Player/Team Ratings are up

[ZigZag]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

I THINK THE RATINGS ARE OFF CUZ OF THE CERTAIN AREA'S OF SKILL ARE DIFFERENT FOR EACH PLAYER.

[CMH]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

Ok, you made a really long post defending it and I respect that, but out of all honesty, the roster ratings still suck to me and there is no complicated explanation behind EA's method. It's just that they took no time with the rosters or they don't know basketball as well as they should if they're making an NBA game.

The Raptors are a very skilled team, stacked with guys who can all play from 1 through 15, made the play-offs, and yet they are the 3rd worst team in the NBA? That means that EA thinks the Atlanta Hawks, Minnesota Timberwolves, Portland Trailblazers, Memphis Grizzlies, Seattle Supersonics, AND Philadelphia 76ers have more skilled rosters than the Raptors. Look at their rosters, and look at the teams the Raptors beat last year and please tell me how that makes sense.

Also the Magic, who made it to the play-offs last year, AND added Rashard Lewis are the second worst team in the NBA? EA better stay away from Dwight Howard.

It's very possible that the teams above do have more skilled players but then again those skilled players may all be a 76 rated together.

Whereas in Toronto you probably have three guys in the mid 80s with a bunch of bench players somewhere below 76 but above 70.

So, it could (I didn't do the math but maybe you get the point) lower a team's overall compared to another. But, when it's all said and done those 80 overall players will be the difference in a basketball game against another team.

[Chi Dynasty12]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

If that's the case, they should have done what madden has done, where they judge each team from the big picture and rate it.

[CMH]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

If that's the case, they should have done what madden has done, where they judge each team from the big picture and rate it.

I agree that it's easier that way to understand what team is better than the other.

But then again, it really doesn't matter so long as the team that should win wins.

Either way, you'll get the positive and negative of the ratings. If teams were weighted on an overall system predetermined by the developers that did little to weigh in overall ratings of the players on the roster then you could have a similar problem. Now that team with an 88 ratings might not make the playoffs while the 82 does because the developers thought the Raptors should be rated higher than the 76ers*.

*only an example that obviously doesn't hold much water when comparing those two teams.

[evarts2616]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

Duncan is the highest rated center in the game at 91 overall.

Why is anyone getting upset with his overall rating when Live takes into account dribbling, speed, passing and outside shooting things of that nature in their game. Surely no one thinks Duncan should get very high ratings in all those categories along with quite a few others that Live has in their game.

That is most likley the reason why he's not rated higher higher than a 91 overall. I'm sure the ratings that really pertain to Duncan like Inside scoring, rebounding, defensive awareness and shot blocking are all sky high.

[stephensonmc]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

Ok, you made a really long post defending it and I respect that, but out of all honesty, the roster ratings still suck to me and there is no complicated explanation behind EA's method. It's just that they took no time with the rosters or they don't know basketball as well as they should if they're making an NBA game.

The Raptors are a very skilled team, stacked with guys who can all play from 1 through 15, made the play-offs, and yet they are the 3rd worst team in the NBA? That means that EA thinks the Atlanta Hawks, Minnesota Timberwolves, Portland Trailblazers, Memphis Grizzlies, Seattle Supersonics, AND Philadelphia 76ers have more skilled rosters than the Raptors. Look at their rosters, and look at the teams the Raptors beat last year and please tell me how that makes sense.

Also the Magic, who made it to the play-offs last year, AND added Rashard Lewis are the second worst team in the NBA? EA better stay away from Dwight Howard.

I totally understand your point man. I can assure you though that the Raptors are a a favorite to play with around the office because Bosh is awesome in the game. Even though the overall team rating isn't the best, the players make that irrelevent.

[CMH]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

Duncan is the highest rated center in the game at 91 overall.

Why is anyone getting upset with his overall rating when Live takes into account dribbling, speed, passing and outside shooting things of that nature in their game. Surely no one thinks Duncan should get very high ratings in all those categories along with quite a few others that Live has in their game.

That is most likley the reason why he's not rated higher higher than a 91 overall. I'm sure the ratings that really pertain to Duncan like Inside scoring, rebounding, defensive awareness and shot blocking are all sky high.

And they are.

It's a bad basketball, anyway, to compare Duncan to a Kobe Bryant. They play two different positions and have two different skill sets.

If Duncan is the highest rated center in NBA Live then that automatically proves Duncan's worth inside. In fact, for Duncan to get a 91 rating when things like dribbling, speed, and outside shooting are factors says a lot about his ability in the game. Kobe is basically 4 points higher than him and Kobe should have better dribbling, speed, outside shooting ratings.

So, doesn't that in some ways say that Duncan is one of the best players in NBA Live? I think so.

[CMH]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

The main issue now is that how does the game look at the Raptors in Franchise mode.......... with the new system the AI uses to determine what kind of team it has, does it say the Raptors are rebuilding since in the game since they have among the lowest overall? Does it look at other equations and conclude that the Raptors are not rebuilding despite the 69 overall? And if so, why is that equation not placed at the forefront instead of the system they have now?

I ignored this question when talking about ratings and it shouldn't be ignored.

It's a very good question and one I would love to see addressed before the game is released.

I get the feeling however that it isn't exactly the type of thing that would be answered.

My gut feeling tells me that a team like the Raptors would realize they have Chris Bosh, Bargnani, and T.J. Ford and not see themselves in a rebuilding stage. Bosh alone says they can compete.

But that of course depends on how intelligent the talent evaluating AI is in Live so it can make these rebuilding/competitive decisions.

[J_Posse]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

I understand that EA's systems rates players individually based on their "skillset," but that doesn't explain why position-by-position "skills" aren't included (sorry for the double negative)?Obviously, skills like ball-handling, passing and quickness mean less to a center and more to a point guard. So, why doesn't that factor in at least a little with these ratings?

Side-note: Other than speed and quickness, Timmy is one of the best big men passing, has underrated ball-handling skills and is above average in quickness/speed (for a center, which he isn't). So, those can't be a justification for why EA (always) rates him so low, IMO.

Why are so many players placed/rated at the incorrect position (Caron Butler, Jason Terry, Tim Duncan, Boris Diaw, Nene', Dwight Howard, Andre Iguodala, Randy Foye, Steve Francis, and Allen Iverson)? Shouldn't these be their secondary positions and not primary?

[betterthanmagic]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

dood if you hate them so much, when you get the game, just change them
damn
its not that hard

[CMH]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

I understand that EA's systems rates players individually based on their "skillset," but that doesn't explain why position-by-position "skills" aren't included (sorry for the double negative)?Obviously, skills like ball-handling, passing and quickness mean less to a center and more to a point guard. So, why doesn't that factor in at least a little with these ratings?

Side-note: Other than speed and quickness, Timmy is one of the best big men passing, has underrated ball-handling skills and is above average in quickness/speed (for a center, which he isn't). So, those can't be a justification for why EA (always) rates him so low, IMO.

Why are so many players placed/rated at the incorrect position (Caron Butler, Jason Terry, Tim Duncan, Boris Diaw, Nene', Dwight Howard, Andre Iguodala, Randy Foye, Steve Francis, and Allen Iverson)? Shouldn't these be their secondary positions and not primary?

A 91 is low? Tim Duncan is the best rated center in the game so obviously EA got something right.

The overall ratings are an average of every attribute. No matter how good Duncan's ballhandling may be it's not as good as Kobe's. But the reason Duncan is the best center in the game is because it's damn near better than most centers in the league so his average is higher.

I mean we're talking about a number here. The 91 rating is basically equivalent to the old system that would give Duncan a 97 rating in NBA Live 2002. The only difference here is that the number is now an average rather than some arbitrary number based on nothing. The ratings aren't low. They are right.

(or as close to right as an unbiased developer can try to be)

[J_Posse]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

A 91 is low? Tim Duncan is the best rated center in the game so obviously EA got something right.

The overall ratings are an average of every attribute. No matter how good Duncan's ballhandling may be it's not as good as Kobe's. But the reason Duncan is the best center in the game is because it's damn near better than most centers in the league so his average is higher.

I mean we're talking about a number here. The 91 rating is basically equivalent to the old system that would give Duncan a 97 rating in NBA Live 2002. The only difference here is that the number is now an average rather than some arbitrary number based on nothing. The ratings aren't low. They are right.

(or as close to right as an unbiased developer can try to be)

That still doesn't explain, and I realize you can't answer the question, why the system isn't weighted by a position-by-position manner. It's ridiculous in my opinion to rate players "universally" and on an individual basis, without taking into account that all five positions generally demand different skills. I think Timmy's rating is fairly good, especially compared to his rating in past Live's (89 ovl. in Live '05) and that they don't factor in intangibles.

Yet, are they truly making all players "accurately" rated, or only the star/superstar-level players? I haven't played Live (last-gen played, current haven't) in awhile, so are they still devaluing (giving lower ratings proposely) to starter and role-player level players to keep their overall ratings down?

[Gibbz]

Re: Player/Team Ratings are up

Raptors the 3rd worst team in the league?

Rockets>Spurs?

Duncan=Arenas?

Arenas>Nash & Kidd?


Awesome ratings...