeling Anthopoulos is gonna do what I think he's gonna do.
                      "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

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                      • ShowTyme15
                        LADetermined
                        • Jan 2004
                        • 11853

                        #311
                        Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                        Originally posted by TheMatrix31
                        Lester scratched from his start tomorrow.
                        Apparently there is a deal in place that will be completed tonight or tomorrow morning.

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                        • SPTO
                          binging
                          • Feb 2003
                          • 68046

                          #312
                          Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                          Originally posted by AC
                          Oh no. This is not going to go well for the Blue Jays.
                          I have a bad feeling too. "sigh"
                          Member of the Official OS Bills Backers Club

                          "Baseball is the most important thing that doesn't matter at all" - Robert B. Parker

                          Comment

                          • AC
                            Win the East
                            • Sep 2010
                            • 14951

                            #313
                            Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                            Oh god. Hutch for Lester. It's happening. Nooooo.

                            e: to be clear this is me saying the sky is falling, no one has reported this.. yet
                            "Twelve at-bats is a pretty decent sample size." - Eric Byrnes

                            Comment

                            • ShowTyme15
                              LADetermined
                              • Jan 2004
                              • 11853

                              #314
                              Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                              Rays talking and willing to trade David Price.

                              Comment

                              • TheMatrix31
                                RF
                                • Jul 2002
                                • 52917

                                #315
                                Re: 2014 MLB Trade Deadline Thread

                                Would they really trade him within the division?

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