If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

[shutdown10]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I'm providing my feedback through a public forum here.

It's much more helpful than saying "This game sucks..." "RIP Live".... "2k all the way".

What do those type of comments do? Nothing. If you all want to play the game, and post some thoughts on how to expand and make the game better, then by all means, do so.

What I see, is what I'm posting on. That's it. EASports_AJ is here on OS, and taking things to the dev team. I'm posting constructive criticisms both here and in private through several different channels.

I don't want what 2k is offering right now. Do I wish Live had their graphics? For the most part, yes. Do I wish they had their animations? For the most part, yes, UNLESS it was at the sacrifice of gameplay.

Feel free to disagree. But don't bash other members for seeing something differently than you do. And don't tell me to "help" the EA Sports team by not sharing my feelings on the game. If I'm sharing my thoughts, and it's what appeals to "me", then I'm content. I'm not in the majority, and I'll take that. I want a dynamic basketball game. I don't want a game that I know the outcome before I finish the game.

I'm not bashing you or any member on this forum about EA's ongoing issues with this franchise. I just wanted to see if you were doing your part to make sure this game improves. If you believe in something, then you do what is necessary to see it improve. I read this review the other day about what EA needs to do to be successful with this franchise again. The review said that EA would have to give their community and consumers more open feedback if they want to survive. I understand that they are watching these threads from the shadows, but what is that going to do for this franchise going forward? One thing I like about Live 10's team is that they were on this forum consistently providing open feedback with us. I was just a lurker back then, but I observed and respected what Mike Wang did on this forum for Live 10. It is vital that the new Live team connect with their community going forward. We must pound it in their heads that they need to actively communicate with us or never receive consumer trust. They cannot hide what they are working on any longer from this point on. I want success for them, but when are they finally going to deliver?

[NoTiCe_O]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I'm sorry, but how do you come to this conclusion? I see no basis for this. I've seen very little PvP Live gameplay that would support any such claim. And all anyone has posted here has been the six Live zealots posting sandbox videos and how the more they play it, the more they love it. (I call these the "Jedi Mind-trick" posts) Those are funny. But how in the world is Live so "skill based" (da-hell does that even mean, anyway)? I'm not saying you're wrong. I just want to know what makes you feel this claim is valid.

The bottom line of the OP is that this was their chance to make up ground. And whether you like the game or not, the fact remains that the game is failing. It doesn't matter if you think it's a good game. If the vast majority of gamers don't want a game that is your idea of "good", then you won't have a game. It should also tell you that you need to reevaluate your sense of judgement, frankly.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not. I've actually researched, been on twitch watching streams and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've watched games where a guy was up 70-8 going into the fourth quarter simply because he knew what he was doing and his opponent didn't. I've seen a game where a guy tried to hop step cheese a victory with LeBron and a basketball minded gamer decided to change up his strategy and the cheeser was completely shut down.

Just watching online games you can tell there is a definite difference between people who know what they're doing and people who are just playing. It's the only reason I compared the game to Street Fighter earlier because when watching street fighter you can who's highly skilled, who's alright, and who's just button mashing. It's the same thing with Live. I've seen the guys who have the bouncetek, post game, shooting, pick and roll, and defense all together just demolish folks. I say it's skilled because you could be good at one of the previous mentioned areas but a well rounded player is good at it all. It's not scripted outcomes but rather stick skill and basketball knowledge that will get you the victory.

I've played 2k14 next gen and I can say the gameplay is still very cheesable. Meaning there's just certain things that are going to happen if you want them to, it's not as free flowing as Live and essentially you get luck plays every now and then. In Live if someone knows what he is doing he can SHUT YOU DOWN! Like it should be. Just like if I'm playing Street Fighter and I know what I'm doing and you don't you're going to get whooped, it's not even a question.

In 2k there's shots that you know will be more high percentage than others no matter the contest, in Live you can be more satisfied on defense knowing that if you have the stick skills to control your defense correctly you'll be rewarded because the shots aren't just falling because the game says so, but it's more based on what you're doing to stop the opponent. Are you sending doubles? Are you going over the screen or under? Are you full court pressing or staying back? Zone or Man? I've seen all these strategies make a significant difference in Live to the point where the opponent panic's and just starts messing up.

I don't get the same vibe from 2k, it's more flashy and just a really pretty game of basketball, but the same grind to win isn't there, at least not without feeling like you got jipped. The main difference I see between Live and 2k is that if you lose in Live it's still satisfying because you know you were the cause of the loss. In 2k when you lose most times you it's because a certain animation didn't go your way at a certain point, or someone was abusing a certain animation, and instead of trying to beat someone with basketball strategy you're worrying about stopping a certain animation.

