50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

[Pared]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

I'm a bit surprised you think that. Hasn't 2K always been the most realistic basketball game out there? Haven't we always been able to play realistically in 2K basketball games despite the difficulty levels? I have been playing 2K for many years and have always played on the highest or next-to-highest difficulty levels, and have always played realistically. And gotten good results, obviously. This is the first time I've heard someone say they can't play realistically on higher difficulty levels. I'm not really sure what's stopping you.

Yeah...

Like I said, if you feel this way then it's not worth carrying on the conversation. Our definitions of "real" are not parallel in any way shape or form.

I enjoy the game - but against the CPU, despite how much I appreciate the strides made, there is a severe disconnect that you can't grasp and explaining it would be useless.

[fluent2332]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

Can you explain please how do you use intense D button?....i must put it down when defending the post or simply follow the player with the LS? You said we must have defensive assist slider in the controller menu up to 100, in this way i noticed that my players are often out of position, i lost 8 consecutive matches with the raptors and defensive assist at 100, then i put it down to 50 and followed your defensive tips and get 2 wins allowing only 26 PIP in 3 quarters, but i must say, strange things still happens to the cpu since in some cases can make every kind of shot even with 2 man and 4 hands in his face.

BTW i agree with you, if you play with effort and attention standing in front of your man both defensive and offensive sides begin to be better.

There are 2 key points for me to have high possibilities of wins: 1. Limitate PIP, 2. Limitate turnovers.

I wait an explanation of how to use correctly the intense D button....

Not sure who you're talking to here, if you're talking to me I never said turn the defensive assist to 100. I never do that. As for intense D, I'm sorry I can't be more help on this, because I'm not quite sure how to use intense D since I never use it. The few times I have used it, it seemed to very slightly improve my on-ball D, but the offensive player was still able to get around me, so it's not "automatic" or anything.

I imagine you can use intense D the same way you use regular defense. If you get beat by the ballhandler, sprint back to where he's trying to get to in the lane, and not where he currently is. If you do that with intense D it should be just as effective for you. Remember to keep your turbo usage limited to when you absolutely need it to get back into position, otherwise lay off the turbo. Maybe someone else can chime in about intense D and how it works. I'd like to know if it is more effective in post defense too. I'll have to experiment with it and get back to you!!

If you're talking about my tips, glad to hear my tips have helped you. You're starting to "get it" when you realize you need to stop PIP and limit turnovers AND don't forget to take good shots offensively. Keep in mind also, you're not going to win every game, even if you become a professional 2K player. There will still be nights where some players are unguardable for you and the other team just gets hot and beats you. But you can expect to at least be competitive most of the time if you follow my tips and other tips given here on the forums.

I'm glad you've been able to enjoy the game, but I'm getting pretty tired of seeing my bigs miss gimmies from right under the basket while the CPU is able to constantly make contested up and unders with just about anybody. In my game against the 76ers, Vucevic made an up and under from near the free throw line with a hand in his face. In another game against the Clippers, Billups threw this insane alley-oop with his back to the basket even though it was a half court situation and the paint was crowded.

This has nothing to do with playing good defense in my opinion, it's just plain ludicrous.

Vucevic can make a shot like that. He's an NBA player. NBA players make tough shots all the time. Did you ever see the shot Popeye Jones made in real life by throwing it over the backboard while falling out of bounds? If that happened in 2K you guys would be up in arms about it. Players make tough shots all the time. Granted, I have had a few times where a player pulled up with a hookshot from the free throw line, and it looked awkward, but those are little flukes in the game. No game is perfect and these flukes are few and far between enough not to bother me. If little things like this really destroy the game for you, then your expectations are way too high and you need to chill out and just enjoy the game for what it is. A play here and there should be forgiven for the overall package of enjoyment you're getting with the game.

Bigs missing gimme baskets? Are you using pump fakes to get the opponent's big men in the air? Are you using the shot stick and pressing in the direction of "daylight" under the rim? Are you trying to finish in a crowd with players who have no business finishing in a crowd? I can regularly score 6-12 points with guys who are, let's be honest, somewhat TERRIBLE at the rim. Guys like Andris Biedrins and Kwame Brown who are both on my Warriors team. I run pick and roll plays which sometimes gives them wide open dunks. But other times I'm able to simply play the defense like a fiddle because I used a few pump fakes and the shot stick properly. I never have a problem scoring underneath on offensive putbacks, etc. Those guys won't give you 20 points on post plays, but I can still score with them when I need to (and as a Warriors fan I still like both of those guys!! Don't get me wrong here...)

Thank you!!! This guy is cleary playing nba2k14. Fluent, just by saying there's no morphing proves that you're in denial, and we're not crazy....

I'm in denial because I clearly stated I have never seen morphing in my personal experience? Okay...

Yeah...

