Is Steve Francis Done?

[Latino_Chocolate]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

**** Francis. I still say he threw that game against Ron Artest and St.Johns way back when in the Ncaa Tournament playing for Maryland. They said dude was laughing at the end of the game talking bout how he just wanted to get to the NBA anyway. Bastard.

someone is a bit jelly... that was almost a decade ago... let it go man, let it go!

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

Steve hasn't played yet, so we don't know that.

Mike James was brought in for something other than passing the ball, because the team needed more players who could create their own shot than just Tmac and Yao.

Just because Rafer is starting doesn't mean he's good. Smush Parker started for LA last year and probably had a better season than Rafer until he started pouting.

No one is saying Rafer is "good". We're saying he's the best candidate for starting PG. The fact that you think Steve is a better candidate despite the fact that Adelman won't even put him in the game is just absurd. Even if Steve weren't a complete has been, he's better suited for SG than PG on this team, particularly if you're talking about starting with Yao and McGrady.

But that's not the issue, because for two seasons, Steve has been a has been.

[23]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

No one is saying Rafer is "good". We're saying he's the best candidate for starting PG. The fact that you think Steve is a better candidate despite the fact that Adelman won't even put him in the game is just absurd. Even if Steve weren't a complete has been, he's better suited for SG than PG on this team, particularly if you're talking about starting with Yao and McGrady.

But that's not the issue, because for two seasons, Steve has been a has been.

I don't know if Steve has anything left in the tank or not, but what I'm saying is the Rockets could do better than Rafer Alston and that's my point, as if there is nobody else in the nba that can handle bringing the ball to halfcourt and passing it off to Tmac.

Steve on the other hand is out of shape and doesn't know the offense (as bad as the team is struggling with it themselves, he had a hard time even getting that far). Even still i'm sure he could bring the ball up to half court.

Rafer Alston is constantly left open by other teams' defenses because they know all about his 6.2 points, 35.3% shooting, 22.2% from three, and on offense his defense is as atrocious which is why it's great that his minutes are reduced from last year.

As bad as that is, he could do better, but I'm sorry if expecting more than a 35% shooter is asking for too much.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

I don't know if Steve has anything left in the tank or not, but what I'm saying is the Rockets could do better than Rafer Alston and that's my point, as if there is nobody else in the nba that can handle bringing the ball to halfcourt and passing it off to Tmac.

Steve on the other hand is out of shape and doesn't know the offense (as bad as the team is struggling with it themselves, he had a hard time even getting that far). Even still i'm sure he could bring the ball up to half court.

Rafer Alston is constantly left open by other teams' defenses because they know all about his 6.2 points, 35.3% shooting, 22.2% from three, and on offense his defense is as atrocious which is why it's great that his minutes are reduced from last year.

As bad as that is, he could do better, but I'm sorry if expecting more than a 35% shooter is asking for too much.

What are you talking about? No one here is putting Rafer on the All Star ballot. The issue is, what is the best PG option on the current Rockets roster?

If we're playing Fantasy Basketball then I think they should get Jason Kidd. You can apologize and go into whatever histrionics you need to continue alternating between taking jabs and playing the part of the victim, but it has no effect on the discussion.

[The 24th Letter]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

word of the thread: histrionics

[23]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

What are you talking about? No one here is putting Rafer on the All Star ballot. The issue is, what is the best PG option on the current Rockets roster?

I happen to think Mike James has been a better player for the team, but that's me. We haven't seen Brooks. I know he's a rook, but he sure gave team USA a fit this summer.

What I was saying was, lets see the other guys first, but you cannot complain when Rafer's minutes are reduced

If we're playing Fantasy Basketball then I think they should get Jason Kidd. You can apologize and go into whatever histrionics you need to continue alternating between taking jabs and playing the part of the victim, but it has no effect on the discussion.

I didn't know asking for a PG shooting better than 35% was asking for Steve Nash, born.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

I didn't know asking for a PG shooting better than 35% was asking for Steve Nash, born.

No one has contended that Rafer's shooting is a weakness. Just in case we're unclear: Rafer's shooting is a weakness. If it weren't, I wouldn't have listed the pros and cons of having a better shooter(Mike James) coming off of the bench.

what I'm saying is the Rockets could do better than Rafer Alston and that's my point, as if there is nobody else in the nba that can handle bringing the ball to halfcourt and passing it off to Tmac.

That's what I was addressing. We're discussing the Rockets roster. They have a glut of players listed as PGs. Any discussion of "nobody else in the nba" is tangential.

[23]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

No one has contended that Rafer's shooting is a weakness. Just in case we're unclear: Rafer's shooting is a weakness. If it weren't, I wouldn't have listed the pros and cons of having a better shooter(Mike James) coming off of the bench.



