AI/Grizzlies agree to terminate contract

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

^^^Two great posts.

Thing I'd like to tack on to Hmac's point; everyone knowledgeable knew that his game was going to have to expand. It didn't. That's the real issue. People would still be in the market for his skills if he agreed to marginalize them within a team capacity. Eddie House, Jamal Crawford, Ben Gordon, Flip Murray--these are all guys with a similar role to what Iverson should have, and could have on a winning team. But he wants to be a STAR, and thinks he's above being a roleplayer.

And he has clearly lost a step. When people say he has fallen off, they don't mean it in the sense that he is a wholly ineffective basketball player, but he used to be the fastest guy in the league, period. Right now we could have a really long debate about who is the quickest guy in the league, but when AI was in his prime, the debate was about whether he himself was the quickest guy EVER. Obviously he is no longer at that point. The difference between him and everyone else is his brain has not expanded while has athleticism fades.

He hasn't worked on his jumper(which is worse), his passing or his positional defense.

I think it's pretty much clear that all contending teams have things working for themselves already... I mean of course Boston, who won a championship with Rondo and Allen won't be sending one of them to the bench. Of Course LA won't be sending D. Fisher or Kobe to the bench... They already did that with Gary Payton and lost to Detroit in the finals, you gotta stick with what's been working.

Better players wont always = Better Team

Every team needs role players. All contenders already have their stars. They have their scorers. Therefore no need to sign Allen Iverson.

People think Iverson couldn't get signed by a contender because he is not good enough or "washed up". He couldn't get signed by a contender because every contender has their scorer already and Iverson made it clear he is not ready to accept being a role player.

Iverson obviously does not want to piggy back a title. He wants to be able to lead and be a top guy. Sadly, all contenders already have that guy.

People keep judging him by their own standards, saying things like "he should come off the bench and settle for a lesser role to win a title". If I had a choice between having Karl Malone's career, or Robert Horry's. I pick Karl Malone. If I could pick between Patrick Ewing's career or Kendrick Perkins, I chose Ewing.

It's pretty obvious Iverson has that same type of mentality. I want to play, I want to contribute in a major way. If I win a title, I want it to be because of me, not because I came off the bench for 20 minutes on an already great team.

I pick Money and Stardom both over rings any day.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

This thread was a decent discussion till here.

Post #34

I say we push to have o_capone banned from AI threads.

He's mostly a one-man army.

I have a difference of opinion with some of you, but others were on the same page as me.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Contenders, playoff teams, fringe playoff teams, non-playoff teams, crappy teams. Nobody wanted him.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Contenders, playoff teams, fringe playoff teams, non-playoff teams, crappy teams. Nobody wanted him.

Clippers, Heat, Knicks, Grizzlies, and Bobcats all expressed interest publicly. I'm sure other teams made contact and when they were told he wants to start a play big minutes they turned the other way.

There were only a select few teams where Iverson could go and be him self.

[JBH3]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

There were only a select few teams where Iverson could go and be him self.

Which is exactly the point. Being "himself" is no longer effective. He has to play w/in a team concept and not be a freelancer, and he's unable to adjust to that.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Which is exactly the point. Being "himself" is no longer effective. He has to play w/in a team concept and not be a freelancer, and he's unable to adjust to that.

It was effective the season before last, which is the last time he was allowed to be his self. He won 50 games. He happened to run in to the Lakers first round but eh, I say being 3rd in scoring and 9th in assist while winning 50 games with a hurt Nene is pretty good. Especially considering that Chauncey Billups comes the next season, shoots a lower fg%, and only wins 4 extra games with a healthy Nene, and gets all the credit in the world for "turning around" the Denver Nuggets.

I wish he had went to Charlotte and they had kept Okafor. That woulda been perfect for him...

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Clippers, Heat, Knicks, Grizzlies, and Bobcats all expressed interest publicly. I'm sure other teams made contact and when they were told he wants to start a play big minutes they turned the other way.

There were only a select few teams where Iverson could go and be him self.

I don't buy any of this.

"Expressed interest" is far from courting

And once again, when he was on the Nuggets, nobody took them seriously.

Winning 50 games doesn't mean much.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

I don't buy any of this.

"Expressed interest" is far from courting

And once again, when he was on the Nuggets, nobody took them seriously.

Winning 50 games doesn't mean much.

when you say nobody took them seriously what do you mean? all of a sudden this season, they don't play the lakers til the conference finals(yes they fell to the same team both years), and Chauncey Billups is a freakin hero...

but anyways, we are beating a dead horse here.....

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Yeah, people say "ran into the Lakers" as if it was just hopeless for no reason at all. If Iverson was as great as you say, it would not have been such a lopsided matchup. They didn't just lose to the Lakers, they got swept easily. Iverson was a complete non-factor in that series. Running and gunning works during the regular season, but teams need to play defense and work the half court in the playoffs, because opponents are much more focused on getting back in transition.

And you've compared Iverson to Rose, CP3 and Steve Nash, but if the Lakers could have gotten any of those players in this off season, Fisher would be coming off the bench, "balee dat"

Of course a good team is not interested in someone who just wants to dribble all the time and make all of the shots, but is significantly worse than every other team's star player. Iverson is not on the level of Kobe, Wade, Lebron, Howard, Melo and so on. He's a fool for wanting their role.

