The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

[youALREADYknow]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

The major problem is how these rating then transalte into game. We know that signature shots and ball handling transalte very well thanks to 1Rose and add to the realism of movement of players WITHOUT the use of or need of roster ratings adjustments because sliders then take over rather well. meaning if a big guys has a week dribble package NO slider adjustment is going to make them better or worse possibly slower or faster but not super hero status.

Its a tough call. Synergy didnt really work in NBA Live 11 as there it made players movements not that great as opposed to "the honest eyball or feel" that me and others have tried.

After all is said and done it's what is seen IN-GAME so ANY way you can make that happen albeit eyeballing it rationalizing it is for the better.

But please do test genetlmans after you make these ratings adjustments.

MANY of these type of rating/tendency edits end up playing very stiffly and robotic looking and not natural in game at all.

But THAT is editors fault that is 2k's for not making the animations complaint WITH the actual rating numbers per click etc

I can tell you all right now that the changes he's claimed to make with the Knicks will not get them to play quality Knicks basketball. Amare as an isolation scorer along with Melo in 2K12 is simply not going to work. Melo's shot tendencies are so high that Amare would rarely reach his 20+ PPG that he sees in real life.

I think Rashidi is mistaking the purpose of the Isolation Freelance tendency. That tendency is supposed to be used for CLEAROUT isolation off the dribble. Give the player the ball and get out of the way. Give Amare a high Isolation tendency and he'll just dribble the clock out on half of the possessions under AI control before either passing out or jacking up a jumper.

Amare can isolate, but he does it on the wings and at the key, not at the 3PT line. The best way I've seen him play like his real world self is to give him post ups in the high post instead of the low post and increase his Face Up slider so he can effectively take defenders off the dribble from the key or wing.

If this were the perfect game, then Amare could isolate on a wing and the rest of the team would still play off his movements. But we know this isn't perfection and unfortunately AI players become nearly useless in Iso situations.

[bedwardsroy19]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

The major problem is how these rating then transalte into game. We know that signature shots and ball handling transalte very well thanks to 1Rose and add to the realism of movement of players WITHOUT the use of or need of roster ratings adjustments because sliders then take over rather well. meaning if a big guys has a week dribble package NO slider adjustment is going to make them better or worse possibly slower or faster but not super hero status.

Its a tough call. Synergy didnt really work in NBA Live 11 as there it made players movements not that great as opposed to "the honest eyball or feel" that me and others have tried.

After all is said and done it's what is seen IN-GAME so ANY way you can make that happen albeit eyeballing it rationalizing it is for the better.

But please do test genetlmans after you make these ratings adjustments.

MANY of these type of rating/tendency edits end up playing very stiffly and robotic looking and not natural in game at all.

But THAT is editors fault that is 2k's for not making the animations complaint WITH the actual rating numbers per click etc

It's very important you test the tendencies... Its very easy to say one thing is wrong and try to fix it, but you see how bad 2k messed up certain aspects of gameplay so its equally important to go check on your fixes to see if the gameplay remains fluid.

As far as touches being far too high yeah they are about 3 times of where they should be at. Im surprised he just noticed that touches were off.

There are so many other tendencies he might want to look into in great detail as well

EDIT: I saw youALREADYknow's post after my post... exactly what I was thinking

[ffaacc03]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

Appreciate the opinions, thus would very much appreciate feedbacks instead. Specially of those with access to his work (360).

LOL at those that make roster edits to ratings or tendencies and do not test their results, obviously Rashidi isnt one of them ... anyways, would really appreciate if we could get detailed and specific feedback on what his edits have translated into. As descriptive as possible: what are the robotic movement we are seing ? on what instances ? or is it a robotic flow of the offense ? is it a per player issue or a team issue ? is it all these found on default or is it new, maybe introduced by edits ? is everything as it should now ? or whatever it is.

Again, if these opinions and feedback could be shared directly to him, would also be better, thus I will direct them once I get the chance. Thanks !


P.S.
To all, please try to avoid derailing this thread off topic (intended or not, even if it is for praises and not critics; I am lately doing so too) by falling into referring adjetives related to the author´s character. Does not adds to the purpose of the thread and it ultimatelly results in unnecessary controversy.

[Colts18]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

I always thought it made sense to make the touches = the usage rate. 2K did that but mutiplied it by 3. And they are random for some players at that.

