Rings or Respect What would you want.?

**Westybro** · 04-21-2003, 11:08 AM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
You earn respect while winning rings...and the TRULY great players end up winning no matter what. Thats what defines a championship..being the best.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is the biggest bunch of crap I ever heard, "Truly great players end up winning no matter what." Ever heard of George Gervin? He was one of the TRULY great players the NBA has ever seen, he never won a ring. You can't define greatnes by how many championships a guy has won. I got news for you, so much of success depends on circumstances. There are many great players in all sports that found themselves in unfavorable circumstances, but you can never take away anything they did between the lines, because they didn't win it all. If anything, championships can give the illusion of greatness. Ever heard of Lynn Swan?

<hr /></blockquote>

Ever hear of Montana, Russel, Magic, Gretzky, Jordan? These were all TRULY great players who WILLED THEIR teams to win. Look at most OF JORDAN's defining moments, all came from the playoffs en route in winning championships, thats why hes considred the BEST. You can't just put ANY PLAYER on the Bulls to replace Jordan and win 6 titles. The BEST of BEST players ever WON"T let their teams lose, because they had the power to do so. Gervin was a great player...but WON'T EVER be considered the greatest. Do you think Patrick Ewing was content when he retired? Hell NO, he wants a ring, he could give flying crap what people think about him. Think about it...if Ewing led his team to 3 or 4 titles(quite possible) he would been considered a MUCH better player guaranteed.

**LHayes37** · 04-21-2003, 03:09 PM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
You earn respect while winning rings...and the TRULY great players end up winning no matter what. Thats what defines a championship..being the best.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is the biggest bunch of crap I ever heard, "Truly great players end up winning no matter what." Ever heard of George Gervin? He was one of the TRULY great players the NBA has ever seen, he never won a ring. You can't define greatnes by how many championships a guy has won. I got news for you, so much of success depends on circumstances. There are many great players in all sports that found themselves in unfavorable circumstances, but you can never take away anything they did between the lines, because they didn't win it all. If anything, championships can give the illusion of greatness. Ever heard of Lynn Swan?

<hr /></blockquote>

Ever hear of Montana, Russel, Magic, Gretzky, Jordan? These were all TRULY great players who WILLED THEIR teams to win. Look at most OF JORDAN's defining moments, all came from the playoffs en route in winning championships, thats why hes considred the BEST. You can't just put ANY PLAYER on the Bulls to replace Jordan and win 6 titles. The BEST of BEST players ever WON"T let their teams lose, because they had the power to do so. Gervin was a great player...but WON'T EVER be considered the greatest. Do you think Patrick Ewing was content when he retired? Hell NO, he wants a ring, he could give flying crap what people think about him. Think about it...if Ewing led his team to 3 or 4 titles(quite possible) he would been considered a MUCH better player guaranteed.

<hr /></blockquote>

You used guys that you really can't dispute their greatness...championships or not. What I said, is a lot of what we consider great depends on circumstance. I never said take Jordan off the Bulls and look, they still would win. I find a problem with defining greatness by the number of championships a particular player has won. I beleive Walter Payton would still be considered by many as the greatest running back to ever play even if he had never played for a Super Bowl champion. Hell, if Gervin had been the key player of a team that won even two or three championships, I don't think he could be considered one of the top ten of all time. I don't dispute that a championship or two can push a guy up a few notches, that is clearly evident. But for every, Montana, Gretzky, Jordan and Magic there is a Marino, Banks, and Karl Malone. These were some of the greatest that ever played in there respective sports, rings or no rings. Would we honetly be discussing the attributes of Scottie Pippen had he not been in such a wonderful situation? We saw what the guy was made of when Jordan left, he was a punk. I'll also agree that many of Jordans high points came during championship runs, that's what we remember him for. You perform big time on a big time stage people will remember. Again, I'll use Lynn Swann as an example. This guy is really known for a few big catches in the Super Bowl, but does that equate to a spot in the Hall of Fame? The guy didn't even average 2.5 catches a game for his career, hardly good numbers. But because he did what he did on the grandest stage in his sport, he gets the highest honor in his sport. That is a shining example of a guy that was thrown into the best of circumstances. Hell, if that's all it takes is to perform big in the big game, let's put Timmy Smith in the Hall of Fame for God sake.