Like I said, if you feel this way then it's not worth carrying on the conversation. Our definitions of "real" are not parallel in any way shape or form.

I enjoy the game - but against the CPU, despite how much I appreciate the strides made, there is a severe disconnect that you can't grasp and explaining it would be useless.

Well since I've been playing 2K games (since about 2K3), for the most part I've always been able to replicate the game stats of a real NBA game. One thing towards a realistic game is having realistic stats. Does the play in the game exactly mirror a real NBA game? Not quite. It's not that perfect yet. But for what it is, a basketball simulation, it's pretty damn good. Guys get the ball in proper positions. They take proper shots. Defensively guys who are weaker defenders mess up more. Etc Etc.

I think what you're wanting is a less punishing AI. I don't think you want an AI that tries to pick you apart. As a sim guy, you would probably like to see a looser type of AI that makes plays more based not on user input, but just for the sake of making them. I.e. instead of a scorer trying to drive against your weak defense, you'd rather they settle for a midrange J, because in real life, guys settle for midrange J's. I'm assuming here, but if you do have that mindset, then I understand, I do. But where we differ is that I think the AI of the game is very realistic when it takes into account the user input. It does things that a smart NBA player really would do.

But you have to take into account the user input. If you pit the CPU against the CPU, the game probably takes a completely different shape. It probably mimics a real game more, because both sides are scripted. But when you add user input into the equation, all of a sudden it mucks things up. It adds a new element that the game AI has to account for. All of a sudden instead of a guy scripted to take a mid range J on you, he sees your poor on-ball defense and instead drives to the rim, pump fakes the user (and you fall for it), and lays it in for an easy 2. That play never would have happened against the CPU (or if it did happen, it would have been more rare than it happens against a user).

The game isn't going to roll over this year just for the sake of rolling over. The game is actively going to try to pick you apart. And I for one, love that about this year's game. I want a challenge from the AI, yet I still want a game that plays realistically. I feel 2K12 walks that line perfectly. So far in all my games I've played, I haven't seen anything (worth noting) that couldn't have happened in a real game. And yes, drives to the rim, up and unders for easy baskets can happen in a real game, if the defense is very poor. Rondo does it all the time. And how many guys drive the lane in real life and then pump fake. That happens all the time. When defenders fall for it and there's no help defense in sight, that's when easy baskets happen, and average NBA players start looking like Bird and Magic out there.

So my mantra continues to be - "Don't blame the game, blame yourself". We all make mistakes but the key to getting the most out of this year's game is too limit the mistakes to the absolute minimum in your power. Then the game will open up so much for you, and it will resemble a real life game more.

[Pared]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

for the most part I've always been able to replicate the game stats of a real NBA game. One thing towards a realistic game is having realistic stats. Does the play in the game exactly mirror a real NBA game? Not quite.

....more along the lines of what I already knew.

THIS is what people expect from the CPU:

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GN-pbML-Qb0?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

THIS is what they get:

<iframe width="640" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qrUCmRCOMyI?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Detection issues aside, there are allowances made to make the CPU "challenging." They are bogus. Again, mostly on the higher difficulties.

BTW - that shot attempt is common no matter the PG, no matter the defense, no matter the settings. The CPU runs its offense no matter what the user is doing. But they are NBA players so I digress...

[thetalkofanation]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

If you watch basketball and know how your team plays and what plays they run in real life you will be fine. It's really a matter of taking your time and getting good shots and playing old school realistic basketball. Just know your players is all I can say. If you don't know how somebody plays in real life. DONT USE THEM! It won't work I promise you. For example, I love it when people use lebron james online and they start shooting 3's with him. It's great. I know i'm going to win. It's an awesome game but patience is key, it is not for the arcade lovers. You should get NBA JAM if you want to have fun. If you want to play basketball get NBA 2K12.

[Whaaaazuuuuup]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

If you watch basketball and know how your team plays and what plays they run in real life you will be fine. It's really a matter of taking your time and getting good shots and playing old school realistic basketball. Just know your players is all I can say. If you don't know how somebody plays in real life. DONT USE THEM! It won't work I promise you. For example, I love it when people use lebron james online and they start shooting 3's with him. It's great. I know i'm going to win. It's an awesome game but patience is key, it is not for the arcade lovers. You should get NBA JAM if you want to have fun. If you want to play basketball get NBA 2K12.

Once again...the large complaint is not the lack of scoring...its the CPU getting desperate to score and disabling you players so it can. Wether it's you controlling them or the CPU controlling your teammate...

[Colts18]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

So how can game companies handle higher difficulties? Other than making the CPU cheat what can 2K do? Well what should they do when the user cranks it up a notch?

[Whaaaazuuuuup]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

So how can game companies handle higher difficulties? Other than making the CPU cheat what can 2K do? Well what should they do when the user cranks it up a notch?

