Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
My bad blues. Good thread.
My bad blues. Good thread.
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EA and 2k have the unfortunate task of trying to balance on a tightrope of fun and sim while trying not to fall 10,000 feet to their death. Instead of a safety net waiting down below there will just be angry customers quick to move out of the way and talk of their failure. -
Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
That is the main issue with the game and why it is so hard to play defense, for 2k13 2k need to focus on player interaction, how players reacts when they bump into each other, it need to be more fluid and realistic.PSN=Coolcas7Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
Here's some more videos I just made showing more of the same, but these videos also highlight the lack of contact on spin moves, hop-steps, and up-n-under shots. Prepare to rage.
<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/X21PhRyo0Yc" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="360" width="640"></iframe>
Below is the second part to the video above (note: there is a weird glitch in this video with OKC's uniforms-it gave them plain white uniforms for some reason).
<iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ONcgVRMZ0L4?rel=0" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="360" width="640"></iframe>Last edited by blues rocker; 03-10-2012, 12:43 AM.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
NBA 2K11 was perfect to me with the collision detection, I thought it was perfect. I played on Superstar/Sim in 2K11.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
100000000% agree, i play people online who realized that these animations cant be stopped so they do it all game long in crowded paint. they has this RIGHT in 2k11 except for contact off hopsteps. what happend during development that they didnt fix this exploit crap. Seems they always leave in some glitch to get easy paint scoring
RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGG GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGEEEEEEEEEEEELast edited by houstonsdream; 03-10-2012, 08:40 AM.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
It really wasn't though. And if they return to the level of collision detection in 2K11, 2K10, 2K9, 2K8, etc. they'll bring with them frustrations of their own. The fact is as long as there are imperfect games, there will be people looking to take advantage of whatever flaws they can - it occurs in every game regardless on genre. Perhaps 2K will need to scale down the amount of moves/options they give to people to narrow the amount of variables they have to account for given the level of complaining. Personally I'm sure they'll improve on the collision detection in the game going forward. But I'm also sure players will simply find something new to exploit.HBO's "The Wire" should rank as one of the top 10 shows EVER on tv - period
XBL gamertag: d0meBreaker22 (that's a zero)
congrats Steelers, city of Pittsburgh, and Steeler Nation - SIX TIME WORLD CHAMPSComment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
still the standard, stars still hitting shots scrubs cant and rewarded for good defensive position. No parting of the red seaComment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
2k11 had excellent paint contact only exploit was hopstep or lead passing to get under basket for layup because it was difficult to waltz in the paint. 2k could have just easily removed hopstep button (they did) or just add collisions to hopstep animations (they didnt). Instead we have guys that just slide by each other like they are invisible. 2k11 rewarded you for good defensive position while 2k12 punishes you.
had real help D also in 2k11 but seems to be missing in 2k12 most of the timeComment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
Yes, I get it. The same devs that were so brilliant with 2K11 are near idiots with 2K12, making wrong choice after wrong choice because every issue was so easy to anticipate and solve. *sigh* The Monday morning quarterbacking on this board is glorious.
As I've said in the past, these devs have produced great basketball games and I trust they know what they're doing. I'm not going to run back out and pick up 2K11, nor do I want to get into the silly comparisons when they're essentially the same game by the same developers. But I disagree regarding your view of positioning in 2K11; from what I remember defense was great because you were bumped back three yards when you made contact with a defender. Imo 2K needs to work on continuing to improve player interactions in the game, not going back. I temper my criticisms knowing there isn't another sports game with this level of player interactions coupled with the complexity of individual signature styles. With that no one can say "gimme more options to do everything I see in an NBA game" without expecting possible issues. More options/more variables/greater chance for exploitsHBO's "The Wire" should rank as one of the top 10 shows EVER on tv - period
XBL gamertag: d0meBreaker22 (that's a zero)
congrats Steelers, city of Pittsburgh, and Steeler Nation - SIX TIME WORLD CHAMPSComment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
Superb post spank! I agree with you 100%. Great post..EA and 2k have the unfortunate task of trying to balance on a tightrope of fun and sim while trying not to fall 10,000 feet to their death. Instead of a safety net waiting down below there will just be angry customers quick to move out of the way and talk of their failure.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
I'm sick and tired of coming to every thread and seeing people say SLIDERS SLIDERS SLIDERS when a legit thing is brought to the table about how badly this game was designed. For one, online you can't use sliders, and it feels like you're ice skating on defense. Offline it's the same way.
