NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

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  • Mos1ted
    MVP
    • Sep 2002
    • 2267

    #346
    Looking at these signature skills from a strategic standpoint, it's looking like NBA 2K13 has the potential to play more like a game a chess than a game of checkers like the previous versions. I'm looking forward to it.

    All of the signature skills seem reasonable and within the context of simulation basketball. I'm hoping none of them are exploitable, but then again, we all know how skilled a cheeser can be at exploiting after getting familiar with the game.
    Last edited by Mos1ted; 09-03-2012, 04:51 AM.
    According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

    Comment

    • iLLosophy
      Plata o Plomo
      • Sep 2005
      • 3673

      #347
      Re: NBA 2K13 - All Signature Skills Revealed

      Originally posted by Stickz24
      First - they've been making these games for 12 years now. For the most part. They are pretty reasonable in their implementation of these things. Give them the benefit of doubt. Assume they consider the reasonable checks and balances that wont make this the arcade/fantastic game you're arguing it will be.
      A few questions...
      • Have you not played NBA 2k12 out of the box?
      • Where were the checks and balances then?
      • Who is this "They"?
      • Did ALL of the people in this "they" work for VC for the past 12 years?

      (I would really looooove for someone to use this argument for 20 plus years EA has been making basketball games...)


      Anyway, for all of you who are trying to crucify RyanFitzmagic, I'll admit he did come off pretty snobbish, but NONE of you all have provided any proof, data, or science to refute his claim (your own experience on the basketball court doesn't count). Is there at least 1 player who would get rattled by having his shot blocked? Yes. But there's at least 1 player who would not get rattled by having his shot blocked. There's also at least 1 player would actually play better after having his shot blocked. So I can't say I'm too ecstatic about the game applying a blanket ability without any sound data backing it and can impact ALL PLAYERS.


      Those who actually research and study the game of basketball already know there is a fair amount of research done that shows "Closer" in basketball is a myth. All data shows they either play the same as they do during the rest of the game or they play WORSE. No player in the history of basketball has their "attributes boosted" in clutch situations. Yet it is in the game. A game that is supposed to simulate actual basketball.


      Bottom line, like I said earlier, I really hope there's an option to turn these off. I am against most of these SS as they are making the game easier for unskilled users.

      In the case of the Eraser SS - for the AI I'm indifferent, there's still no science to back this up, but if they add it as a slider, people can have it how ever they want it. Win-win. But for the case of a user, I am not a fan of any Psychological elements in the game. This is a basketball simulator, not a psychological simulator. I am of the belief that the Psychology is already built-in by the guy who is holding the stick. There are plenty of guys who that get rattled easily to begin with (including myself depending on what else is on my mind). You get your opponent to throw his controller across the room and you've already won. THAT is the level where user psychology should play a factor. Not some artificial penalty in the game.

      My 2 cents....
      Last edited by iLLosophy; 09-03-2012, 04:52 AM.

      Comment

      • sactown_13
        Pro
        • Nov 2011
        • 479

        #348
        Originally posted by RyanFitzmagic
        No, I have no idea what I'm talking about. I've never played basketball in my life. I'm just an all-around dickhead.

        Right, guys?
        i am in agreement. and ive read a few comments a few pages back that KG had a good defensive coaching staff, which those celtics did/still have minus Thibodeau. but i dont wont people to forget the impact that rondo and tony allen had on that team. And lets not forget that tony allen has and is a great defensive presence on every team he has been a part of. so at times they had 3 players on the floor with great defensive abilities. while KG did have a big impact on the defense its not like he made rondo and allen great defensive players. they already were....
        Nobody exists on purpose, nobody belongs anywhere, everybody is gonna die, come watch TV.- Morty

        Comment

        • Mos1ted
          MVP
          • Sep 2002
          • 2267

          #349
          Re: NBA 2K13 - All Signature Skills Revealed

          Originally posted by djwax90
          Heat Retention has me mildly worried that it's gonna be OP. Basically, if you have it, once you're hot, the only way you'll cool off is if you miss shots or commit turnovers... a LOT of them, which won't happen if you're hot, so you'll stay hot, etc, etc.
          That's where the basketball IQ of the user comes into effect. How would you stop a hot player in real life? Double team, better help D, etc. Just because a player is hot doesn't mean he's invincible. Of course, if you continue to leave him open or continue with the same defense that got him hot in the first place, then you deserve to continue getting torched.

