Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

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  • PrettyT11
    MVP
    • Jul 2008
    • 3220

    #106
    Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

    Yes but by the time he is 34 he will have played 16 YEARS in the NBA. I think it's pretty safe to say his legacy will have been defined by then. So that is reach right there. Plus you have no idea how much of his athletic abilities he will lose. His size and strenth really aint going nowhere so he would still be able to out muscle guys to the basket.

    The whole athletic argument is kind of hard to apply to an athlete we have never really seen the likes of before. Even if he loses a step or two he would still be right at the top of the league when it comes to athletic ability.

    And who is to say he won't have developed more skills by then. I mean hell all you have to do is look at that season to see he is still improving. He took his free throw's up right at 80 percent, got his three's up to around 36 from 31, took his defense to All NBA level, and lead his team to the most sucess it has ever had. I would say it would be a wise bet to say he is still working on his game.

    Comment

    • JBH3
      Marvel's Finest
      • Jan 2007
      • 13506

      #107
      Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

      ^ Wasn't just him elevating his team either.

      West improved and Mo Williams was a big addition...at least via reg. season games.
      Originally posted by Edmund Burke
      All that is needed for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing.

      Comment

      • PrettyT11
        MVP
        • Jul 2008
        • 3220

        #108
        Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

        Originally posted by JBH3
        ^ Wasn't just him elevating his team either.

        West improved and Mo Williams was a big addition...at least via reg. season games.
        I didn't say they didn't help. But it was obvious to see how his commitment to defense last year and ways rubbed off on his team and helped take them to another level. He made it alot easier for them to go and do what they do best.

        Comment

        • ProfessaPackMan
          Bamma
          • Mar 2008
          • 63852

          #109
          Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

          Originally posted by Bornindamecca
          Ex, you are talking about the very minor exception to the general consensus. If you need 100% agreement about something on the internet, then you'll be on the LBJ Defense Committee with Mike Brown and Hmac forever. Sure, a couple of people on messageboards exaggerate. I'm sure no one is shocked by that. But to sit here and act as if opinion is split on Lebron's skills is just ludicrous.

          And Lebron's only weakness is NOT his jumpshot. That is also ridiculous. That's his 2nd biggest weakness.

          I never brought up the argument about "if you take away his athleticism". I just answered it. Though now that we're discussing it, it isn't stupid at all. Lebron is 24 now, but he won't be this athletic when he's 34. The skills he develops between now and then will determine whether or not he's still the number 1 option on his team, and that is a factor in any player's legacy.

          There sure is a lot of heat in this discussion considering that no one is saying that Kevin Durant is better than Lebron James, or going to be better this season. All of this is because people are saying "I could see him getting to Lebron' level one day". Perish the thought, eh?


          Hey Jerry Colangelo, how do you improve a team with Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Melo and Chris Paul?



          The sky is the limit for his kid. Ya'll need to ease up.
          This.
          #RespectTheCulture

          Comment

          • Bornindamecca
            Books Nelson Simnation
            • Jul 2007
            • 10919

            #110
            Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

            For the audience playing at home, this is exactly the kidn of Lebron Defense Committee post I'm talking about. I made no judgement on where Lebron's game would be when he gets to his 30s. All I said--again, perish the thought--was that the skills he develops between now and his athletic decline will contribute to his legacy, and determine his effectiveness in the last third of his career.

            Somehow, some way, that gets read as "Lebron won't be **** when he can't just jump over people anymore".

            I don't even know why I engage the zealots.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            Yes but by the time he is 34 he will have played 16 YEARS in the NBA.
            And that's a lot of wear and tear. With his commitments to international play, there is no telling how is body will respond in the next six years, let alone the next ten.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            Plus you have no idea how much of his athletic abilities he will lose.
            Then it's a good thing I never made that determination.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            And who is to say he won't have developed more skills by then.
            Certainly not I, which anyone who read my post can plainly see.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            He took his free throw's up right at 80 percent, got his three's up to around 36 from 31, took his defense to All NBA level
            I don't know what stats you're looking at, but on NBA.com it says that he got 2 1/2% points above his rookie year from the charity stripe and raised his 3pt game to...oh wait, he actually shot the 3 better in his second year. Either way, he still shoots about as well from three as Rafer Alston.

            Those staggering numbers aside, I'm gonna go ahead and reserve my judgement on his place among the great shooters in the league, a group which already includes a 20 year old Durant, by the way.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            ...and lead his team to the most sucess it has ever had.
            Or, they got him better teammates.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            I would say it would be a wise bet to say he is still working on his game.
            Wise...or the consensus opinion of basketball fans and experts alike. The people who are saying he hasn't improved are in the severe minority. However, those that believe he completely changed are perhaps overlooking some of the roster changes the Cavs made in the middle of the 08 campaign, and also in the offseason before the 09 campaign.