[ex carrabba fan]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

The style the Nuggets played was not going to win them jack outside of the regular season.

When LA matched up against DEN in the first round I was ecstatic, I knew it would basically be a bye week/round. Their half court offense was nothing to be afraid of. Won't even mention their defense.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

you say he is not on their level with no basis for your statement... like i said, last team he was allowed to do him, he was #3 in scoring and #9 in assist on a winning team...

OAKLAND, Calif. -- Grizzlies coach Lionel Hollins, exhausted by the attention placed on one player, refused to answer questions about Allen Iverson's opposition to playing off the bench during a pre-game chat with the media.


No problem. The one person that doesn't mind talking about Allen Iverson is Allen Iverson. For the second time in as many games played, the 34-year-old guard was accessible for a long period of time and candid with his postgame comments in the locker room.


Here is the unfiltered version of a wide-ranging interview Iverson granted the media Wednesday night following the Grizzlies' 115-103 loss to the Golden State Warriors:


Q. How comfortable were you after complaining about your role and playing time in your first game back?

Iverson: I'm doing my job, man. When coach calls on me I go out there and try to help the team win basketball games. That's my whole thing. I just want to help us win basketball games. I'm always comfortable if I'm on the basketball court.


Q. Are you surprised that what you said about not wanting to be a reserve made such big news?

Iverson: Anytime I say something that anybody don't agree with then, yes, it's going to be a big deal. That's what y'all love, right? There ain't no good story if it's a positive story about Allen Iverson. You don't want to talk about me doing charities. You want to talk about me blowing up or something like that, right? It sells doesn't it?


(Not necessarily)


Iverson: In this country it does.


Q. Do you regret saying those things after the first game?

Iverson: I came here to help these guys win basketball games. It's a young team. I see a lot of talent. I just felt like I could help and I'm going to continue to do that. I make mistakes. When I'm upset I say things that I don't mean sometimes. But it's frustrating to not have that come-off-the-bench thing never come up my whole career and then once it came up last year it seems like it's on everybody's mind.


Q. Do you understand what Hollins is trying to do by gradually bringing you along?

Iverson: I understand what he's doing. But he's seen the things I've done. He knows I've never come off the bench in my whole career. He knows that's not something I'm accustomed to. He knows that's not something I would want to do. ...Everybody knows that's not something I want to do.


And I know people are watching my every move and watching to see if I'm sitting over there pouting. My son is at home watching the same thing.


I don't want to be the guy who is a distraction to this squad but everybody knows I'd be fake if I said, 'Yeah, I'm so happy with everything that's going on.' It would just be too fake so I wouldn't even play that game.


Q. How do you reconcile the team trying to develop talent with accomplishing what you want to accomplish as a veteran?

Iverson: Do we want to develop kids or do we want to win basketball games? Obviously, the development comes with playing and practice and being in an NBA environment. But what do we do to win basketball games? That's the most important thing. From everything that I've experienced in the NBA is guys want to win basketball games.


If they would have told me that I was coming to a team ... where this a rebuilding process, it wouldn't have sat well with me. From Day 1, any team I am on, I want to win basketball games. That's why I play the game. I hate losing more than I like winning."


Q. Did Griz brass tell you the franchise was rebuilding?

Iverson: No. Nobody ever said anything about rebuilding. You know I wouldn't have come to a team, at 34 years old, that was in a rebuilding process. I'm trying to win a championship. I thought I would have won a championship by now. I didn't come here for no money. I didn't come here for another scoring title or an All-Star game. I've done all that stuff. I want to win. If we are not trying to win, I have a problem. I'm assuming we are trying to win."

a lil interview from last night

[GSW]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

with all that scoring power they have they should make the playoffs... Let A.I start at PG and let him do his ballhog thing...

he has enough "help"

[Bornindamecca]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

you say he is not on their level with no basis for your statement... like i said, last team he was allowed to do him, he was #3 in scoring and #9 in assist on a winning team...

So you actually think that Allen Iverson is as good as Kobe, Wade, Melo, Lebron, Dwight, Roy, Deron and CP3?

[JBH3]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

Q. How do you reconcile the team trying to develop talent with accomplishing what you want to accomplish as a veteran?

Iverson: Do we want to develop kids or do we want to win basketball games? Obviously, the development comes with playing and practice and being in an NBA environment. But what do we do to win basketball games? That's the most important thing. From everything that I've experienced in the NBA is guys want to win basketball games.

[o_capone]

Re: Guess who already sounds upset in Memphis

So you actually think that Allen Iverson is as good as Kobe, Wade, Melo, Lebron, Dwight, Roy, Deron and CP3?

Kobe, no, Wade, no, Lebron, no, melo, no, no Dwight is someone he can not be compared to, Roy, maybe, d-will, maybe, cp3, no.

I can only judge him based on his last season in Denver. Roy and D-will have gotten better since then, but still neither one of them have been as productive as Iverson was during the 07-08 season. Iverson actually was more productive than Melo that year, but they both played very well...

We are not talking about 5-10 years ago. We are talking about the season before last. The difference is the players you just mentioned have not reached their prime yet. Iverson is past his prime. But not far past it.

Tell me this, do you honestly think it's fair to base your whole opinion on Iverson off of his season in Detroit despite what he did the season before?