Why are people so down on Yao?

[Havok410]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Yeah, but for every MONSTER game he has, his stats say that he has very sub par ones, or else his averages would be higher.

Yao: 20.2 ppg, 9.6 rpg, 1.2 apg, .51 spg, 1.54 bpg, 50% FG % 83% FT in 33.5 mpg

Ben: 7.9 ppg, 12.3 rpg, 2.1 apg, 1.71 spg, 2.31 bpg, 50% FG, 46% FT

The significant differences are the points and FT%, every other category, Ben's stats are barely higher, rebounding being the biggest difference (2.7 more).

Ben is an anomoly in that noone plays D anymore, and he's arguably the best at it, but he is still very one dimensional. He can afford to be a liability on offense in the system he's in, but he wouldnt excell as well as he is on other teams.

Big Ben's interior defense is alot better then Yao's and stats don't really show that. He makes just about every player who drives on him put up bad shots or else they would get blocked. Ben's bpg have gone down from his usual 3+ because players don't challenge him as much anymore. You can't say the same for Yao. He's tall but how many times have you seen a player drive in the lane and score a layup or dunk on him?

I think the best way to compare Yao and Ben is to just say that Yao is the best offensive center in the NBA while Ben is the best defensive center in the NBA. It all depends on what you want more...great offense or great defense.

[Streets]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Every GM in the league would love to have a Ben Wallace type player. Are you saying his offensive liability (which clearly exists) would prevent him from being successful on the defensive end elsewhere? Can you explain how that would be true. He would start on every team in this league at PF or C.

I don't think him being an offensive liability (which u said "clearly exists") affects him on the defensive end at all (dunno where that came from), but I do think that it brings down his overall rating. Like I said I don't think he'd be AS successful elswhere because Detroit is the perfect system for him and such a good team, they don't need him to drop 50.

Like Yao's 0 rebound game against the smallest frontline in the league.

Exactly!

Thats a perfect example. Yao's one bad game is not indicative of his performance on a nightly basis. Because in order for him to have a 0 rebound game, and still average

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

it's his impact on the game. until he starts dominating (including getting lots and lots of wins) he won't shake the mediocre label.

that's why i'll take big Ben over Yao no questions asked. it's all about impact not stats.

[BAMJ6]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Here's a better question for Yao's impact.

Take a full health Yao and a full health Amare. If they swapped places right now. What would happen to them. We'd be talking the same thing, only it's Amare with the nondomination instead of Yao.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Here's a better question for Yao's impact.

Take a full health Yao and a full health Amare. If they swapped places right now. What would happen to them. We'd be talking the same thing, only it's Amare with the nondomination instead of Yao.

since there's no way of REALLY knowing, why even bother? and actually i happen to believe a healthy amare and current tmac would translate into a whole hell of alot better combo than yao/tmac.. and ALOT more wins for the rockets. again, pointless to really say: "well if he was on that team then _______".

[KENYON06]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

The thing about Yao, is he is a wimp. He's the biggest guy in the NBA, is fairly mobile for his size and has an amazing amount of skill around the rim. He's got the whole arsenal, the midrange shot, the fadeway, the hook shot. He has the ability to do so much more than he does, on both ends of the floor. He needs to get angry, if he does that I think he'll impress us all.

[Rocky]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Here's a better question for Yao's impact.

Take a full health Yao and a full health Amare. If they swapped places right now. What would happen to them. We'd be talking the same thing, only it's Amare with the nondomination instead of Yao.

I think Amare would be sucessful anywhere solely because how the game is played today. Amare has explosive quickness and the ability to take it hard to the rim. With today's game and how the rules are called, it's very, very difficult to guard a guy like that wthout fouling. Yao's the opposite. Guys can front him, get under him, bang him, and etc. and with all the creative zones and schemes that you couldn't do 10 years ago, it's even tougher for Yao.


Amare's a great player who I would love to have on my team. But in terms of basketball skill, Yao has always been, IMO, the better player.

[billmatic]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

People are down on Yao because they are idiots. I agree with the original poster, except for the knock on Amare. There may be half a dozen power forwards better than him right now, but that wont be the case in a couple years.

[EWRMETS]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Yao has 27 points, 18 boards, 5 assists tonight..he's a monster but he needs a better team.

[aswoioshr]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

hes averaging close to 27pts and 16reb the past 4 games.

[platic]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Yao Ming will be the next Rik Smits which isnt bad but it isnt what people expect of him.

When was the last time Rik Smits averaged 20 ppg and 9.6 rpg? Has Rik Smits even come close to those numbers? As far as I know, a typical year for Rik was 14 ppg 7.2 rpg.