Also, I still don't get why people are bringing up the "Well the fact that you like the game isn't going to make it sell better, it's still doing terrible." argument. I mean are we consumers or producers, are you the one making the game and getting royalties, no, so why do you care how well it's selling, is that really a concern of yours when buying a game? "Hmm, Well I wonder if the games gonna sell? Hmm, probably not I'll pass." Really? Enjoy what you like and don't let figures decide what you enjoy. If that's the case most of you people probably have an iPad, iPhone, iMac, and some of the other hottest not neccsarily greatest gadgets because "They're selling well, or they're popular"

Sorry but I'm not the guy that follows the trends I buy what I like and enjoy, and if it happens to be Live then let it be. Fact of the matter is the game is very skill based whether you decide to see it or not.

I'm really not one to argue over the forums but I just have to speak my mind, I also respect WTF's opinion because he clearly can see the basketball aspects of the game that make it fun and isn't just saying he likes it for attention or something. The game s legitimately fun if you'll play it right and learn it. (Also, you must have some sort of basketball knowledge to really get the most out of the game, a BASKETBALL game mind you). That's how it should be.

Don't expect a reply if you're just going to say I work for EA, or I'm a fanboy, or I'm blind or something. ( Fair Warning)

[King_B_Mack]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not. I've actually researched, been on twitch watching streams and I've seen it with my own eyes. I've watched games where a guy was up 70-8 going into the fourth quarter simply because he knew what he was doing and his opponent didn't. I've seen a game where a guy tried to hop step cheese a victory with LeBron and a basketball minded gamer decided to change up his strategy and the cheeser was completely shut down.

Just watching online games you can tell there is a definite difference between people who know what they're doing and people who are just playing. It's the only reason I compared the game to Street Fighter earlier because when watching street fighter you can who's highly skilled, who's alright, and who's just button mashing. It's the same thing with Live. I've seen the guys who have the bouncetek, post game, shooting, pick and roll, and defense all together just demolish folks. I say it's skilled because you could be good at one of the previous mentioned areas but a well rounded player is good at it all. It's not scripted outcomes but rather stick skill and basketball knowledge that will get you the victory.

I've played 2k14 next gen and I can say the gameplay is still very cheesable. Meaning there's just certain things that are going to happen if you want them to, it's not as free flowing as Live and essentially you get luck plays every now and then. In Live if someone knows what he is doing he can SHUT YOU DOWN! Like it should be. Just like if I'm playing Street Fighter and I know what I'm doing and you don't you're going to get whooped, it's not even a question.

In 2k there's shots that you know will be more high percentage than others no matter the contest, in Live you can be more satisfied on defense knowing that if you have the stick skills to control your defense correctly you'll be rewarded because the shots aren't just falling because the game says so, but it's more based on what you're doing to stop the opponent. Are you sending doubles? Are you going over the screen or under? Are you full court pressing or staying back? Zone or Man? I've seen all these strategies make a significant difference in Live to the point where the opponent panic's and just starts messing up.

I don't get the same vibe from 2k, it's more flashy and just a really pretty game of basketball, but the same grind to win isn't there, at least not without feeling like you got jipped. The main difference I see between Live and 2k is that if you lose in Live it's still satisfying because you know you were the cause of the loss. In 2k when you lose most times you it's because a certain animation didn't go your way at a certain point, or someone was abusing a certain animation, and instead of trying to beat someone with basketball strategy you're worrying about stopping a certain animation.

Also, I still don't get why people are bringing up the "Well the fact that you like the game isn't going to make it sell better, it's still doing terrible." argument. I mean are we consumers or producers, are you the one making the game and getting royalties, no, so why do you care how well it's selling, is that really a concern of yours when buying a game? "Hmm, Well I wonder if the games gonna sell? Hmm, probably not I'll pass." Really? Enjoy what you like and don't let figures decide what you enjoy. If that's the case most of you people probably have an iPad, iPhone, iMac, and some of the other hottest not neccsarily greatest gadgets because "They're selling well, or they're popular"

Sorry but I'm not the guy that follows the trends I buy what I like and enjoy, and if it happens to be Live then let it be. Fact of the matter is the game is very skill based whether you decide to see it or not.

I'm really not one to argue over the forums but I just have to speak my mind, I also respect WTF's opinion because he clearly can see the basketball aspects of the game that make it fun and isn't just saying he likes it for attention or something. The game s legitimately fun if you'll play it right and learn it. (Also, you must have some sort of basketball knowledge to really get the most out of the game, a BASKETBALL game mind you). That's how it should be.

Don't expect a reply if you're just going to say I work for EA, or I'm a fanboy, or I'm blind or something. ( Fair Warning)

C'mon son. C'mon.

