Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

to me kobe like i said before needs to win a chip before i can put him in at this point to me at least

kobe needs to do that if he wants to be considered one of the greatest to ever play the game, but as far as not being hall of fame material, you can go ahead and count 3 rings as his ticket to the hall.

[Brankles]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

This shouldn't even be a thread. Kobe by a long shot, and I critique Kobe as much as anyone on here.

I don't understand why it's a long shot.

Besides being on a team that won championships and scoring 81 points in a game, what has Kobe done that TMac hasn't?

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

I don't understand why it's a long shot.

Besides being on a team that won championships and scoring 81 points in a game, what has Kobe done that TMac hasn't?

haha.

[Brankles]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

haha.

lol
I know, what was I thinking.

Kobe's the best f***ing basketball player ever.

I was just seeing what response I could get if I said otherwise.


haha It's funny to even think that Kobe isn't the best. It's like being a Christian and denying the existance of God.

[Mofasa]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

I'll have to go with kobe. I dont think this season should give kobe any HUGE edge over T mac there are still pretty close. And Tmac has been injured all year (even though kobe didn't get a pass last year either...)

I just think that kobe has another level that he can go to (both off. and Def.)....he just cant do it as consistantly and at will like some players of past (MJ and Finals Shaq comes to mind) but that will come with time.

However if La makes the playoffs and they reach the 2nd round it a rap.

[Flyboy]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

lol
I know, what was I thinking.

Kobe's the best f***ing basketball player ever.

I was just seeing what response I could get if I said otherwise.


haha It's funny to even think that Kobe isn't the best. It's like being a Christian and denying the existance of God.

That's why I love OS, buddy!

[kuruption]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

I don't understand why it's a long shot.

Besides being on a team that won championships and scoring 81 points in a game, what has Kobe done that TMac hasn't?

first all-nba defensive team for like 4 or 5 years in a row. your opinion is in the minority , even in this forum. kobe is winning the poll by a landslide. most ppl feel kobe is superior , you feel otherwise.

doesnt make it right or wrong though. from the limited games i do watch featuring tmac , i see him as a great scorer. not much else. i have no hate for tmac , hes one of my fav. players . thats just how i see it.

[Brankles]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

That's why I love OS, buddy!

lmao

I would love to have an actual discussion about Kobe vs. TMac without 18 homers jumping in and talking nonsense.

There's not even a real debate going on.
Here's what I've heard from the Kobe side of the argument so far:
1.) Bryant's won three championships (A team accomplishment)

2.) Bryant's a better defender (Kobe hasn't really played that outstanding of defense in the past two seasons. TMac, if I remember correctly, completely shut down Dirk in the playoffs last year.)

3.) TMac gave up on his team (No. That's something John Weisbrod, former Orlando GM, formulated to get stupid Magic fans to support his trade for Steve Francis. I also don't get how anyone can talk bad about TMac's character when Kobe completely destroyed a dynasty single-handedly)

4.) TMac lost 19 games in a row (Kobe went 2-19 in his last 21 games at the end of the season last year... I know this hasn't been brought up yet, but it will.)

The fact that TMac led any Orlando team from the past 6 years to the playoffs speaks volumes to me.

Numbers-wise... TMac and Kobe are about equal. However, TMac is a better rebounder, more athletic, more team-oriented, a better teammate, and less of a drama-queen/team cancer.

As far as talent... they're out of this world.
It's TMac's intangibles that set him apart from Kobe.

[noize]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

Yes Kobe is the better overall player if you include his offensive burst this year but other then that, I don't think you guys are giving T-Mac enough credit here. Remember, Kobe had played with the most dominant center(3 time championship MVP) of all time when he won those three rings. Would've T-Mac win them rings if he had played with Shaq's Lakers during the 3 peat? I think so, but I'm not sure if Kobe could carry the Orlando Magic to the playoff 3 yrs in a row being a one man show that he is. Sure T-Mac quit on his team in his last year in Orlando which is the reason why I didn't like him to began with, but he's a totally different person now with a different mindset to winning.