[UltimateAvgGuy]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

WOW

Please know what you are talking about before saying something this wrong as if its true. Wade had better numbers, shot a higher percentage overall, and did more for his team, all of this while playing with Lebron James. It was not better on some other level shyt, but Wade has the better season bar none. Rose was more important to his team hence the MVP, if Bron was not on the Heat and Wade/Bron posted their exact same numbers on opposite teams, Wade and Bron are 1 and 2 im MVP voting easily. You are making no sense right now bro

Do you have some hidden D-Wade solo sex tape? Because bruh, you are in love.

[UltimateAvgGuy]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

last time i saw the miami heat play wade kept the heat in games in the finals where was LeBum at??? LeChoke was nowhere and i mean NOWHERE to be found in games 5 and 6 especially the 4th qtr in the whole series.....get your facts straight before you start talking out your ***

Everyone conveniently forgets who dominated the Bulls series (Lebron) and who was nowhere to be found (Wade) a week before the Finals....I wonder if we would hear the crap negativity for Wade if the Heat lost that series.

Back on topic, this is an incerdible job on the rosters keep up the great work.

[UltimateAvgGuy]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

do specific slider sets affect your ratings at all?

[Tomba]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

do specific slider sets affect your ratings at all?

hopefully this isnt off topic but

game slider tendencies do.

The two crucial to a lot of overboard cpu agressiveness is the inside shot and close shot tendencies...

theres a magic number for both to make the cpu play less arcade like and more sim like

[Zen_Master07]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

Has rashidi edited any of the 3 pt ratings yet? They still seem way too high

[Lee Harrison]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

hopefully this isnt off topic but

game slider tendencies do.

The two crucial to a lot of overboard cpu agressiveness is the inside shot and close shot tendencies...

theres a magic number for both to make the cpu play less arcade like and more sim like

Please can be clearer??
In General or for the player?

[ffaacc03]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

Please can be clearer??
In General or for the player?

Sliders are composed by both, players attributes and tendencies ... editing sliders globally alter the outcome of what was edited.

So, if you alter close and inside attributes, you shall see that reflected on the player performances from those areas ... if you alter close and inside tendencies, you will see that reflected on the recurrence of the players into those areas. Sliders affect all players, thus the effect depends on the attribute/tendency base they had within a roster.

What makes a custom roster worthy, is having some sort of scale, where the norm is the scale and the exceptions are just that. Once you have a worthy roster like that as a base, you can then inmerse yourself in the land of doing global adjustments to correct issues or simply, to adjust the gameplay to your perception of the game.

Hope this helps you ... and lets get back to topic with our next post.

[ffaacc03]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

The continuation of the previous post ...

Wednesday, October 19, 2011

Fixing NBA 2K12, Part II



I completed my ratings, tendencies, and assigned plays for the Celtics, and instead of running a CPU match I decided to play against them with my also completed Knicks.

SETTINGS
All-Star difficulty
Simulation sliders

Rather than post the box score it might be best to look at each individual player's performance.


Carmelo Anthony
STATS: 44 Points, 6 Rebounds, 5 Assists, 1 Steal, 43 Minutes
SHOTS: 19-30 FG, 1-1 3PT, 5-5 FT
NEGATIVE: 2 Turnovers, 4 Fouls

I had my offensive play calling set to Auto which naturally meant a bunch of Iso and Post plays for Melo. Naturally, I suck at the new Iso & Post controls. I still managed to find some separation here and there, and hit my share of contested shots too (which balanced out the ridiculous rate the CPU hit some of theirs). One thing I don't like about "Simulation" sliders is that the CPU will never swipe at the ball and thus I was kinda free to generate my own shot without losing the ball (PASSING is the absolute worst thing you can do in this game at times). Thus Melo only had 2 turnovers to his 30 FGA, 5 FTA, and 5 assists. The CPU also never goes for Charges which is a main source of Melo's real life turnovers, and unfortunately this is a feature that has been largely absent from the last 4-5 years of 2K.

Paul Pierce
STATS: 38 Points, 6 Rebounds, 1 Assist, 6 Steals, 2 Blocks, 37 Minutes
SHOTS: 15-20 FG, 4-6 3PT, 4-4 FT
NEGATIVE: 1 Turnover, 1 Foul

You can't get any more efficient than the game Pierce had. I played great defense for much of the game (at least as good as one can with Carmelo Anthony), but that is more than one can say about the dreaded CPU. Two straight possessions Pierce was able to hit threes because the CPU got totally lost on their rotations (chasing after a man that already had defensive coverage) while I was busy successfully defending a West/Garnett Pick & Roll.

