Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

[Sellaz32]

Personally I would be glad if this was the last we see of legends. I think more attention needs to be given to the NBA of today than being stuck 20 years in the past.

I am more interested in the present. I may be in the minority but I have not even used any legends or legend modes over the past 3 years. I am strictly an offline association player and would like more attention focused on that.

Whereas I am certainly biased toward legends, since I personally view 1985-1995 as being the best years of the NBA, but I certainly don't think they need more priority than current teams. These discussion always end up either or. Why not have the best of both worlds?

[ggsimmonds]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Whereas I am certainly biased toward legends, since I personally view 1985-1995 as being the best years of the NBA, but I certainly don't think they need more priority than current teams. These discussion always end up either or. Why not have the best of both worlds?

Because game developers have finite resources to make games. Sports games in particular usually don't have the biggest budgets. Association mode has been largely untouched over the past few years.

[Sellaz32]

Because game developers have finite resources to make games. Sports games in particular usually don't have the biggest budgets. Association mode has been largely untouched over the past few years.

Right...I guess my point was that if average Joe can put together decent legend teams on the roster at no cost, than it wouldn't be too much extra work to have them on the game officially. I also agree 100% with you that Association Mode needed more attention though.

[VDusen04]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Right...I guess my point was that if average Joe can put together decent legend teams on the roster at no cost, than it wouldn't be too much extra work to have them on the game officially. I also agree 100% with you that Association Mode needed more attention though.

I definitely think Association and Legends could co-exist. I think they both have a rightful place in an NBA basketball video game as they're both directly related to the real life NBA experience. If it really came down to a matter of resources, I believe there are many other aspects of 2K that could be reduced that are not as tightly tied to real life.

Also, as you mentioned Sellaz, I don't imagine classic teams taking that much man power to be honest. I feel as though there'd be some art requirements for courts (if needed), and faces (if needed), and research on signatures, but it's not as if they'd be taking up programming resources that could be of use in Association developments.

[dkrause1971]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Because game developers have finite resources to make games. Sports games in particular usually don't have the biggest budgets. Association mode has been largely untouched over the past few years.

You really could say the same thing about my player and other modes then too. They could go so more time is spent on association. The way the game is currently with legends your talking about the art department mainly taxed, not the gameplay or coding for association like these other modes are taking up. You could argue the money spent on legends could go to adding more workers to work on association, but i think that would be a wrong assumption because we have no idea how much of the sales are tied to having legends.

What it boils down to is i think your not interested (or as interested) in legends so its the easiest and most logical for you to see go. I could easily go without all this stuff but association and legends and be happy.

[lostsoul]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

i wish it were a strictly legends game without the whack nba teams and players of today. well - besides the celtics, spurs and thunder.

nah, i'm trolling.

[Phreezy P]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

I think MJ signed a 3 year deal in 2010 to be in until 2k13. So unless he re-signs his contract, have fun playing Live 14!

[lostsoul]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

I think MJ signed a 3 year deal in 2010 to be in until 2k13. So unless he re-signs his contract, have fun playing Live 14!

if it even makes the shelves next year =/

[ggsimmonds]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

I definitely think Association and Legends could co-exist. I think they both have a rightful place in an NBA basketball video game as they're both directly related to the real life NBA experience. If it really came down to a matter of resources, I believe there are many other aspects of 2K that could be reduced that are not as tightly tied to real life.

Also, as you mentioned Sellaz, I don't imagine classic teams taking that much man power to be honest. I feel as though there'd be some art requirements for courts (if needed), and faces (if needed), and research on signatures, but it's not as if they'd be taking up programming resources that could be of use in Association developments.

Everyone brings up the man power while forgetting about the budget issue. Do all the legend players agree to be in the game for free? That couldbe money spent on other resources like programmers and testers. And typically teams that work on sports titles are quite small. But I don't know the size of the 2k team.

The two things can coexist, but I do think it comes at the expense of the association mode. 2k is using legends as a back of the box feature and put a lot of time into it (which is a good thing, shouldn't do something halfassed) but that is time that I would prefer spent on association. so it is not so much that they have legends in the game, but rather that they have game modes built around legends.

But I agree that there are other things that can be downsized (for lack of a better term) before legends, and his name is Justin Bieber. Any time spent on getting his face in the game could be better spent elsewhere.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

You really could say the same thing about my player and other modes then too. They could go so more time is spent on association. The way the game is currently with legends your talking about the art department mainly taxed, not the gameplay or coding for association like these other modes are taking up. You could argue the money spent on legends could go to adding more workers to work on association, but i think that would be a wrong assumption because we have no idea how much of the sales are tied to having legends.

What it boils down to is i think your not interested (or as interested) in legends so its the easiest and most logical for you to see go. I could easily go without all this stuff but association and legends and be happy.

You bring up valid points, but my reply to the money issue is that while it is true what you say about sales, the sales come after development of the game. Maybe the presence of legends boost sales for that year and that leads to a bigger budget the next year (which is a reasonable assumption), but the issue still is that it does take a sizeable portion of the budget.

I don't necessarily want to see legends eliminated per se, I just will not be unhappy if this is the last year they are present. But I should clarify, it's not the presence of legends that I am speaking of; classic teams should be included. what I am speaking of is making the inclusion of legends be a main feature or selling point of the game. To put it simply, we could have classic teams without the classic courts, uniforms, presentation, commentary etc.

Finally I will say that even though I am arguing against legends, the argument is almost just for fun. I don't exactly dislike their inclusion nor do I blame it for lack of improvements in association. More or less I am indifferent towards them. Their presence one way or the other in next year's title will not have any impact on whether or not I buy the game.
and on a related if slightly off topic point, I am unhappy with some aspects of the direction of this years game. I kid about Beiber but that is not a big deal. I don't like the "VC" and the changes to myplayer (buying a wardrobe? DLC jewelry that boost your stats? uye). I hope this does not represent a new direction in the series.

[VDusen04]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Everyone brings up the man power while forgetting about the budget issue. Do all the legend players agree to be in the game for free? That couldbe money spent on other resources like programmers and testers. And typically teams that work on sports titles are quite small. But I don't know the size of the 2k team.

The two things can coexist, but I do think it comes at the expense of the association mode. 2k is using legends as a back of the box feature and put a lot of time into it (which is a good thing, shouldn't do something halfassed) but that is time that I would prefer spent on association. so it is not so much that they have legends in the game, but rather that they have game modes built around legends.

But I agree that there are other things that can be downsized (for lack of a better term) before legends, and his name is Justin Bieber. Any time spent on getting his face in the game could be better spent elsewhere.

I agree with you when you say there are other things much less related to the actual NBA and its history that could be downsized before giving the classic teams the chop. And if it ever came down to a boardroom meeting where someone poses, "Okay, here's the issue, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird and friends are cutting into our budget to afford Pauly D and Justin Bieber. One group's gotta go. So, Larry, Magic, sorry, we've got to prioritize. This is an NBA game and without Biebs and Kevin Baumgartner, our MyCareer Twitter feed makes little to no sense. We gonna have to let you go."

But I should clarify, it's not the presence of legends that I am speaking of; classic teams should be included. what I am speaking of is making the inclusion of legends be a main feature or selling point of the game. To put it simply, we could have classic teams without the classic courts, uniforms, presentation, commentary etc.

On the flip side, I'm not sure if I follow you here. The legends in 2K13 were certainly not a selling point of the game. In fact, it's almost as if they've been forgotten. And when they were a selling point, I think it went over quite well. It was a true NBA feature that tapped into the hearts and souls of a lot of folks who'd have otherwise looked straight past yet another video game featuring the same modes involving current NBA players. I believe the more real life options, the better.

For me, classic teams aren't about living in the past. I still love using current teams too. But it's just a matter of providing more awesome options. It adds a significant amount of depth to the game itself. If some gamers opt not to utilize that depth, that's fine, but I'm not sure it warrants removal on those grounds. I also don't believe the fact teams are no longer current means they more or less have no place in a modern video game. Including former teams that actually existed seems to make a lot more sense than including a mode where a made up version of ourselves is drafted and becomes a superstar over the course of one season while earning pirate coins for our exploits. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Lastly, I was confused by your statement "we could have classic teams without the classic courts, uniforms, presentation, commentary etc.". I mean, I understand not needing custom commentary. And as cool as the era-filters are, I wouldn't necessarily need them (they're absent this year). But having classic teams without classic courts and classic uniforms? I feel as though that'd defeat the purpose of classic teams in the first place. Would they just wear white and grey generic jerseys? Their team's current jerseys?

In contrast, would a game feel just as authentic if the current Brooklyn Nets still wore old Nets jerseys and played in the Meadowlands? If the current Heat wore white and grey generics? Would that not ruin any sort of immersion?

