The Allen Iverson Saga

[Jukeman]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Sounds so familiar.

Yep!

[slimm44]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

LOL, do you live here?

People are exicted to GO to a Sixers game....

This is what I was responding to.

AI is a good thing for Philly right now and anybody who sees the other way please explain to me how he is not.

I was thinking that we should hold off until praising AI for helping the team win until he earns it, which he very well may, but we don't know yet. I am glad AI brings excitement back to the city and the arena, but that doesn't mean he's going to make them a winner. We are talking about two different things.

Point is, NO ONE can say for sure whether or not he will help the team win.

[Tha_Kid]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Sounds so familiar.

Tell the truth.

[Jukeman]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

This is what I was responding to.



I was thinking that we should hold off until praising AI for helping the team win until he earns it, which he very well may, but we don't know yet. I am glad AI brings excitement back to the city and the arena, but that doesn't mean he's going to make them a winner. We are talking about two different things.

Point is, NO ONE can say for sure whether or not he will help the team win.

who said anything about him turning the team into winners?


Either way, win or lose it is going to be a positive thing fot the Sixers....

Sixers without AI arent bad enuff to get a top 5 pick and arent good enuff to past the first round of the playoffs...

With AI, the sixers get a much better fan base, he give them a chance to win a series...If everything fails, the Sixers still will have more tickets sold, Sixers will still have their same draft position and they would have a scrape goat and that Elton Brand contract wouldnt look so bad lol

Talking about him taking shots away is ludacris...Man took way less shots as a Piston and a Grizzlie not to mention the 18 per game as a Nugget and despite what happen last year, he started in most games he played in so that didnt hurt his shoot attempt stats........

Its funny, people tell the "supporters" to not judge him from the 2001 season but the "doubter" always does this when they talking about him being a chucker lol

it wasnt too early to doubt the man and it to early too praise him(who's praising him anyway?)..Nuff said

[NINJAK2]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

This is what I was responding to.



I was thinking that we should hold off until praising AI for helping the team win until he earns it, which he very well may, but we don't know yet. I am glad AI brings excitement back to the city and the arena, but that doesn't mean he's going to make them a winner. We are talking about two different things.

Point is, NO ONE can say for sure whether or not he will help the team win.

That includes you as well I take it. You or anyone else can't say for certain he won't help correct? If people couldn't comment on things that they thought were going to happen, 50% of the threads at O.S. probably wouldn't exist. Alot are based on opinions and assumptions with no facts to base them on. I will hope for the best. I don't think anyone is praising a.i. here, some just think he may help the team in it's current state.

The guy has a non-guaranteed contract which means at the 1st sign of trouble they can cut the guy loose with no financial burden. It doesn't get any lower risk than that imo. Mean you no disrespect slim.

WWharton-at this point I would have no problem with him taking away minutes from Willie Green as he has had a lot of time to develop into something. He is essentially filling in for Lou, so wouldn't that be like saying when Lou is healthy he is taking away minutes from someone? Jrue will still get his minutes with Lou out as the best position for a.i. is the sg imo which means Jrue could start.. I think Brand may suffer the most due to Eddie not really seeming to like him in the offense and with Young and Speights looking so promising. You could potentially start Jrue, ivy, a.i., young/brand, speights/sammy d. The problem will come when Lou gets back 7-8 weeks from now. Hopefully the Sixers talked to a.i. about what will happen once that day comes in advance with him.

[wwharton]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

WWharton-at this point I would have no problem with him taking away minutes from Willie Green as he has had a lot of time to develop into something. He is essentially filling in for Lou, so wouldn't that be like saying when Lou is healthy he is taking away minutes from someone? Jrue will still get his minutes with Lou out as the best position for a.i. is the sg imo which means Jrue could start.. I think Brand may suffer the most due to Eddie not really seeming to like him in the offense and with Young and Speights looking so promising. You could potentially start Jrue, ivy, a.i., young/brand, speights/sammy d. The problem will come when Lou gets back 7-8 weeks from now. Hopefully the Sixers talked to a.i. about what will happen once that day comes in advance with him.

It's more than minutes. We both agree that taking minutes away from Green is a good thing no matter how you look at it, and honestly, I personally am not ready to say Holliday deserves extended play. My worry would be more about offensive flow, looks, and experience as more than an AI side kick. These kids need touches and not just from offensive rebounds and spotting up for jumpers on passes kicked out (team is actually built horribly in terms of that). Lets say AI retires next year, I don't see how you can depend on any of them really being much better for what they'd be asked to do since their entire game will be changed with AI back on the team.

Also keep in mind, I think it was a good idea, just stating how it will hurt the 6ers in a few years. If the Sixers win a championship then it's a HUGE move... may even call it a bigger sports transaction than the Vikings getting Favre this year. But I personally don't think a championship is possible with that team now or in the near future so that makes the signing a bit of a step back. If I'm running that franchise in today's economy I would've been knocking on his door the day after he left Memphis though.

[JBH3]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

A championship is far-off wishful thinking.

I liked Hollinger's take on this move when asked:

For Sixers: Marketing move, basketball move, or desperation move?

John Hollinger, ESPN.com:
30% marketing, 40% basketball, 30% desperation.

If Lou Williams were healthy, I don't think they'd be looking at Iverson, so I still say the biggest chunk of this is basketball-driven. If he's willing to play for the minimum, he's by far the best player available at that price. But you can make a stronger case that they wouldn't pursue this if they were playing well, or if the arena were selling out every night. It's a perfect confluence of all three, basically.