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

Well unlike you I haven't let a few videos and posts on a public forum decide my decision of whether a game is good or not.

Master Jedi, again, I don't feel the need to constantly post why I like or dislike a game. "Wow! The more I play it, the more I love it. It's just so deep! Blah blah blah!"

Hey, did you forget who you're addressing? I'm the one that saw it at E3. I'm the one that got it before ship date. Four days before most of you Jedi here! So kill the sheep talk, dude. You don't know anything about how I form my opinions.

Frankly, I'm not going to respond to the rest of your post. It is full of the same Jedi assertions that have no details or examples to back them up. Not to mention the laughable comparisons to Street Fighter and 2K. No, I won't accuse you of working for EA or any of that other stuff. Why? There are thousands of rabid fans out there willing to eat up anything their favorite game shovels in their face. I'll just say this; all I want to hear are the details. You guys keep repeating the same thing, waiting for the brainwashing to kick in. I want to hear details. See evidence. Not clunky highlight videos that could be ripped apart at a moments notice.

So, I ask again - what are you seeing exactly that leads you to the conclusion I asked you about? It was just a question. Why so much resistance to actually answering it?

[noshun]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I dont think this game will come out next year.. its over. Live isnt even hitting FaceBreaker numbers in terms of sales. Theyve tarnished the Elite name, tarnished the Live name, reviews are brutal.. O'Brien apology letters abound.. this whole thing is deja vu.. oh last but not least the SLA's (struggle Live apologists) have to convince themselves whats happening is a facade. Theres noone to blame but those particular fans, who like the series but dont say anything..

this just doesnt bode well and weve seen this happen 3 times now since Live 07..

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I dont think this game will come out next year.. its over. Live isnt even hitting FaceBreaker numbers in terms of sales. Theyve tarnished the Elite name, tarnished the Live name, reviews are brutal.. O'Brien apology letters abound.. this whole thing is deja vu.. oh last but not least the SLA's (struggle Live apologists) have to convince themselves whats happening is a facade. Theres noone to blame but those particular fans, who like the series but dont say anything..

this just doesnt bode well and weve seen this happen 3 times now since Live 07..

I disagree man. I think EA is hell bent on at least one last go at it.

[King_B_Mack]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I disagree man. I think EA is hell bent on at least one last go at it.

You may be right, they might take another shot at it. However and I've been saying this, EA looking at improving Live 14 over "the coming weeks and months" is NOT a good sign at all. It's like when they offered updated rosters for Live 10 in light of Elite's cancellation. Pretty sure they didn't update the rosters after there was no Live 12 or after Live 13's cancellation. Track record doesn't suggest anything good coming from continuing this level of support of a game already out the door for that long on their part.

[noshun]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I disagree man. I think EA is hell bent on at least one last go at it.

possibly, but theyve wasted so much $$ since elite.. and arent even sniffing any decent recoup since. 4 times to make a 1st impression.. Live is a $ sink...

[23]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I disagree man. I think EA is hell bent on at least one last go at it.

Agreed but that's the premise of the article. If the game remains like this its over and done with for good.

A 2nd sub par effort smashed in reviews no matter how you disagree with it or say they dont matter...the youtube dudes will toast it and thats pretty much what willbe a wrap

Galaxy Note 2

[goofyballer]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I've got a clip of 2k14 that the CPU got on their rubber band, I'm going to score no matter what you do, where they drove and dished the ball through... THROUGH the crotch of 3 of my defenders in the paint, and then THROUGH the hand of my attempted block, only to score. That's not a good game. That's a scripted game.
...
I played 2k12, 2k13, I'd say for about a month. I can't take any more of the scripted style of gameplay.

Are you seriously suggesting that in 2K, the game will determine when it wants the CPU to score and just magically make all its passes/shots succeed on that possession with nothing you can do to stop it???

[Earl1963]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

Regardless of poor reviews, I like this game quite a bit more than 2k. And I hope the negative reviews don't sway EA to try and make this game like 2K. Just keep improving on what you have EA.

[El_Poopador]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I think people that desperately want to defend the game take a look at it's bad graphics and just make it up in there heads that because the graphics are so bad that the gameplay MUST be something special.

When that's just not the case.

They also boast about how the game has a learning curve and they either don't or won't acknowledge why that is. It has such a steep learning curve for all the wrong reasons. It's not because of how effectively the game represents real basketball, it's because of how slow and unnatural the players move and interact with each other. I liken it to that Superman game on Nintendo 64, that game was excessively difficult with a rigid learning curve and that sure as hell wasn't because of how good it was. It's actually kind of funny listening to people brag about how hard it is to learn the game not knowing that they're effectively aiding in arguments against the game.