How about the players utilizing his skills better. Ex. A player having a 95 handle rating. On pro level it's not as effective and less likely to use all the dribbling arsenals that comes with a 95 handle rating. But on superstars/HoF levels, he's compable of using most if not ALL on them and they're VERY effective on you if you're a poor defender (user control) or controlling a poorly rated defender is guarding him. Not allowing the move to push the defender to the side like he's on skates.

So the long and short of it...let attributes matter MORE!!...

[Goffs]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

THIS is what they get:

<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qrUCmRCOMyI?rel=0" allowfullscreen="" width="640" frameborder="0" height="480"></iframe>

AARRGH! When I pull off the same move against the CPU they always block it with there armpits! I really hate this part of the game.....

[AdamBa17]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

Pared making some good posts.

[Whaaaazuuuuup]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

Pared making some good posts.

Not only are they good , but they're valid...

[Kid FSU]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

....more along the lines of what I already knew.

THIS is what people expect from the CPU:

<iframe width="853" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/GN-pbML-Qb0?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

THIS is what they get:

<iframe width="640" height="480" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/qrUCmRCOMyI?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Detection issues aside, there are allowances made to make the CPU "challenging." They are bogus. Again, mostly on the higher difficulties.

BTW - that shot attempt is common no matter the PG, no matter the defense, no matter the settings. The CPU runs its offense no matter what the user is doing. But they are NBA players so I digress...

I'm all for fluent in this arguement. Pared, when was the last time you did that chris paul layup, went to the replay and looked for what you saw in your example. Most likely never. People usually don't go looking for glitches and stuff like this until it can be used to prove a point. I can almost guarrantee that when users do the same layup shown, there have been instances where the ball goes through an arm. It's a video game. Its physics can't be 100% all the time. Fluent is correct because this game requires a real basketball IQ and focus to win. You may have those qualities in real life, but until you're able to channel them in the game you'll never be the best you can be.

[Pared]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

I actually look pretty often because I have a high interest in this game becoming better in the single player experience. Last year the issues were similar for the user and CPU. This year it is more sided in their favor. I'm not saying this to waste anyone's time; I'm providing examples to illustrate the differences people are frustrated with.

I don't think they are worth glossing over because as a user there is only so much you can do. But that doesnt mean I agree with it or even justify it by saying these are NBA players. That is an excuse you could have used any year you played an NBA game in the past and lost.

[mjbird123]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

great tips and advice will use it to help my 2k game play improve.

[fluent2332]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

Honestly, I see nothing wrong with that Stuckey play. First of all, the initial on-ball defense was terrible and let Stuckey drive right to the rim. So right from the start the defense is already in a world of hurt. The AI glitched a little bit as he should have just cruised in and layed it up in one fluid motion, but instead stopped and pump faked, maybe because he anticipated the defense to recover faster than they did. Bogut was out of position and had his back turned on the play, and Gooden was also out of position and was trying to recover. Gooden got lucky by hitting the ball but even though there was a detection issue, that whole play should have been a Stuckey easy layup.

They need to iron out some animation issues with that play, I'll give you that. Stuck should have went up with the other (right) hand and layed it up around Gooden's outstretched arm. Other than that though, I found it to be perfectly legitimate. And besides, Stuckey is a slasher/scorer, of course he is going to be capable of pulling off a clever move at the rim. That's what he's paid to do. I can see him pulling something like that off multiple times a game, when he's on his A game.

Some guys are going to attack the rim. It's up to you to (try) stop it. If you can't, these players will score. That is my point about them being NBA players. All of them can score and a lot of them can score right at the rim with clever moves. NBA2K12 reflects that in a big way.

And really, I don't find that type of play to be all that common in the game. It might happen once or twice a game, but it depends on who the opposing PG is. Not all of them play the same. But if you keep the guards out of the paint at the initial point of attack, then they have no chance to pull an up-and-under on you. And even when it does happen, it's because they were simply probing your defense to see if you're going to react to the pump fake. That's a smart move. I can't knock the AI for pulling off smart moves against me. If I fall for the pump fake then by all means they should lay the ball in, if the help defense is out of position, etc.

Let me ask you this. What would you rather have happened on that Stuckey play? Would you rather he didn't drive straight to the rim even though his defender was way out of the play and played bad defense? Would you rather Bogut or Gooden have miraculously morphed back into position to contest the shot? Or do you simply wish Stuckey didn't pump fake the ball first and just cruised in for the easy layup? Any way you slice it that play definitely should have been an easy 2 for Stuckey. If anything, there was an animation issue with the play, not an AI issue. The AI was great.

[Pared]

Re: 50 Ways to Beat the CPU or Become a Better 2K Player Overall, by Sovartus

Your entire reasoning is just rationalization. Like I said, I can't argue that - it's pointless for both of us.