That's what I was addressing. We're discussing the Rockets roster. They have a glut of players listed as PGs. Any discussion of "nobody else in the nba" is tangential.

Doesn't seem like we're disagreeing here. All I'm adding is that I would like to see what the others can do before i declare he's the best they have, because he's not doing anything but bringing the ball upcourt.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

I would like to see what the others can do before i declare he's the best they have, because he's not doing anything but bringing the ball upcourt.

Well here is the issue: I'm talking about the best candidate to start, strategically speaking. Rafer is a passer who doesn't turn the ball over and can push the tempo. Mike James is a scorer who will occasionally make terrible decisions with the basketball, and admits to looking for his shot first.

With Yao and Tracy on the floor, as a coach I'd want my PG to consistently look for Tracy and Yao before taking the shot. In fact, I'd only want him to take shots late in the clock if the whole possession went sour. Why? Because with Tracy and Yao on the floor, they present the best chances of breaking down the defense and causing fouls and overall rhythmic disruption in the offense. Yao has to rest anyway, so I don't want to waste any of his minutes with my PG shooting.

However, with the limited offensive prowess of their frontline when Yao sits, James is great, because he can cheat points into a game and provide an open shooter for a playmaking McGrady.

The other point I disagree with you on is summarizing Rafer's play into walking the ball up and passing it. He makes bad defensive decisions on the pick and roll, but I like his ability to pressure the ball handler. Also, he is the only PG on the roster that I've seen get Tracy easy shots when things aren't going well for him. I've seen it time and time again. He also does this by pushing the tempo and creating early offense sets for the Rockets. Lastly, he seems to be the only PG that actually knows how to run the sets and get people into their positions when plays break down in the middle of the shot clock. Again, very important when you have Tracy and Yao on the floor.


I disagree with you saying that he just runs the ball up and passes to Tracy because that is not the set that Adelman is running, so that literally can't be the case. He's running motion sets which are much more complex than that.

And on top of it all, the Rockets are winning with this approach.

[youvalss]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

Steve Francis can't even crack the Rockets' rotation. Rick Adelman has said that he had brought in Steve Francis with the expectation he'd be in the starting line up. However, apparently he has been outplayed by Rafer Alston, Luther Head, and Mike James throughout the preseason.

Is Steve Francis done? Will he ever climb his way back to respectability?

People keep saying that he's lost a lot of quickness to age. But the guy is only 30 friggin' years old! This isn't football; it's basketball. Players are typically still in their prime at 30 years old. Other guards with similar quickness have remained explosive at and beyond 30 years old, including: Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Gary Payton, Allen Iverson, Sam Cassell, Tim Hardaway, Michael Jordan, and just about 80% of perennial All-Star guards in the past 20 years. I don't think age becomes a major factor until a player passes 32 years old. In contrast, Steve Francis has been "over the hill" since the age of 28.

What's the real reason Steve Francis is in such a funk? Was he never really any good to begin with? Is he one of those players that look really good on a bad team, but are exposed when playing on a talented roster? (*cough* Cuttino Mobley * cough *)

It would be interesting to see what happens in NBA 2K8 when u bench Francis...how loud he/his agent's gonna whine...

[Leahmic223]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

I am pretty sure the guy is just in the doghouse for being out of shape.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/solomon/rockets/5253140.html

I don't think he's not playing because he's not good enough.

[Streets]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

The only thing I don't agree with is the fact that Mike James is an inferior decision maker. He shoots the ball at a higher clip (40% from three!), and averages less turnovers than Rafer. I don't know how many times I have cringed watching rafer dribble into traffic and throw up the tear drop that NEVER falls (you aren't Tony Parker!!).

That said, I like Mike's role as the 6th man/ energy guy. He has great chemistry with Scola and Bonzi, and I love that Rick plays them as a unit.

Right now, that leaves a rookie who has never played an NBA game (AB) and a guy who is out of shape and by all of his interviews, seems like he has no intention of getting into shape and thought he didn't have to work for his spot in the rotation (SF3).

Thus, Rafer appears to be the best option because he is the lesser of three evils. Personally, I think AB could be better than Rafer RIGHT NOW, but I have to trust that coach A sees things that we don't in practice.

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

I agree with everything your'e saying, Streets. Let me clarify--I like Rafer's decisions with the ball in a distribution context. Mike is shoot first and doesn't always take good shots, where I've seen Rafer make the game easier for Tracy at times by reestablishing the offense or pushing the tempo to get Tracy and easy look.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Is Steve Francis Done?

Would any Rocket fan really want a rookie handling the starting point guard duties? I sure as hell wouldn't. He may be more skilled than Rafe, but he's going to make some huge mistakes that every rookie makes.. and yall can't afford that. AB is a talent though, coming from someone who followed him closely in the Pac-10 last year.