          <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/7eOuUO0lif4?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
          Last edited by Mos1ted; 09-03-2012, 05:37 AM.
          According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

          Comment

          • Mos1ted
            MVP
            • Sep 2002
            • 2267

            #350
            Re: NBA 2K13 - All Signature Skills Revealed

            Originally posted by iLLosophy
            A few questions...
            • Have you not played NBA 2k12 out of the box?
            • Where were the checks and balances then?
            • Who is this "They"?
            • Did ALL of the people in this "they" work for VC for the past 12 years?

            (I would really looooove for someone to use this argument for 20 plus years EA has been making basketball games...)


            Anyway, for all of you who are trying to crucify RyanFitzmagic, I'll admit he did come off pretty snobbish, but NONE of you all have provided any proof, data, or science to refute his claim (your own experience on the basketball court doesn't count). Is there at least 1 player who would get rattled by having his shot blocked? Yes. But there's at least 1 player who would not get rattled by having his shot blocked. There's also at least 1 player would actually play better after having his shot blocked. So I can't say I'm too ecstatic about the game applying a blanket ability without any sound data backing it and can impact ALL PLAYERS.


            Those who actually research and study the game of basketball already know there is a fair amount of research done that shows "Closer" in basketball is a myth. All data shows they either play the same as they do during the rest of the game or they play WORSE. No player in the history of basketball has their "attributes boosted" in clutch situations. Yet it is in the game. A game that is supposed to simulate actual basketball.


            Bottom line, like I said earlier, I really hope there's an option to turn these off. I am against most of these SS as they are making the game easier for unskilled users.

            In the case of the Eraser SS - for the AI I'm indifferent, there's still no science to back this up, but if they add it as a slider, people can have it how ever they want it. Win-win. But for the case of a user, I am not a fan of any Psychological elements in the game. This is a basketball simulator, not a psychological simulator. I am of the belief that the Psychology is already built-in by the guy who is holding the stick. There are plenty of guys who that get rattled easily to begin with (including myself depending on what else is on my mind). You get your opponent to throw his controller across the room and you've already won. THAT is the level where user psychology should play a factor. Not some artificial penalty in the game.

            My 2 cents....
            You have to remember that none of us have the skill to compete in the real NBA. If we did, we'd be looking forward to the NBA regular season and getting ready for training camp, not browsing OS looking for information on NBA 2K13. Regardless of how well we may know the sport of basketball, there is a difference between knowing how to play basketball and actually being able to physically play basketball. Some of the greatest coaches in basketball history were mediocre players in their day.

            Yes, this is a basketball simulation, but it's also an NBA simulation. The goal here is to not only replicate five on five basketball but NBA basketball as well. To me, Signature Skills makes it more possible for that to take place.

            If you don't think a psychological effect takes place, then check these out:

            <iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MgJ_MZWg3iw?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

            <iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/LDSF8otJH8Y?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

            <iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/WZ5BBWwd_x0?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
            According to my old marketing professor, satisfaction is when product performance meets or exceeds consumer expectation.

            Comment

            • fluent2332
              MVP
              • Aug 2005
              • 1735

              #351
              Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

              One thing I think we can safely say about Signature Skills is that people are going to complain about them, regardless of how they are implemented. The very second a "Corner Specialist" hits a game-winning 3 after receiving a pass from a "Dimer", and the user loses the game because of it, you will see complaining. The moment a "Brick Wall" puts the user on the floor and leaves someone open for a 3, you're gonna hear about it. That's for sure. It's going to be this year's up-and-under or spin layup.

              As for how they will be implemented, I imagine overall this is a good addition for 2K. I don't necessarily agree with the philosophy behind the skills, such as "Defensive Anchor" flat out making people better, but hey, at least 2K is trying to add a different element to their game. And it's not like they are pulling these skills out of nowhere, a lot of analysts would agree with their philosophy behind this, so hey, whatever's clever. I like the prospect of role players being more valuable because of their skills. Role players should now have the most value they have ever had in the 2K series, and that's pretty exciting.