            Originally posted by PrettyT11
            I didn't say they didn't help. But it was obvious to see how his commitment to defense last year and ways rubbed off on his team and helped take them to another level. He made it alot easier for them to go and do what they do best.
            That's an interesting take, considering the Cavs have been one of the top defensive teams in the league since Mike Brown took over.
            Last edited by Bornindamecca; 07-29-2009, 03:41 PM.
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            • KG
              Welcome Back
              • Sep 2005
              • 17583

              #111
              Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

              Originally posted by Bornindamecca
              Ex, you are talking about the very minor exception to the general consensus. If you need 100% agreement about something on the internet, then you'll be on the LBJ Defense Committee with Mike Brown and Hmac forever. Sure, a couple of people on messageboards exaggerate. I'm sure no one is shocked by that. But to sit here and act as if opinion is split on Lebron's skills is just ludicrous.

              And Lebron's only weakness is NOT his jumpshot. That is also ridiculous. That's his 2nd biggest weakness.

              I never brought up the argument about "if you take away his athleticism". I just answered it. Though now that we're discussing it, it isn't stupid at all. Lebron is 24 now, but he won't be this athletic when he's 34. The skills he develops between now and then will determine whether or not he's still the number 1 option on his team, and that is a factor in any player's legacy.

              There sure is a lot of heat in this discussion considering that no one is saying that Kevin Durant is better than Lebron James, or going to be better this season. All of this is because people are saying "I could see him getting to Lebron' level one day". Perish the thought, eh?


              Hey Jerry Colangelo, how do you improve a team with Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Melo and Chris Paul?



              The sky is the limit for his kid. Ya'll need to ease up.
              What's his biggest weakness, defense?
              Twitter Instagram - kgx2thez

              Comment

              • TMagic
                G.O.A.T.
                • Apr 2007
                • 7550

                #112
                Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                Originally posted by ProfessaPackMan
                LOL Yea if he has links for those quotes then I'll take back what I said but I know for sure I definitely don't remember saying ANY of those things.
                I would!

                But, but, um... I can't find em. I, uh, wasn't able to pull them back up. Yeah. That's it.

                Pack must of went and deleted those posts fellas!

                Covering up the evidence for his infinite hate of LeBron.

                PSN: TMagic_01

                Twitter: @ThoseFools

                YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEC...cd41cJK2238sIA

                Comment

                • PrettyT11
                  MVP
                  • Jul 2008
                  • 3220

                  #113
                  Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                  Originally posted by Bornindamecca
                  For the audience playing at home, this is exactly the kidn of Lebron Defense Committee post I'm talking about. I made no judgement on where Lebron's game would be when he gets to his 30s. All I said--again, perish the thought--was that the skills he develops between now and his athletic decline will contribute to his legacy, and determine his effectiveness in the last third of his career.

                  Somehow, some way, that gets read as "Lebron won't be **** when he can't just jump over people anymore".

                  I don't even know why I engage the zealots.



                  And that's a lot of wear and tear. With his commitments to international play, there is no telling how is body will respond in the next six years, let alone the next ten.


                  Then it's a good thing I never made that determination.


                  Certainly not I, which anyone who read my post can plainly see.


                  I don't know what stats you're looking at, but on NBA.com it says that he got 2 1/2% points above his rookie year from the charity stripe and raised his 3pt game to...oh wait, he actually shot the 3 better in his second year. Either way, he still shoots about as well from three as Rafer Alston.

                  Those staggering numbers aside, I'm gonna go ahead and reserve my judgement on his place among the great shooters in the league, a group which already includes a 20 year old Durant, by the way.



                  Or, they got him better teammates.



                  Wise...or the consensus opinion of basketball fans and experts alike. The people who are saying he hasn't improved are in the severe minority. However, those that believe he completely changed are perhaps overlooking some of the roster changes the Cavs made in the middle of the 08 campaign, and also in the offseason before the 09 campaign.
                  And damn I didn't know you needed a class in reading comprehension and I also like the way you cut my words short to try and twist them around. First and formost I never defended Lebron about anything in my post or never said that you said he wouldn't develop or anmything of that nature. All I spoke on was about the athletic thing. But if you can't comprehend that then you might just need to stop with this topic.

                  As far as the statement about the 16 years thing. It was made to show that by a players 16th season his legacy has already been long determined. So I don't see how anything that happens on the basketball court in your 16th or later season would affect your legacy. That was the entire and only point. There was no defending LeBron or anybody for that matter.

                  Then you want to go off on this and that nitpicking like I said you made any assumptions at all. I never did any of the such. God forbid all I do is make a simple statement like NOBODY, not you specifically, know how much if any athletic ability he will lose. That remains to be seen. I have no idea why you took my post as a personal attack or made it your agenda to make it seem like there is some big defense thing going on. I think you are blowing one little thing way overboard.