In fact, through much of the 2000's, NBA 2K included something called "All-Time" teams. Around five NBA clubs (Celtics, Lakers, Supersonics, and another team or two) had all-time teams made up of their franchise's best players. The jerseys they wore were kind of team inspired and kind of generic and I can't recall whether they played on their current team's court or on a generic court. Either way, it was a mess and that feature was largely forgotten, because it made no sense. There was no authenticity because it was just a fantasy club with a hodgpodged roster, fake jerseys, and no home court. 2K's been implementing classic players for years. It just wasn't until they did it right (NBA 2K11 with teams, jerseys and courts) that it really took off and caught gamer's imaginations.

[Sellaz32]

I agree with you when you say there are other things much less related to the actual NBA and its history that could be downsized before giving the classic teams the chop. And if it ever came down to a boardroom meeting where someone poses, "Okay, here's the issue, Magic Johnson, Larry Bird and friends are cutting into our budget to afford Pauly D and Justin Bieber. One group's gotta go. So, Larry, Magic, sorry, we've got to prioritize. This is an NBA game and without Biebs and Kevin Baumgartner, our MyCareer Twitter feed makes little to no sense. We gonna have to let you go."

On the flip side, I'm not sure if I follow you here. The legends in 2K13 were certainly not a selling point of the game. In fact, it's almost as if they've been forgotten. And when they were a selling point, I think it went over quite well. It was a true NBA feature that tapped into the hearts and souls of a lot of folks who'd have otherwise looked straight past yet another video game featuring the same modes involving current NBA players. I believe the more real life options, the better.

For me, classic teams aren't about living in the past. I still love using current teams too. But it's just a matter of providing more awesome options. It adds a significant amount of depth to the game itself. If some gamers opt not to utilize that depth, that's fine, but I'm not sure it warrants removal on those grounds. I also don't believe the fact teams are no longer current means they more or less have no place in a modern video game. Including former teams that actually existed seems to make a lot more sense than including a mode where a made up version of ourselves is drafted and becomes a superstar over the course of one season while earning pirate coins for our exploits. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Lastly, I was confused by your statement "we could have classic teams without the classic courts, uniforms, presentation, commentary etc.". I mean, I understand not needing custom commentary. And as cool as the era-filters are, I wouldn't necessarily need them (they're absent this year). But having classic teams without classic courts and classic uniforms? I feel as though that'd defeat the purpose of classic teams in the first place. Would they just wear white and grey generic jerseys? Their team's current jerseys?

In contrast, would a game feel just as authentic if the current Brooklyn Nets still wore old Nets jerseys and played in the Meadowlands? If the current Heat wore white and grey generics? Would that not ruin any sort of immersion?

In fact, through much of the 2000's, NBA 2K included something called "All-Time" teams. Around five NBA clubs (Celtics, Lakers, Supersonics, and another team or two) had all-time teams made up of their franchise's best players. The jerseys they wore were kind of team inspired and kind of generic and I can't recall whether they played on their current team's court or on a generic court. Either way, it was a mess and that feature was largely forgotten, because it made no sense. There was no authenticity because it was just a fantasy club with a hodgpodged roster, fake jerseys, and no home court. 2K's been implementing classic players for years. It just wasn't until they did it right (NBA 2K11 with teams, jerseys and courts) that it really took off and caught gamer's imaginations.

Agreed. Speaking for someone who hadn't bought a basketball game since Live 97 in college until 2k11 (because of the classic teams) having a game with old teams allowed me to relive the days of double dribble, Bird vs Dr. J, Lakers vs Celtics, etc, but with a next gen system.

[spudnique]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Agreed. Speaking for someone who hadn't bought a basketball game since Live 97 in college until 2k11 (because of the classic teams) having a game with old teams allowed me to relive the days of double dribble, Bird vs Dr. J, Lakers vs Celtics, etc, but with a next gen system.

Agreed 100%. If it is about the money. Well, I basically bought a PS3 just to play 2k11 and 2k12. That is saying something for the sales boost these 2 games received by including classic teams and mode.

I think they haven't unlocked the real potential with these classic teams. IMO They need to expand it, not restrict/eliminate it.
The greatest mode was kind of cool but many just saw it as a way to unlock the teams. I think they could create a few more modes (online and off) either unique to classic teams or mixed with current teams.

Last quick point, if the focus turns to just currents. I am one person who is less likely to buy. My thought is, they could put all there efforts into the current game and charge us for classic team/classic modes DLC. I for one, would pay for it.

[aussieicon91]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Do people honestly buy NBA 2k13 just to play quick games with the Legends?

[ezio]

Re: Could this be the last NBA 2K with Legends?

Do people honestly buy NBA 2k13 just to play quick games with the Legends?

Is that all you can use them for this year? Can you put them in assosication?