              Comment

              • UnbelievablyRAW
                MVP
                • Sep 2011
                • 1245

                #352
                Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                Remove ankle breaker from making people fall. That sort of thing was in Live 07 and it was cheese. My brother would always use Deron Williams on Utah and would simply just run up the court and do a step back or spin and I'd fall over without pressing anything then he'd pull up for open shots. With 2k making ankle breaker similar to the old Live expect to fall over frequently (30% is nearly 1/3 times then do a signature crossover you'll get shook)

                I know players that have ankle breaker and shot creator will be cheese because they can easily get loose of defenders and then **** creator will kick in and make them automatic.

                I want dropping someone to be RARE

                I want to be like "Oh sh*t I just dropped this guy! Did you see that!"

                Comment

                • nova91
                  MVP
                  • Oct 2009
                  • 2074

                  #353
                  Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                  I think everyone may be blowing the Ankle Breaker skill out of proportion. Out of the thousands of iso moves I used and seen used against me, I have only seen my guy fall about 6 maybe 7 times and the guys I use them against fall about 6 times. A 30% increase isn't much.
                  Last edited by nova91; 09-03-2012, 08:12 AM.
                  Say "No" to railroaded MC modes.

                  Comment

                  • triplewgf
                    Rookie
                    • Jan 2008
                    • 23

                    #354
                    Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                    Originally posted by 2k10Fonzarelli
                    Then wouldn't that suggest that receiving a good pass from a good passer raises shot percentages based on the shooters position on the court AND the actual pass itself?

                    Point is this : Getting a pass from a good player does raise the percentages based on who the passer is most of the time. I used an extreme example sure, but there must be some accuracy discrepancies between a dime from steve nash, and a dime from Jameer Nelson. Nash's receiver is in a more comfortable position to shoot the shot the way he's shot it for his whole life thus making his %age higher.

                    Of course thats not to say Jameer can't drop a perfect dime.

                    This all depends on whats going on under the hood of 2k. I've always felt like, if one of my players catches a pass and bobbles it or at least doesn't catch it in a ready to shoot stance, their %age to make the shot is decreased. On the other hand if a great rated passer nails his target perfectly, that shot has an increased %age of going in. This Sig Skill just emphasizes the absolute best of the best so there's a difference between Jose Calderon's 90+ pass rating and Rondo's 90+ pass rating that can't be realistically, or for gameplay balance purposes, implemented through stat slider boosting.



                    Stat is a Man-Child, even if its not in his tendencies to bang that much anymore he still possesses the ability to get muscley.
                    Ah, I understand your point now. Yup, I agree.

                    What "feels" wrong to me is that it seems to be an automatic thing, without context -- get a pass from Nash, automatically, the percentage is higher. Would there be a world of difference, for example, if Nash, from a standstill, throws a basic chest pass to a shooter curling off a screen, as opposed to Jameer throwing the same pass?

                    It would be awesome if those bobbles and bad catches and stuff would actually be implemented (maybe the receiver's hands rating could come into play) and result in a significant delay before the shot can go up. That way, the defense can recover and influence the shot.

                    I guess the way I'd implement it is to consider that "catching in a ready to shoot position" thing as super important -- good passers could hit the shooters in that position more often, more consistently, and with more difficult passes.

                    I'm really excited for 2K13 )
                    Last edited by triplewgf; 09-03-2012, 08:20 AM.

                    Comment

                    • Thunder Storm
                      Rookie
                      • Dec 2010
                      • 480

                      #355
                      Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                      Originally posted by raidertiger
                      LeBron can have around 27 of those skills, will he actually get them?
                      gimme a break..
                      2K teams : Rockets,Thunder
                      222-34 online

                      Comment

                      • UnbelievablyRAW
                        MVP
                        • Sep 2011
                        • 1245

                        #356
                        Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                        Originally posted by nova91
                        I think everyone may be blowing the Ankle Breaker skill out of proportion. Out of the thousands of iso moves I used and seen used against me, I have only seen my guy fall about 6 maybe 7 times and the guys I use them against fall about 6 times. A 30% increase isn't much.
                        30% is almost 1/3 times. Yup that's very small
                        /s

                        Comment

                        • Thunder Storm
                          Rookie
                          • Dec 2010
                          • 480

                          #357
                          Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                          Originally posted by UnbelievablyRAW
                          30% is almost 1/3 times. Yup that's very small
                          /s
                          then you take the regular percentage for an ankle breaker to occur, which is maybe a 5-6 % chance and multiply it by 1.3 ... what is that 6.5-7% now ???

                          So it's not really a big deal. People just don't understand percentages, all they're seeing is "30 % increase".
                          2K teams : Rockets,Thunder
                          222-34 online

                          Comment

                          • KasparV
                            Rookie
                            • Mar 2012
                            • 65

                            #358
                            Re: NBA 2K13 - All Signature Skills Revealed

                            Originally posted by iLLosophy
                            Anyway, for all of you who are trying to crucify RyanFitzmagic, I'll admit he did come off pretty snobbish, but NONE of you all have provided any proof, data, or science to refute his claim (your own experience on the basketball court doesn't count). Is there at least 1 player who would get rattled by having his shot blocked? Yes. But there's at least 1 player who would not get rattled by having his shot blocked. There's also at least 1 player would actually play better after having his shot blocked. So I can't say I'm too ecstatic about the game applying a blanket ability without any sound data backing it and can impact ALL PLAYERS.

                            I believe you are right in this, not every player reacts the same in a certain situation.
                            But I believe that there are more players in the league that are rattled by being blocked then there are players who are not or play better after being blocked. I have no data to back this up, but I think this is the case.

                            If we just assume this is true (maybe it is, maybe it isn't but hypothetically speaking because I think so and this is my opinion):
                            To me, perfection is unreachable, so the next best thing is to be as close to perfection as you can; if you have a league (NBA) where most of the players play a little worse after being blocked then I rather have that in a simulation everyone plays a little worse in the game then no-one, because it resembles reality more.
                            Do you understand my point?

                            Comment

                            • silverskier
                              Rookie
                              • Sep 2008
                              • 285

                              #359
                              Re: NBA 2K13 - All 31 Signature Skills Revealed

                              (30% is nearly 1/3 times then do a signature crossover you'll get shook)
                              no, it is not. Ankle breaker will be contextual with the defender movement. If you perform an isomotion correctly and your opponent doesn't defend well, maybe you have a 20% to break his ankles. You just have to multiply it by 1,3 and then you'll have the probability of a player with the SS of ankle breaker, a 26%. So no, it is not a 1/3 to break the ankles of your opponent =]

                              Comment

                              • iLLosophy
                                Plata o Plomo
                                • Sep 2005
                                • 3673

                                #360
                                Re: NBA 2K13 - All Signature Skills Revealed

                                Originally posted by Mos1ted
                                If you don't think a psychological effect takes place, then check these out:
                                Maybe I made that post too long, but I just reread it and I'm pretty sure that I didn't say or imply that. I merely said a) no one has provided any science or proof that every player in the nba gets loses confident for 90 seconds after getting their shot blocked by these guys and b) I want the psychology to take place when playing User vs User, actually between the Users....not Blake Griffin's psychology vs Serge Ibaka's.



                                Just some hypothetical questions - say you did one of those dunks on Blake griffin against me:
                                • What is my (meaning me - iLLosophy) psychological state after getting posterized and hearing the crowd go crazy?
                                • Is it possible I (iLLosophy) could be demoralized after you did that, thus impacting how I play the next several minutes? My thoughts could be like this: "Man Mos1ted better not submit that dunk for OS top 10...that was some bs....I can't believe they called foul on me." Completely throws off my game for the next few minutes. I start 2nd guessing myself, throwing bad passes, leaving guys wide open, etc
                                • Is it possible you (Mos1ted) get hype after doing that dunk and gives you a boost in confidence? If not you, maybe someone else?


                                That should give you a better insight into the psychological game I want to play. And I'd prefer to play it without the game compounding or negating the effect
                                Last edited by iLLosophy; 09-03-2012, 08:50 AM.

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