He's more of a playmaker then just a scorer now which I think is good for team. If he needs to be just a scorer he could do that as well, as proven this year when Yao is out scoring 34ppg in the last 4 games and grabbing 7RB. Its too bad he miss most of the game due to back spasm or else the Rockets would've gotten a better record then they do now...we will see what happen in the 2nd half of the season.

To say that he's not clutch or doesn't guard the opponent best player is ludicrous. He just hit 3 clutch basket against the Bulls including the game winner and most of you Laker homers forgot already when he guarded Kobe this year, held him to 19ppg and got off the game winning drive where Kobe didn't even bother to guard him. He had like 10 game winning shot last year including 1 against the Mavs in the playoff while shutting down Dirk for the whole series despite the loss.

To be honest with you I was never the biggest T-Mac fan before he joined the Rockets b/c I thought he was just all about stats in Orlando. My perspective and views of T-Mac totally change when I watch him closely since his arrival to Houston. I've never thought he was this good in terms of playmaking,man to man D and most importantly the abilities to make clutch shot after clutch shot as proven in the last two years(13pts in 35sec.). After being a fan of T-Mac for the last 2 yrs, I'm kicking myself in the A$$ for not giving him a chance in Orlando and I wish I would've followed him more back in the days b/c simply put...I've missed out on some of the craziest individual display from a basketball player.

I guess my only knock on him was that he was considered lazy and could never get out of the first round which just doesn't sound right saying that in the same sentence with the T-Mac I saw with the Rockets. I really hope great things will happen to T-Mac as he enter his prime b/c it would be a monumental collapse in a career of a person who imposes such will in the game and to come out empty handed when its all said and done would be anything but total disappointment.

[Brankles]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

^Good post, man.

[Mofasa]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

Numbers-wise... TMac and Kobe are about equal. However, TMac is a better rebounder, more athletic, more team-oriented, a better teammate, and less of a drama-queen/team cancer.

As far as talent... they're out of this world.
It's TMac's intangibles that set him apart from Kobe.

What are Tmac intangibles? Is it he's...more athletic(lol), more team-oriented, a better teammate, and less of a drama-queen/team cancer.

..I'll give you the better team mate. but thats it. I think kobe's big draw back is he is a difficult player to mesh with (especially if your a scrub or role player). We dont really know the reason for this but im willing to bet by next year this time this wouldn't even be an issue...IMO

the main positive about kobe is there a few players who want to win as bad as he does,

I think you talked about crying when they got knocked out of the playoffs ... thats shows where the guy's focus is imo, ultimately he wants to win and his will to win is head and shoulders above everyone else in the league....see
81 points.

[Mofasa]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

Yes Kobe is the better overall player if you include his offensive burst this year but other then that, I don't think you guys are giving T-Mac enough credit here. Remember, Kobe had played with the most dominant center(3 time championship MVP) of all time when he won those three rings. Would've T-Mac win them rings if he had played with Shaq's Lakers during the 3 peat? I think so, but I'm not sure if Kobe could carry the Orlando Magic to the playoff 3 yrs in a row being a one man show that he is. Sure T-Mac quit on his team in his last year in Orlando which is the reason why I didn't like him to began with, but he's a totally different person now with a different mindset to winning.

This argument is silly....just stop with the what ifs

To say that he's not clutch or doesn't guard the opponent best player is ludicrous. He just hit 3 clutch basket against the Bulls including the game winner and most of you Laker homers forgot already when he guarded Kobe this year, held him to 19ppg and got off the game winning drive where Kobe didn't even bother to guard him. He had like 10 game winning shot last year including 1 against the Mavs in the playoff while shutting down Dirk for the whole series despite the loss.

LMAO...he held him to 19 ppg...but kobe scored 24 points and they played only once this year...further more this was a game where kobe was trying to do what every said he doesn't do and look where it got him....

It really makes no sense to bring up single games cause I could as easily bring up the game where kobe outscored Tmac 28-5 head to head in the second half in 2004...so...

Also Tmac IS VERY CLUTCH but when compared to kobe well...he comes up short.

[Slymm]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

This thread is pretty much what I expect. Everyone talking in circles. I voted Kobe. He is a hall of famer if he retired today. That's all.

[blackceasar]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

Kobe.

While at first glance on the court you might put them as close but you have to look at the not so obvious things. T-Mac is a great player. Kobe is a special player. There is a difference between being great and special.