                  Oh lastly I like the game you tried to play with the stats. It was kind of funny. All I did was say the man improved his free throw's to right at 80 percent. That was a major knock people had on his game the past couple of years and his numbers from the line had gone DOWN until last year. That was the point there was improvement. Oh and when did I ever say he was a great a shooter?? I'll wait but the answer is never. So I have no idea what your lil comment about his place on the best shooters list has a damn thing to do with anything. And you want to talk about assumptions?? Give me a break

                  Comment

                  • PrettyT11
                    MVP
                    • Jul 2008
                    • 3220

                    #114
                    Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                    Originally posted by Bornindamecca
                    That's an interesting take, considering the Cavs have been one of the top defensive teams in the league since Mike Brown took over.
                    Since this wasn't in there when I responding. Again here goes that whole reading comprehension thing again. I said his commitment to defense and his other ways rubbed off on his team and helped them go to another level. Never said they wasn't any good before or LeBron was the only reason they improved. But he damn sure was spark plug that lead to it.

                    It doesn't take a damn genious to see that they had thier BEST regular season EVER and played better as a team on both sides of the floor than ever before.

                    Since you want to throw out stats. Last season was the FIRST time the ranked FIRST in the NBA in defense as far as PPG and FG%. The season before they where the middle of the pack. That is what we call IMPROVEMENT. That all begins with your star player and trickles down. Feel free to come up with some other garbage to try and dispute that.
                    Last edited by PrettyT11; 07-29-2009, 03:56 PM.

                    Comment

                    • Bornindamecca
                      Books Nelson Simnation
                      • Jul 2007
                      • 10919

                      #115
                      Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...





                      U mad?

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                      • TMagic
                        G.O.A.T.
                        • Apr 2007
                        • 7550

                        #116
                        Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                        These always provide some good entertainment.
                        PSN: TMagic_01

                        Twitter: @ThoseFools

                        YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEC...cd41cJK2238sIA

                        Comment

                        • ex carrabba fan
                          I'll thank him for you
                          • Oct 2004
                          • 32744

                          #117
                          Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                          Originally posted by Bornindamecca
                          Ex, you are talking about the very minor exception to the general consensus. If you need 100% agreement about something on the internet, then you'll be on the LBJ Defense Committee with Mike Brown and Hmac forever. Sure, a couple of people on messageboards exaggerate. I'm sure no one is shocked by that. But to sit here and act as if opinion is split on Lebron's skills is just ludicrous.

                          And Lebron's only weakness is NOT his jumpshot. That is also ridiculous. That's his 2nd biggest weakness.

                          I never brought up the argument about "if you take away his athleticism". I just answered it. Though now that we're discussing it, it isn't stupid at all. Lebron is 24 now, but he won't be this athletic when he's 34. The skills he develops between now and then will determine whether or not he's still the number 1 option on his team, and that is a factor in any player's legacy.

                          There sure is a lot of heat in this discussion considering that no one is saying that Kevin Durant is better than Lebron James, or going to be better this season. All of this is because people are saying "I could see him getting to Lebron' level one day". Perish the thought, eh?


                          Hey Jerry Colangelo, how do you improve a team with Kobe, Lebron, Wade, Melo and Chris Paul?



                          The sky is the limit for his kid. Ya'll need to ease up.
                          Here's the bottom line. I'm not even in the business of comparing LBJ/KD right now or even in the future.

                          My beef is that people hold LBJ's physical tools against him. It's incredibly shortsighted. It's like they are slighting his actual basketball skills. I don't care if only a couple of people are doing this, once I see people post that nonsense I'm going to say something.

                          As for his jumper being his only weakness, sure that's probably an exaggeration, but really I don't know what a bigger hole is in his game. If his jumper isn't his only weakness I would say it's his biggest.

                          Also I never said you brought up the "take away the athleticism" hypothetical. The people who do that are the ones grasping for straws when it comes to this debate or a discussion on LBJ's shortcomings.

                          Edit: PP you my man..

                          There's no heat at all from me, it's like whomever doesn't think KD can reach LBJ's level will automatically be mocked.
                          Last edited by ex carrabba fan; 07-29-2009, 06:37 PM.

                          Comment

                          • ProfessaPackMan
                            Bamma
                            • Mar 2008
                            • 63852

                            #118
                            Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                            This thread has gone on 7-8 pages too long man(don't lock it though, Mods lol)

                            But I will say that I have never seen so many people get up in arms about a prediction or even worse, a simple word. My goodness, I'm glad Football season has started up now lol.
                            #RespectTheCulture

                            Comment

                            • HMcCoy
                              All Star
                              • Jan 2003
                              • 8212

                              #119
                              Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                              Originally posted by ProfessaPackMan
                              This thread has gone on 7-8 pages too long man(don't lock it though, Mods lol)

                              But I will say that I have never seen so many people get up in arms about a prediction or even worse, a simple word. My goodness, I'm glad Football season has started up now lol.
                              So true, lol. Meh, we'll see what happens...
                              Hank's Custom Collectibles 3D printer/painter extraordinaire

                              Comment

                              • TheMatrix31
                                RF
                                • Jul 2002
                                • 52927

                                #120
                                Re: Durant as good--or better?!?!--than...

                                Since I don't really have anything else to add to the topic...

                                I kinda wish his number wasnt 35 though. Not an "attractive" number. Durant's a good 21, 23, 24, 30, 31, 33....but 35 is so random.

                                Eh, nitpicky on my part, whatever.

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