I don't understand why this was such a step back. Go back and play 2K11. You can actually stay in front of someone when you anticipate what they're doing. 2K12, even when you anticipate you get slid out of the way or some lame animation triggers to slide you away. It's dumb and it sucks.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
I have say I have seen all of this in the game.
IMO 2k did this to give the CPU easy points in the paint. No one conviently slides out of the way when they are in position to contest. Sometimes it is two defenders and they just move right out of the way to give a direct path to the hoop just like in one of his videos. There should be a level of default defense that is played in the NBA no one is sliding out of the way to give up easy layups especially the way it occurs in the paint in this game.
I hope 2K13 doesn't have to resort to this to give the CPU or another user easy points in the paint. Right now it seems like there is an on or off switch which makes them slide out of the way so to make sure there is no contact no matter how unrealistic it looks or happens. What they need is light contact, medium contact and hard contact.
Light contact could occur on layups in the paint sometimes, hop steps, medium contact on layups again most likely to be a foul, hard contact occurs when you are directly in front of the defender or defenders.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
To countermand this problem, I put the Blocking attribute slider to 100 so if I go for the big block well-timed I can swat the ball away since the contact in the paint is almost non-existent. I even have the Drive Frequency slider at 100 and the Contact Shot Success at 42 (NBA 2K11-esque).Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
Naw dude, no joke. Sometimes when guys are hot, the slip and slide happens. When they are not, the contact animation is engaged.
If I'm playing, and I see this happen, I'm giving the ball back to the guy who did not draw contact. He's hot. If I'm coaching the D, I may take out the players this happened to, I may deny ball, switch up defensive schemes, take a time out. I'm going to recognize and adjust and try not to rage. Just like in the NBA, you've got to absorb runs if you're going to win.
Fact is, the game will not be able to 100% mirror reality and physics etc. Never. No game will. This game does a good job of finding a balance letting players get to the hoop sometimes and get shut down other times. Sometimes the seams in the game architecture show, as in these videos. It doesn't bother me.Comment
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Re: 2k's "slip n slide" physics and lack of contact (youtube video included)
Playing on-ball defense is possible in NBA 2K12. As an on-ball defender in 2K12 you just have to pick a side to shade a ball handler once he puts the ball on the floor and move backward diagonally during his drive just like in real life. You'll sure enough draw a lot of body contact if done properly. You just can't stand still in front of a driving ball handler and expect to stop all of his forward momentum, or expect to stick to him like a magnet from stationary position to defend against a drive like what takes place in 2K11.
The problem I see in 2K12 is that this method doesn't work in this fashion all the time against a high-rated ball handler who drives to the cup (LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Russell Westbrook and Derrick Rose for a few examples). Granted, these guys are elite ball handlers, but they should still be able to be defended like everyone else to a lesser degree as opposed to being virtually indefensible because of how "slippery" they are in the game. As an on-ball defender I should at least be able to slightly redirect any elite ball handler not named LeBron James toward my help defenders near the hoop while making body contact if I properly shade him to go in the direction I want him to go on his drive to the basket.
Also, any mediocre-rated ball handler who performs any of the hop step moves or spin dribbles directly into defenders standing near the basket would often slide right by like what's shown in some of the examples that those YouTube videos blues rocker uploaded. Now what should happen during the latter scenario whenever a smaller ball handler collides with a player standing his ground near the basket is that the ball handler doing any of these moves should lose his balance (and also lose the basketball in some cases), and possibly get stonewalled too if that ball handler happens to bump into a much bigger and stronger man. Again, maybe not LBJ, but every other ball handler in this scenario should pay the price for suffering impact of that magnitude whenever making contact with a big man standing near the basket.
Both games have their own respective body contact issues, but after extensive play of both games I find that 2K12 is certainly the lesser of two evils. Players actually have difficulty finishing out their play assignments on a routine basis in 2K11. During a called play a cutter moving in the lane would get repeatedly bumped due to over-exaggerated body contact which stops their movement, then that player would casually walk to the corner of the court and consequentially kill the play. It's like the cutters have completely forgotten what they were supposed to do in the first place.
KruzaLast edited by Kruza; 03-11-2012, 01:18 PM.Comment
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