Its like this if you take basketball and put it into "24" Terms (the Fox show). If I just found out that Osama Bin Laden was spotted in a hotel in Paris Im sending in my best assasin to take him out. Thats Kobe. Kobe is an assasin. T-Mac is capable of making the big shot or big play to win the game but no one since MJ has consistently put a dagger in teams than Kobe. Kobe is a natural finisher. He's that kid playing Mortal Kombat in the arcade who always seems to pull the "fatality" off when the game says "finish him!".

T-Mac puts of 40 points on any given night. Kobe will put up 40 points and leave a team feeling like he ripped thier heart out. I cant explain it, its just different and as long as he sticks with Phil and they can really work together hes going to get even better than he already is.

[blackceasar]

Re: Who is the better overall player, Kobe or T-Mac?

lmao

I would love to have an actual discussion about Kobe vs. TMac without 18 homers jumping in and talking nonsense.

There's not even a real debate going on.
Here's what I've heard from the Kobe side of the argument so far:
1.) Bryant's won three championships (A team accomplishment)

2.) Bryant's a better defender (Kobe hasn't really played that outstanding of defense in the past two seasons. TMac, if I remember correctly, completely shut down Dirk in the playoffs last year.)

3.) TMac gave up on his team (No. That's something John Weisbrod, former Orlando GM, formulated to get stupid Magic fans to support his trade for Steve Francis. I also don't get how anyone can talk bad about TMac's character when Kobe completely destroyed a dynasty single-handedly)

4.) TMac lost 19 games in a row (Kobe went 2-19 in his last 21 games at the end of the season last year... I know this hasn't been brought up yet, but it will.)

The fact that TMac led any Orlando team from the past 6 years to the playoffs speaks volumes to me.

Numbers-wise... TMac and Kobe are about equal. However, TMac is a better rebounder, more athletic, more team-oriented, a better teammate, and less of a drama-queen/team cancer.

As far as talent... they're out of this world.
It's TMac's intangibles that set him apart from Kobe.

First of all lets talk about those 3 championshps. I before I say this if you are ever in the football forums you will see me talking about Manning VS Brady and Superbows. Out of the 3 major US Sports NFL football is the ultimate TEAM sport. No one player can really take over a game and dominate it from start to finish in the NFL because teams in the NFL have to a large degree work as a machine and each player being a cog or wheel in that machine so IMO when talking about individual greatness championships are overrated and I would say you have a point IF we were talking about the NFL....... BUT.... WE are NOT. Out of the 3 major US Sports Basketball is the most individually oriented sport. In baseball your batter gets anywhere from 3-4 at bats on average. You cannot call upon him to go hit for every out of every inning. In football the QB cannot score touchdowns without the WR and he cant win SB's without the rest of the team. PERIOD. BUT in the NBA u dont have those restrictions. You can put that ball in one players hand all game long and brings his A game he can single handedly dominate the game. PERIOD. So the fact that Kobe has 3 rings DOES factor in when comparing him and T-Mac.

As far as T-Mac being a better this, a better that, and having these so called "intangibles" that you speak of I can tell you one thing Kobe is that TMac is not, and in my book its the most important thing.. Kobe is a Winner. What has Tmac won? Who cares about regular season games. Sure he took a lousy team and made it better but he still hasnt done enough to IMO be mentioend in the same breath as Kobe. If anything Kobe is the one with the intagibles. Kobe knows how to finish an oposing team off and he does this better than anyone in the history of the NBA only 2nd to MJ himself. to me THATS the intagible. Like I said in my previous post. Tmac and drop 40, Kobe can drop 40. Both can win that game but team tmac beats feels like they lost a game. The teams Kobe drops 40 on feels like he put a dagger in thier heart. Its not how you score, its when you score and Kobe has a nack for demoralizing an opposing team with his style of play. When he makes his shots during a game, when a team is trying to rally back and have a sense of hope.. Kobe slams the door shut on them. This is somethine T-Mac doesnt do. They both can dunk on anyone, they are both altheticly gifted out of this world but like i said. Tmac is a great player, Kobe is a special player. I personally dont like Kobe but it is what it is.