Pierce also hit a go-ahead three with 1.8 seconds left in OT by literally jogging through a double screen play to hit an uncontested three. I didn't have much of a beef with his shot selection but the CPU defensive AI (who I honestly think intentionally function worse when rubberband AI is in effect) made his line a bit gaudier than it should have been (32 points on 13-18 FG and 2-4 3PT I can live with). Pierce also didn't take many FTs so maybe I could have been more physical with him on his drives... though the CPU managed to avoid contact from even the help defender on a few occasions.

Pierce also had 6 steals mainly from reaching on post entry passes to Melo. I wish my CPU would aggressively go after post entry passes.

Amare Stoudemire
STATS: 28 Points, 8 Rebounds, 2 Blocks, 44 Minutes
SHOTS: 12-24 FG, 4-5 FT
NEGATIVE: 3 Turnovers, 3 Fouls

After fixing the assigned plays, Amare ran more Pick and Rolls than he normally would, which was very pleasing. He should be utilizing his quickness against Garnett rather than playing with his back to the basket against one of the best post defenders in the league. I was also able to find him on a few basket cuts during one of Melo's isolation plays (this was not part of the play diagram, and I doubt the CPU would make this kind of recognition).

Amare also hit the game winning shot (unfortunately not a buzzer beater for the achievement, 0.3 seconds left) as I gave the CPU a taste of it's own medicine. For whatever reason my team wasn't running an inbounds play so I grabbed Amare (who was standing 30 feet from the basket with 1.8 seconds left looking for a pass like an idiot) and ran him towards the basket where he belongs. Garnett got caught behind Fields, Jermaine O'Neal (inbound defender), and Pierce (defending Fields) which gave Amare a clear path to the basket. Amare caught the ball 10 feet away and pulled up for a jumper. If I missed the shot I probably would have kicked myself for not going for the layup (though if time expired I would have kicked myself for not going for the shot). I think I pulled up simply because I was so shocked I was open. Either way, the shot went down, and Boston had no timeouts remaining (and w/ 0.3 ticks left, not enough time to get a shot anyway).

Kevin Garnett
STATS: 12 Points, 3 Rebounds, 2 Steals, 2 Blocks, 43 Minutes
SHOTS: 6-15 FG, 0-1 3PT
NEGATIVE: 2 Turnovers, 3 Fouls

I took Garnett very seriously because I remember how unstoppable his fadeaway is in previous 2K games. Late in the game I started doubling off Rondo anytime KG got it in the post. He got a few good looks due to poor CPU rotation but at the end of the day he did not have a good offensive game (zero assists, no free throws, 9 missed shots).

One important feature to note is that Garnett played within himself and didn't dribble around the court. One of fan's biggest complaints is that bigs have Isolation tendencies that are much too high (Garnett's in particular was a team leading 91). Isolations only made up 5% of KG's offense IRL so this was appropriately dealt with.

Chauncey Billups
STATS: 11 Points, 4 Rebounds, 8 Assists, 1 Steal, 1 Block, 29 Minutes
SHOTS: 4-7 FG, 2-3 3PT, 1-1 FT
NEGATIVE: 1 Turnover, 6 Fouls

I was a bit reach happy with Billups on the defensive end, forgetting that it was Simulation setting where on-ball steal success is very low. Billups actually had some good fouls, preventing an alley oop (fouling the passer), and another that stopped a fastbreak so it wasn't all bad. I am not a fan of his man defense anyway as he isn't nearly quick enough to keep up with Rondo. I was flabbergasted when Avery Bradley checked into the game in the 4th quarter and then proceeded to blow by Billups for a dunk no more than 5 seconds later. Offensively, I didn't have a bad game with Billups as he ran the offense and I took smart shots, but his defensive struggles kept the Celtics in the game and I wasn't sad to see him foul out late in the 4th quarter.

Rajon Rondo
STATS: 24 Points, 2 Rebounds, 7 Assists,4 Steals
SHOTS: 9-22 FG, 6-8 FT
NEGATIVE: 1 Turnover, 6 Fouls

As mentioned before, Billups struggled to keep up with Rondo, and I also played off Rondo to double down on Garnett. The result is the CPU took more shots than Rondo normally would. He was only 1-6 between the 4th quarter and OT and fouled out via intentional foul on the 2nd to last possession of OT (I bricked one FT which set up Pierce's go-ahead three on the next possession). I definitely picked my poison properly by staying at home on the big three. I probably could have defended his penetrations better, but I was also using one of the league's worst defensive teams and I've spent the bulk of my time editing ratings. Cut me some slack.

Landry Fields
STATS: 11 Points, 5 Rebounds, 1 Assist, 1 Steal, 39 Minutes
SHOTS: 3-4 FG, 3-3 3PT, 2-2 FT
NEGATIVE: 2 Turnovers

Fields didn't get many plays run for him (a few Pick & Rolls w/ Amare) but was able to do most of his damage giving post-entry passes to Melo. Anytime Allen made any effort to double I was able to hit Fields for a three. Allen was late just enough that he wouldn't put his hands up and Fields was able to get B quallity shots on a Perfect Release that all went down. Defensively, he struggled to stay in front of Ray Allen at times, but was usually athletic enough to (eventually) recover. At one point Fields grabbed an offensive board, shot faked, and went to the line. All told, this was really how Fields plays in real life.

Ray Allen
STATS: 17 Points, 2 Rebounds, 1 Assist, 1 Steal
SHOTS: 6-17 FG, 1-5 3PT, 4-5 FT
NEGATIVE: 2 Turnovers, 1 Foul

If there was one player I was determined not to let beat me, it was Ray Allen. I made sure not to leave it to the CPU to chase Allen around on screens. I didn't overreact to Allen when he was on the 3pt line getting a pick from Garnett. He isn't going to take the shot in motion. Just get over and put your hands up. Only jump when the shot clock is down to one. The end result is I defended Allen much better than I'd thought. Most of his successful shots were fastbreak layups and dunks (or a layup he was able to get based on how tight I played him on the perimeter). I can live with 17 points on 17 shots from Ray Allen.

Ronny Turiaf
STATS: 4 Points, 6 Rebounds, 1 Assist, 1 Steal, 1 Block, 35 Minutes
SHOTS: 1-1 FG, 2-2 FT
NEGATIVE: 2 Turnovers

Turiaf had the biggest shot of the night. Down 2 points with 5 seconds left, I inbounded the ball to Toney Douglas, 35 feet from the basket, momentarily forgetting it was the end of the game. Douglas drove in but was stopped by Rondo at the FT line. Turiaf showed up running over Douglas' left shoulder. Garnett was on my right side chasing Turiaf. With 1.6 seconds left I figure what the hell and give it to cutting Turiaf half-praying it was Amare (it wasn't... Amare was standing behind the 3pt line in the corner, home position for a PF/C in the 2Kverse). Turiaf catches the ball but has been re-picked up by Garnett on his right hand side. Turiaf swoops to the basket and lays it in over Garnett with no time remaining on the clock to send it into overtime.

Aside from that, no plays were ever called for Turiaf and he did his best to stay out of Amare & Melo's way. He played some solid team defense and helped limit KG but I'd have a bitter taste in my mouth if it weren't for him being in the right place at the right time.

Jermaine O'Neal
STATS: 4 Rebounds, 1 Assist, 3 Steals, 22 Minutes
SHOTS: 0-1 FG
NEGATIVE: 1 Foul

Like Turiaf, O'Neal got out of the way and focused on defense and rebounding. 3 steals in 22 minutes for O'Neal is a lot considering he only had 2 steals the entire season (458 minutes). Boston had 18 steals to my 6, which is ultimately what kept them in the game despite my 58% shooting to their 48%. I was pretty careful with my passing aside from one stint late in the 4th where I turned it over 3 straight times, so I don't know what one can really do to cut back on the CPU's success on this end. Obviously the Celtics are a good defensive team and get lots of steals, but not from Jermaine O'Neal (0.2 STL% last season).

Toney Douglas
STATS: 7 Points, 3 Rebounds, 10 Assists, 3 Blocks, 33 Minutes
SHOTS: 1-2 FG, 0-1 3PT, 5-6 FT
NEGATIVE: 9 Turnovers, 2 Fouls

Douglas with the **** 1.11 A/T ratio. His low pass rating probably had something to do with passes getting picked, as Billups had no problem making those same passes. Unlike Billups however, Douglas had no problem keeping Rondo in front as evidenced by his 3 blocks. Believe it or not, Douglas actually lead the team in Plus/Minus with +8 while Billups was -5. Now that I mention it, I did say Rondo was 1-6 in the 4th and OT (including 0-4 in OT which Douglas played all of) so really, we saw the best and worst of the Knick PGs. Both have to be used differently. 2K's playcalling system doesn't do a great job of recognizing this. One thing I definitely would have done if I were calling the shots would be to use Douglas in the Pick and Roll more with Amare rather than exclusively featuring Melo every time down, even if Melo was having his way offensively (when he actually got the ball - hence the reason why Douglas is best used in P/R situations).