It's astonishing how a game this poor in quality can continue to be determinedly defended when the people that made the game themselves are giving out public apologies. That don't happen to good games.

if you read the letter they never say its a bad game. they say they realize that people are having a hard time grasping the controls and they know the graphics arent great.

my issue with what im reading is that people are saying it doesnt resemble nba basketball but no one is offering any reasoning aside from "it looks like a ps2 game!"

the biggest thing im looking for in a basketball game is intelligent ai. i see a lot of it in live 14. i also see a lot of poor decisions from the ai but for the most part it does a good job. i see good spacing between the players. i see intelligent rotations. i see players moving without the ball to actually help the ball handler rather than moving just to be moving. that is the essence of nba basketball.

obviously the game has a long way to go. it definitely needs to improve on the graphics/player movement front. there are also a lot of areas where the ai needs improvement. the presentation and commentary needs a lot of work. but this game does a lot right. its also the first iteration for a new team. so im not expecting perfection out of the gate.

i just hope they continue with what theyre doing.

[WTF]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

Are you seriously suggesting that in 2K, the game will determine when it wants the CPU to score and just magically make all its passes/shots succeed on that possession with nothing you can do to stop it???

Yes, that's exactly what it is. I'm not the only one.

Next Gen CPU Cheating is Amazing

Plenty of these types of moments:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=1391674057744957&l=3240630994490740309

Goaltending? Nope. Was it called? Yep. It was after I stopped 3-4 instances of cheese that they were "supposed" to score. But that's for another thread. I'll be uploading the video that I took of the ball morphing through my defenders momentarily as well.

But back to NBA Live looking radically different. No matter what everyone else says, if you aren't playing the game in it's current state (NOT when the game released, NOT NBA Live 10) then you aren't seeing the game as it is today.

Dre, Sure, Synegy was implemented in NBA Live 10 and you had to do a ton of edits. What myself, and SEVERAL other members here are saying, is that you don't need to be doing those edits THIS YEAR. Yes, perhaps Synergy wasn't as evolved back in 2009 when Live 10 released. But THIS YEAR, it is a different animal. I don't feel the need to edit ANYONE thus far. The games that I'm playing are playing like I would expect to see on TV. That's not to say, that if I doubleteam Durant and/or Westbrook, that they will not find another option for the score, they will, and you'd expect them to. They will find the open man, but if you play them man to man D, expect to be hitting their spots.

If you all don't want to give it a shot, that's cool. I get it. The demo blew, hard. I get it. I don't expect anyone to run out and buy it. We've all been burned before. Am I glad I got the game? You bet.

The ONLY thing I'm wanting right now is the ability to edit accessories, sig shots/dribbles, and that's about it. I don't need to edit player ratings. I don't need to alter any sliders thus far.

I have a counter to everything that the CPU AI throws at me, if I'm smart enough to use it. I don't have random generic Points of Emphasis that people still don't know what they do. I have the ability to custom tailor an attack for each individual player on the opposing squad.

Do you think in the locker room, a coach is going to say, here is our point of Emphasis for this quarter, Play Physical. No, he's going to get up into his guys and tell them to Deny Kobe the Ball, Front Pau Gasol, double in the post if Pau gets it, play weak on the backside and slide over for help defense. Stick Nick Young, don't let him get space. Sag off of Steve Blake (injury), make him beat us from the outside, don't let him penetrate. You have the option to do that in this game. And, it works!

Points of Emphasis, Limit Perimeter Shots. What happens in reality, somehow, it causes my guys to come and double team someone with the ball on the wing, that I can't cancel out of, and the CPU kicks it to an open man in the corner.. For a Perimeter Shot.

If you fellas are happy with that type of ball game, then that's fine. I will applaud EA for everything that it's doing, sans the graphics. If this game came out swinging with the graphics of NBA 2k, or better, and with a tutorial/practice mode, you'd see a LOT more guys on the forums over here. But it doesn't look next gen. It's not pretty. But it plays a damn good game of basketball.

[Earl1963]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

I said this a million times already. The Pick & Roll is a thing of beauty, and basketball ain't basketball without it. Love the half court sets in Live, makes me feel like Chauncy Billups, a coach on the floor. The game lacks fast breaks but it more than makes up for that in the half court game.

[Boilerbuzz]

Re: If NBA Live Has a Future, It Has to Look Radically Different

Are you seriously suggesting that in 2K, the game will determine when it wants the CPU to score and just magically make all its passes/shots succeed on that possession with nothing you can do to stop it???

No, he is not suggesting it. He's straight saying it. Dudes have been crying this for a while, even though it's been debunked.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD