Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

[kumamae_33]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

...and we are doing some really cool stuff for 11.

I hope that in Live 11, players will no longer do a razzle dazzle dunk when dunking in traffic coz in Live 10 it looks so arcadish when a player does a razzle dazzle dunk when dunking in traffic. Razzle dazzle dunks should only happen when a player is wide open. Also the alley-op animations in Live 10 are awful.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

It's tough to go back and critique previous games as a developer. I only worked on 09/10. All I can say is nobody wants to make a bad game, but sometimes the best intentions and the best feature ideas don't turn out the way you hoped. That said, I'm really proud of 10, and we are doing some really cool stuff for 11.

Looking forward to it.

Live '10 had a lot of encouraging things and was a fun game.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

I still say that NBA Live 06 had the best pre-game intro..with the starting 5 introductions.

The arena also had a kind of foggy effect for the first minute or so, as the lighting and pyrotechnics wore off.

I still think the 06 pre-game intro is sweet as hell lol

[travis72]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

While it was fun to play I was very dissapointed. Her are some issues that better be fixed or I will be done with Live just like i dont play EA football games no more.

1 Dynasty mode overhauled
2 sim stats
3 post play
4 Post guys like Howard scoring 9 pts a game in Dynasty mode,( come on )
5 Actually try to put out a game where we as consumers get what we pay for and not have to wait for a patch to enjoy a game.

By the way I agree with jrose I never could get into dynamic season. i do know some enjoy it thou. DNA is a good idea that needs to be tweaked. I don't understand how guys like shaq, and howard could have anything but a 0 for 3pt likelyhood but of course that was not the case. Also guys with 99 likelythood to shoot 3's that was making for some crazy 3pt fg attempts in dynasty mode.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

While it was fun to play I was very dissapointed. Her are some issues that better be fixed or I will be done with Live just like i dont play EA football games no more.

1 Dynasty mode overhauled
2 sim stats
3 post play
4 Post guys like Howard scoring 9 pts a game in Dynasty mode,( come on )
5 Actually try to put out a game where we as consumers get what we pay for and not have to wait for a patch to enjoy a game.

By the way I agree with jrose I never could get into dynamic season. i do know some enjoy it thou. DNA is a good idea that needs to be tweaked. I don't understand how guys like shaq, and howard could have anything but a 0 for 3pt likelyhood but of course that was not the case. Also guys with 99 likelythood to shoot 3's that was making for some crazy 3pt fg attempts in dynasty mode.

#2 is pointless, I don't sim games, I play them through. I would like CPU vs CPU games to come out with realistic results, but I don't start a Dynasty to sim through it and see if I can get real results its pointless. I want the CPU to react as if it's playing a human. Live 10 out the box on 12 minute quarters game realistic results and the same thing in Dynamic Season post patch. On All-Star level...

#5 Good luck, we live in the age of patching games. Not just sports but all games. Live 10 played fine pre-patch and only had a couple things wrong, that weren't game killers, fixing those issues made a bigger mess.

But there will never be a game period that in the long term won't need a patch. Minus Mass Effect and Bioshock..lol

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

#2 is pointless, I don't sim games, I play them through. I would like CPU vs CPU games to come out with realistic results, but I don't start a Dynasty to sim through it and see if I can get real results its pointless. I want the CPU to react as if it's playing a human. Live 10 out the box on 12 minute quarters game realistic results and the same thing in Dynamic Season post patch. On All-Star level...

#5 Good luck, we live in the age of patching games. Not just sports but all games. Live 10 played fine pre-patch and only had a couple things wrong, that weren't game killers, fixing those issues made a bigger mess.

But there will never be a game period that in the long term won't need a patch. Minus Mass Effect and Bioshock..lol

On your first point: "Pointless" to YOU. Perhaps, but the fact is, the sim engine is broken, period. Sim stats are WAY off, the ratings look like my niece (she's 5) came up with them (why Shaq & Howard have three point tendencies above 0, let alone 10, escapes reality). I have given up on two seasons (one with the Heat, one with Rockets) simply because I can't gather ANY illusion of realism without looking at League Leaders and seeing Bron with a stat line of 18, 4 rpg 3 apg, or Melo avg'ing 16 & 4. BROKEN, whether it's pointless or not in one's "personal" preference.

Your second point: There is NO excuse for releasing games completely unfinished, and missing whole components, (can only play 82 games? No rotation by mins? NO SIG STYLE ON PERIMETER OR POST?) five years into this "next gen." What's even more unforgivable, is releasing patches post release that do more HARM than GOOD. And just as unforgivable, or close to it, is having people with the actual nerve to defend this practice and be WILLING beta testers. At the very least, they could have took a cue from 2K and released a mega patch that actually fixed the major issues.

Come on now, this game is LIGHT YEARS behind the competition, and it's reached a consensus by now. EA needs to know this, so they can finally get serious about competing at least once this gen.

But, on the videos, it's clear there's progression over the years. Personally, none of these were playable till Live 10, (06: Camera, and no modes whatsoever... 07: No words for it... 08: Stiff animations, net/rim interactions, wonky physics... 09: One trajectory for makes? Game breaker for me personally. Skinny players, awkward defender rubber band D. Some good sig stuff though, esp down low.

But I do think with Live 10, they have a solid ground to stand on and work from there.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

On your first point: "Pointless" to YOU. Perhaps, but the fact is, the sim engine is broken, period. Sim stats are WAY off, the ratings look like my niece (she's 5) came up with them (why Shaq & Howard have three point tendencies above 0, let alone 10, escapes reality). I have given up on two seasons (one with the Heat, one with Rockets) simply because I can't gather ANY illusion of realism without looking at League Leaders and seeing Bron with a stat line of 18, 4 rpg 3 apg, or Melo avg'ing 16 & 4. BROKEN, whether it's pointless or not in one's "personal" preference.

Your second point: There is NO excuse for releasing games completely unfinished, and missing whole components, (can only play 82 games? No rotation by mins? NO SIG STYLE ON PERIMETER OR POST?) five years into this "next gen." What's even more unforgivable, is releasing patches post release that do more HARM than GOOD. And just as unforgivable, or close to it, is having people with the actual nerve to defend this practice and be WILLING beta testers. At the very least, they could have took a cue from 2K and released a mega patch that actually fixed the major issues.

Come on now, this game is LIGHT YEARS behind the competition, and it's reached a consensus by now. EA needs to know this, so they can finally get serious about competing at least once this gen.

But, on the videos, it's clear there's progression over the years. Personally, none of these were playable till Live 10, (06: Camera, and no modes whatsoever... 07: No words for it... 08: Stiff animations, net/rim interactions, wonky physics... 09: One trajectory for makes? Game breaker for me personally. Skinny players, awkward defender rubber band D. Some good sig stuff though, esp down low.

But I do think with Live 10, they have a solid ground to stand on and work from there.

Animations is a complete level of programming, not a patch issue...The game is made as it is....Live series has lacked animations since PS2, that is nothing new. Nor am I justifying it as being okay! Hell I hate the stiffness of the players, is it a game killer no, because the animations that are available are just fine, do they need more, hell yes! Like 100x more.

Signature moves is another thing, that can't be patched or to make a game better. Signature moves should be programmed off the base level of the game. Not a patch issue, so it's also irrelevant to the question of patching.

Does this game need the signature stuff, you bet your arse it does...09 seemed to have signature jumpers and then in 10 they were gone. I think only around 24 to 26 players kept somewhat of some signature stuff in Live 10.

And Live 10 wasn't broken out the box, it was a great game out the box. Trying to patch a few things jacked it up.

Playing 82 games is another thing, that isn't a issue with the subject of patching.

Last time I checked the official rules of a NBA season is a 82 game schedule. I don't see why so many people are whining about this, and then want to talk about realistic stats, etc.

I mean is playing a 24 games season or a 32 game season, going to give you realistic stats, compared to the real NBA. NOPE!!!!

Because the real NBA plays 82 games. I mean that's like asking NFL 2k5 and Madden to only allow a 6 game season mode. I mean really! Or a 30 game season in MLB when they play over a 100 games.

I think we all want the same things to a certain aspect. Mainly more animations, but we want animations to work, not take complete control of our players like in the other game. To talk about player models, I think Live 10's models are the best in a long time and are also the most realistic with muscle tone, structure, and skin textures. I think face modeling can be done a heck of a lot better. Especially when it comes to eyes, nose, and lips details. And forehead structures make a difference with eyebrows.

See we all agree on a few things, but really need to focus on whats important.

82 games in a Dynasty is realistic, now lets add real practice modes, real trades, drafts, off season contract negotiations, D-League movements and games, it's part of the NBA put it in the game. Real life injuries and reports.

Better commentary that expands with the season, meaning it changes based off stats during the game we are playing. REAL Dynamic commentary.

Half Time Show, Post game, Nightly wrapups, real playoffs bracket breakdowns with really ESPN / ABC presentation...let's get it done...

Post game with realistic movement, up and unders, backdowns, etc.

[sportyguyfl31]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

In the mes that was Live 07, there was one thing they did right, that they kind of forgot about.

Size/Weight.

IF you look at the clip, there's a posession where Devin Harris goes into the lane and smacks into the PF.

Harris stumbles backwards and loses the ball.

They need to bring that back.

[travis72]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

#2 is pointless, I don't sim games, I play them through. I would like CPU vs CPU games to come out with realistic results, but I don't start a Dynasty to sim through it and see if I can get real results its pointless. I want the CPU to react as if it's playing a human. Live 10 out the box on 12 minute quarters game realistic results and the same thing in Dynamic Season post patch. On All-Star level...

#5 Good luck, we live in the age of patching games. Not just sports but all games. Live 10 played fine pre-patch and only had a couple things wrong, that weren't game killers, fixing those issues made a bigger mess.

But there will never be a game period that in the long term won't need a patch. Minus Mass Effect and Bioshock..lol

I for one don't go into dynasty mode and sim all games. I play the majority of my teams games. Actually the only reason I ever sim any of my games is to hopefully get some injuries since EA cant seem to figure out how to have in-game injuries. If you play dynasty mode and know anything about basketball you know that team statistics are way off.
1. Team scoring is bonkers
2 to many individual 3 pt attempts
3 bigs not having a high enough scoring average.
4 off. rebounds to few of them

Now how is that pointless? I'm sure that 99% of the dynasty players would not consider that pointless.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

I for one don't go into dynasty mode and sim all games. I play the majority of my teams games. Actually the only reason I ever sim any of my games is to hopefully get some injuries since EA cant seem to figure out how to have in-game injuries. If you play dynasty mode and know anything about basketball you know that team statistics are way off.
1. Team scoring is bonkers
2 to many individual 3 pt attempts
3 bigs not having a high enough scoring average.
4 off. rebounds to few of them

Now how is that pointless? I'm sure that 99% of the dynasty players would not consider that pointless.

1,2,3,4 and all are messed up off and on....I remember starting one Dynasty and it was jacked up, started another one and the stats were fine. I think sometimes it glitches good and bad results.

Again I won't justify them being unrealistic. As I've yet to see any sports title get it right. Live team does need to find a solution with the cpu coding and get them to be close to realistic in Live 11, that is for sure.

Overall I don't disagree with you post..

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

Come on man. We have to let go of any "personal" feelings toward this game at some point, in favor of plain "keeping it real."

It's NOT off and on, the sim stats during seasons, not only when you are simming, are BROKEN. I was in several season attempts, with diff teams, and every single time the sim stats were WAY off. Even in cases where you'll get the Lebrons and Kobes getting their proper numbers, you will without a doubt see PLENTY of unrealistic stats, and it kills any sense of realism.

Dwight avg'ed 9.2 ppg in one season, while Kobe was avg'ing 29 and 6 apg. Okay, fine right? But in the same season, Melo's avg'ing just 17 ppg and 3 boards.... My season with the Nuggets, yeah my stats were great in games I played. Dwight was beasting with a double double per game. But Bron was avg'ing 18 ppg like 4 rpg and 2.3 apg. Bosh avg'ing 5 rpg. Listen man, it's broken. Let's take solice though, in that EA has acknowledged as much and is focusing on it for next year.