Jeff Green
STATS: 5 Points, 4 Rebounds, 2 Steals, 26 Minutes
SHOTS: 1-3 FG, 3-4 FT
NEGATIVE: 1 Foul

Not much to say about Green's performance except that he stayed out of the way. He posted up a few times with Pierce out of the game but he's not a big time scorer. His lone basket came on a fastbreak.

Jared Jeffries
STATS: 4 Points, 5 Rebounds, 2 Steals
SHOTS: 1-1 FG, 2-4 FT
NEGATIVE: N/A

Jeffries is only 58 overall but still found a way to impact the game, be it coming up with a loose ball underneath or helping out on the defensive end. In typical Knick fan fashion, I found myself screaming at the TV anytime Jeffries came up with a ball and was timid about going up for a shot (resulting in a drawn foul). Part of that is my stick control, the other is just the shock from the CPU not coming up with the loose ball.

Glen Davis
STATS: 4 Points, 6 Rebounds, 3 Assists, 1 Block, 22 Minutes
SHOTS: 2-4 FG, 0-1 3PT
NEGATIVE: 2 Fouls

Like most opponents, I didn't really care when Davis had the ball on the perimeter, though he inexplicably was able to blow by Amare on the baseline (w/ Amare sagging off!) thanks to the game's unresponsive defensive controls.

THE REST
Bill Walker: 2 Points, 3 Rebounds, 1 Block, 13 Minutes (1-2 FG, 0-1 3PT)
Shawne Williams: 2 Rebounds, 1 Foul, 10 Minutes (0-2 FG, 0-1 3PT)
Iman Shumpert: 3 Points, 1 Turnover, 1 Foul, 6 Minutes (1-1 FG, 1-1 3PT)
Delonte West: 5 Points, 2 Rebounds, 2 Assists, 1 Foul, 16 Minutes (2-4 FG, 1-2 FT)
JaJuan Johnson: 4 Poinrs, 3 Rebounds, 11 Minutes (2-4 FG)
Avery Bradley: 4 Points, 2 Rebounds, 2 Assists, 5 Minutes (2-2 FG)

SUMMARY
This was a great gaming experience for me as it was a realistic and back and forth game with some huge highlights for both teams. I can live with some of the CPU's steals since I was playing the Celtics and most came against a guy who really can't run the point, and even the Knicks' defensive mistakes by the CPU (it IS the Knicks we're talking about). One major concern however is how many steals the CPU had when they weren't even reaching for the ball. Turning up that slider would probably make me want to rip my hair out (though it would also lead to more steals on my end). I also would have liked to see more P/R play from the Celtics which can be attributed to the "Look for Post Players" slider being increased on the Simulation slider set (that certainly isn't a player tendency issue however).

I was basically able to shut down Boston's halfcourt offense (aside from Pierce) but those fastbreaks simply killed me. Celtics had 64 Points in the Paint, 22 Fastbreak Points, and 28 Points off Turnovers. They shot 48% from the field, but when you factor in how many of those baskets came on the break, I did a much better defensive job than the numbers showed. When the CPU wasn't forcing turnovers, I more or less took them to town with my superior shot selection (58% from the field and 7-11 on threes). The game was ONLY close because I had 15 more turnovers than they did.

All told however, this was one of the most realistic NBA experiences I have ever played, and a big improvement over what we were seeing with the default rosters. I'm looking forward to working on the other 28 teams. I will also upload the roster right now (it is on the 360) so you guys can download and try it out for yourselves (remember: only the Knicks and Celtics are completed so far). I would love to hear your results.

Remember to check his blog and twitter comment sections as there are usually plenty of additional insights ... also, do it if you have some suggestions/feedback/claims/questions that you would like to share to him.

[ocho cuatro]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

I'll play a Celts vs Knicks game later today and let you know how it goes.

[keshunleon]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

I have really enjoyed Rashidi rosters in the past and 2K12 is good also but I wish someone would take his completed roster and Hex edit the rookie faces, shoes, and accessories...

[lkasprzak]

Re: The Real 2K12 Insider: Rashidi ...

THIS!

10 char