I honestly don't remember where I read it, there is a quote from a GREAT athlete and he said greatness does depend on circumstances. All the guys you named are great, but to a man each will admit they were lucky to be surrounded with teammates that also had that burning desire to be the best. Greatness is never a one man show.

**LHayes37** · 04-21-2003, 03:09 PM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
<blockquote>Quote:<hr />
You earn respect while winning rings...and the TRULY great players end up winning no matter what. Thats what defines a championship..being the best.

<hr /></blockquote>

This is the biggest bunch of crap I ever heard, "Truly great players end up winning no matter what." Ever heard of George Gervin? He was one of the TRULY great players the NBA has ever seen, he never won a ring. You can't define greatnes by how many championships a guy has won. I got news for you, so much of success depends on circumstances. There are many great players in all sports that found themselves in unfavorable circumstances, but you can never take away anything they did between the lines, because they didn't win it all. If anything, championships can give the illusion of greatness. Ever heard of Lynn Swan?

<hr /></blockquote>

Ever hear of Montana, Russel, Magic, Gretzky, Jordan? These were all TRULY great players who WILLED THEIR teams to win. Look at most OF JORDAN's defining moments, all came from the playoffs en route in winning championships, thats why hes considred the BEST. You can't just put ANY PLAYER on the Bulls to replace Jordan and win 6 titles. The BEST of BEST players ever WON"T let their teams lose, because they had the power to do so. Gervin was a great player...but WON'T EVER be considered the greatest. Do you think Patrick Ewing was content when he retired? Hell NO, he wants a ring, he could give flying crap what people think about him. Think about it...if Ewing led his team to 3 or 4 titles(quite possible) he would been considered a MUCH better player guaranteed.

<hr /></blockquote>

You used guys that you really can't dispute their greatness...championships or not. What I said, is a lot of what we consider great depends on circumstance. I never said take Jordan off the Bulls and look, they still would win. I find a problem with defining greatness by the number of championships a particular player has won. I beleive Walter Payton would still be considered by many as the greatest running back to ever play even if he had never played for a Super Bowl champion. Hell, if Gervin had been the key player of a team that won even two or three championships, I don't think he could be considered one of the top ten of all time. I don't dispute that a championship or two can push a guy up a few notches, that is clearly evident. But for every, Montana, Gretzky, Jordan and Magic there is a Marino, Banks, and Karl Malone. These were some of the greatest that ever played in there respective sports, rings or no rings. Would we honetly be discussing the attributes of Scottie Pippen had he not been in such a wonderful situation? We saw what the guy was made of when Jordan left, he was a punk. I'll also agree that many of Jordans high points came during championship runs, that's what we remember him for. You perform big time on a big time stage people will remember. Again, I'll use Lynn Swann as an example. This guy is really known for a few big catches in the Super Bowl, but does that equate to a spot in the Hall of Fame? The guy didn't even average 2.5 catches a game for his career, hardly good numbers. But because he did what he did on the grandest stage in his sport, he gets the highest honor in his sport. That is a shining example of a guy that was thrown into the best of circumstances. Hell, if that's all it takes is to perform big in the big game, let's put Timmy Smith in the Hall of Fame for God sake.

I honestly don't remember where I read it, there is a quote from a GREAT athlete and he said greatness does depend on circumstances. All the guys you named are great, but to a man each will admit they were lucky to be surrounded with teammates that also had that burning desire to be the best. Greatness is never a one man show.

**SPTO** · 04-21-2003, 03:13 PM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

I agree with you TOTALLY Lhayes!

**SPTO** · 04-21-2003, 03:13 PM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

I agree with you TOTALLY Lhayes!

**LHayes37** · 04-22-2003, 04:37 AM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

I remember now, it was Ted Williams that said it. As I recall, he never won a World Series, and many consider him the greatest hitter to ever play the game.

**LHayes37** · 04-22-2003, 04:37 AM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

I remember now, it was Ted Williams that said it. As I recall, he never won a World Series, and many consider him the greatest hitter to ever play the game.

**BigTigLSU** · 04-22-2003, 11:52 AM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

Well I think we got our answer about Kobe and what he wants. If he is really opting out of his contract its moe likely to get his own team i.e. Tmac.

**BigTigLSU** · 04-22-2003, 11:52 AM

Re: Rings or Respect What would you want.?

Well I think we got our answer about Kobe and what he wants. If he is really opting out of his contract its moe likely to get his own team i.e. Tmac.

Rings or Respect What would you want.?

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