In Indiana, did opposing defenses gameplan specifically against Smits? Did they double and triple team him in the paint regularly? Did the Pacers' offense usually start with Rik Smits setting up in the post, with his teammates attempting to get him the ball?

I'm very, very curious why people are always comparing Yao's on court performance to Smits. Of course, only complete morons would equate Yao to Smits simply because they're both 7'5" tall and they have fair skin. Nobody would really be dumb enough to do that... right?

[platic]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Every GM in the league would love to have a Ben Wallace type player. Are you saying his offensive liability (which clearly exists) would prevent him from being successful on the defensive end elsewhere? Can you explain how that would be true. He would start on every team in this league at PF or C.

Well, Ben Wallace didn't amount to anything for the first four years and first two teams he played for. He was a good role player then, but he was far from being "great". Nobody, and I mean nobody, expected him to blossom the way he has.

He started to look very good the year he played for Detroit. Coincidence? I doubt it. Ben Wallace is a very, very good fit for Detroit. The Pistons are able to get the most out of him. But I think that situation suggests that Ben Wallace is probably a better fit in Detroit than he would be on any other team. Very few teams in the league can afford to play 4-on-5 on offense every night. Very few teams in the league can win inspite of having one starter contribute only 7 points after logging 38 minutes on the floor.

The thing is: Detroit's system can easily mask the HUGE weakness in Ben Wallace's game (ie no scoring ability whatsoever). It misleads people into thinking it's OK for a player to be so impotent on offense just because he's a beast on defense.

Great defenders should be decent scorers too. Just look at how Dikembe Mutombo developed as a legitimate scoring threat midway through career. Ben Wallace, on the other hand, will never, EVER be considered great. Why? Because he's forever be a half-great player. The defensive half.

[HMcCoy]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

I think you're vastly over-generalizing Detroit as a team. Wallace has been there through 3 different coaching regimes, each with a slightly different defensive philosophy. IE, Carlisle, like coach Pop utilized a sideline D that keeps guys out of the middle at all costs...while Larry Brown used a ton of pressure on the perimiter and funneled guys to the middle. I haven't really seen enough of Flip's D-scheme, but I'd bet its a bit different as well. Wallace has been an anchor throughout. Also, Wallace v. Ming as a leader is no contest whatsoever, and yes, competent floor leadership is good for a few wins.

All that being said, I like Yao and I think he's coming along nicely. The media used his nationality and size to set up Shaq-like expectations. On paper, a 7'5" guy with his skills should be more than a 20/10 player, but hey...20/10 is great in this perimiter oriented era.

[BigTigLSU]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

When was the last time Rik Smits averaged 20 ppg and 9.6 rpg? Has Rik Smits even come close to those numbers? As far as I know, a typical year for Rik was 14 ppg 7.2 rpg.

In Indiana, did opposing defenses gameplan specifically against Smits? Did they double and triple team him in the paint regularly? Did the Pacers' offense usually start with Rik Smits setting up in the post, with his teammates attempting to get him the ball?

I'm very, very curious why people are always comparing Yao's on court performance to Smits. Of course, only complete morons would equate Yao to Smits simply because they're both 7'5" tall and they have fair skin. Nobody would really be dumb enough to do that... right?

Its not his stats its his impact on the game... that is similar to Smits. He gets lost in the flow the game and doesnt affect the game as he should.

[platic]

Re: Why are people so down on Yao?

Its not his stats its his impact on the game... that is similar to Smits. He gets lost in the flow the game and doesnt affect the game as he should.

What are you talking about?

In case you haven't noticed, the Rockets winning % have improved every single year since they drafted Yao (excluding games Yao missed to injury). Prior to Yao's arrival, the Rockets had one of the league's longest playoff draughts. I'd call that an "impact".

And Yao has a SIGNIFICANT affect on the Rockets' game. If you've watched even a handful of Rockets games, you'd notice how the defense will always collapse on him if he's within 12 feeet of the basket. He's almost always double teamed (even triple teamed) in the paint. Every team the Rockets play gameplan specifically against Yao. Don't try telling me Yao doesn't have an impact on Rockets games.

And of course, there's the Rockets winning 9 of the past 12 games since Yao returned from injury. He's single-handedly carried the team on his shoulders during the winning streak --- what with TMac going through one of his worst slumps ever in the past dozen games or so.

And no matter how you twist and turn the facts, the REALITY is that a guy that averages about 12 ppg and 7 rpg (Rik Smits) does NOT have anywhere near the impact of a guy getting 20 ppg and 9.6 rpg. Not by a long shot. It amuses me how people are so adamant in comparing Yao to Smits just because they're both tall and fair-skinned. It's just plain... moronic.