And the 82 games thing is NOT subjective. The season length has been editable since PS1 on most bball games. A lot of us work OT in our jobs, and not to mention girlfriends, other games, systems, etc. I don't have time for a 100-plus game season. Letting us play 56 or 28 games may not be an issue to YOU (emphasis on YOU), but it's needed and its omission screams lack of priorities for yet another year.

I just finished a massive project where I imported edited clips for every arena and specific players in the "other" game, to the point where while playing I'm fully immersed in the game and it sounds unbelievable. Playing a 56 game season, Bron is getting numbers close to what he's getting IRL, so is Dwight, and so is Melo. Even Durant is challenging my Wade for the scoring chip, and the announcers are talking about my stats from last game, and stats from games around the league in MY CURRENT season.

And here we are debating the usefulness of editable season lengths in Live 10. The gap is wide as it's ever been, so sugarcoating the myriad of issues with Live won't help EA, or any of us.

[Behindshadows]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

Come on man. We have to let go of any "personal" feelings toward this game at some point, in favor of plain "keeping it real."

Comments like this are still funny to me, so the fact that I can enjoy this game for what it is! Makes me have personal feelings...that's laughable. I'm just not nitpicking every corner of it, and I'm not about to let what isn't in the game and what isn't going to be in the game, ruin my enjoyment for it right now.

There are dozens of things I like and dislike about Live 10, as I've pointed them out many times. Does my dislikes take away from my enjoyment of it, no it doesn't.

There are dozens and dozens of things I dislike about 2k10, as I've also pointed out, but does it ruin my experience? No! Both games have their issues, but overall I still have 2 solid games to play my NBA season.

Do I favor Live 10 more, yes! Because it's more solid to me, and it's fresh and feels like a different game, and I continue to see new things every time I play it. Even though now I don't have my 360 going on the 4th day!

I itch everyday to play Dynamic Season and to get a online match in with a friend or two. For a game that is broken to so many, 4 days without it, is killing me.

Don't misjudge favoring a game, fanboyism, and personal feelings mislead you.

I know the game has it's issues, I also know that what was done in 1 year is amazing, don't forget that area. For what was broken in older game they fixed in 10 months. I think the patches did ruin a few things in this game. And no I didn't forget the alien players, generic rookies, and I definitely didn't overlook the cpu simulated game scores of 50 to 68, etc. Nobody scores that low in the NBA. I look at the scoring leaders, etc. And I'm like WTF!!! Some of the players suck, also players who get scoring leader awards, etc are all wrong and no way in hell.

Some how Dirk and Wade seem to be winners every time...lol

I don't have personal feelings, I just know that what is available isn't a complete bust, as some continue to try to make it.

But I agree with you a lot of things need to be adjusted, smoothed out and implemented into Live 11, or like some have said. I will not look past it and will forget Live series just like I did Sony's lame NBA series.

[HOLLIDAY1183]

Re: Live Next Gen The Series and it's Direction!

Alright you know what, after reading my past posts, I feel the need to fall back a bit and acknowledge the progress Live has made a little more. I certainly don't want anyone to interpret it as "bashing" Live or anything. My only point is, we can't minimize a complaint that has reached widespread consensus on the grounds it doesn't bother us personally. Some of these modes/features needed to be in Live 08, let alone '10.

Live is worlds better than the "other" game in terms of being in control of your player. And Hum vs Hum games are second to none IMO, because the flow and atmosphere, along with the controls, make it such a blast to go at it against another person. Actually, to be honest, I wouldn't have traded it in if my boy who was staying with me didn't move back upstate, or if ranked games were on SS. Because literally no other game touched my 360 from launch till like late Nov, we had some EPIC battles Suns or Cavs (him) vs my Heat.

I do like what they did on the perimeter this year, I think all they have to do is add tons of sig stuff to it, and then implement a similar system down low. Even though I traded it in, Live 11 is still very much on my radar to see if they build on this year's effort. I'm actually already regretting it, seeing the results 23 is getting with his tweaks over in his thread, and if that continues I'm picking it back up (been watching that thread like a hawk lol).

I really hope EA realized the potential they have with this game. Personally, it went from "unplayable" to "never leave the disc drive" in one year, until the patches and AI stuff started becoming glaring vs the CPU.

One thing those vids bring to light is, Live is DEFINITELY progressing in the right direction. 07 & 08 were just a mess.