I can tell you from being a 76er fan that there really was no reason to tune into this team once Louis went down. I enjoyed watching him via Leaguepass, and in the same way I enjoyed him until that damn broken jaw will be the same way I hopefully will enjoy the 6ers now w/ A.I. back in saddle...hopefully...

[Altimus]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

From a financial stand point this is the best thing Philly could have done. Williams out, 2nd worse attendance in the Association and not much risk with brining AI in.

Personally I love the move as it allows me to watch my 2nd all time favorite player play a little longer.

[J.R. Locke]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

The Sixers actually could use Iverson. Louis Williams is fine and could play the 1 or 2. But they have a big problem filling in that wing position next to Iggy.

I am not high on Jrue Holiday. I don't think he was worth a first round pick. He has not real talent...maybe defense?

Lou Williams can come back and play 30+ minutes along with Iverson.

I love the signing.

[3rdAnswer]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Assuming that AI makes it that far, I am excited to see AI and Lou Williams in the backcourt together.

[Altimus]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

The Sixers actually could use Iverson. Louis Williams is fine and could play the 1 or 2. But they have a big problem filling in that wing position next to Iggy.

I am not high on Jrue Holiday. I don't think he was worth a first round pick. He has not real talent...maybe defense?

Lou Williams can come back and play 30+ minutes along with Iverson.

I love the signing.

His play time is limited but from what I have seen Jrue has looked decent. He is still very raw and I think he can be a solid PG one day. Either way with the AI signing his minutes will diminish once again. In 8 weeks he might be completely MIA.

[P2K]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

The Sixers and anybody defending this move need to stop the lies. Getting AI to replace Louis Williams? The Sixers haven't needed Lou or Marreese Speights this whole time. The team can still score.

Now, I know how Wiz fans feel. I said this over at RealGM...I know why Eddie Jordan is a .500 coach. His offensive philosophy works. The Sixers can shoot 3s. They aren't God awful on offense despite bad shooters.

Why his teams are .500 is his idea of a defense. Defending the paint only? Leaving the perimeter wide open? Teams are hitting 3s on us at a 40% clip. Are you serious???

So why would bringing in Iverson help this team? We don't need offense, man! The team sucks on defense and you want to bring in someone that doesn't play defense AT ALL? Nice move.

Mean friggin' while, Jrue is going to be riding bench when he should stay the starter. Even with being in such a horrible defensive scheme, Jrue is a lockdown defender. And with the playing time, his playmaking skills are starting to show more and more. Dude is TALENTED.

Bringing in AI is a pure waste. We don't need HIS offense.

[candiasis]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Primary scorers with better mid-range games (statically) than Iverson - Dirk, Wade, Kobe, Rip (A lot of this has to do with system), Durant, Bosh, Tony Parker, David West, Ben Gordon, Derrick Rose, Danny Granger, Kevin Garnett, OJ Mayo, Brandon Roy, Chris Paul, Josh Howard, Jason Terry, Deron Williams, and Paul Pierce. There are probably more, but I thought I would stop there.

Can you give me something objective that would help your case that Iverson is a good mid-range shooter? I've given you objective and subjective into that go towards proving he is not. HE IS A VERY GOOD SCORER, just not from mid-range.

If you can't bring meat to the table, don't bother coming with anything. If you still want to believe, howbeit blindly, that Iverson has a good mid-range game, go ahead. I don't think I can give you much more to help you see it.

You talk about objectivity when you cite an arbitary statistic and give an arbitatry list of players who all have lower career ppg, many MUCH lower. AI was forced to take as many shots as he did cause he was forced to carry the load offensively, with no reliable even second go to option for 10 years there at philly. Many of the players you list have played with mvps and all stars, not to mention much better surrounding casts then ai ever had the majority of his career. If you're gonna spew a list out like that, give me players who've had at least similar playing careers in terms of the talent they played with, the position they play and the number of shots they were forced to take a game. And for those youngins, get back to me in 10 years.

I get what you're saying but why even focus on a stat like mid range %, it doesn't summarise a guards efficiency or effectiveness by any means. Every career is different ok.

[candiasis]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

The Sixers and anybody defending this move need to stop the lies. Getting AI to replace Louis Williams? The Sixers haven't needed Lou or Marreese Speights this whole time. The team can still score.

Now, I know how Wiz fans feel. I said this over at RealGM...I know why Eddie Jordan is a .500 coach. His offensive philosophy works. The Sixers can shoot 3s. They aren't God awful on offense despite bad shooters.

Why his teams are .500 is his idea of a defense. Defending the paint only? Leaving the perimeter wide open? Teams are hitting 3s on us at a 40% clip. Are you serious???

So why would bringing in Iverson help this team? We don't need offense, man! The team sucks on defense and you want to bring in someone that doesn't play defense AT ALL? Nice move.

Mean friggin' while, Jrue is going to be riding bench when he should stay the starter. Even with being in such a horrible defensive scheme, Jrue is a lockdown defender. And with the playing time, his playmaking skills are starting to show more and more. Dude is TALENTED.

Bringing in AI is a pure waste. We don't need HIS offense.

Well they're ranked 21st in ppg and 20th in opp ppg, so about equally mediocre in both categories. Jrue is gettign what 13 mpg, with ai coming in i wouldnt be too worried that'll be much different. They're also currently on a 7 game losing streak, so can't harm them bringing him in. Personally i hoped he'd wait a little longer and sign with a contender, ah well maybe next year. P2k remember when you said you would not watch a sixers game all season and boycott the team if AI was brought back, you gonna stick to your definitive pronouncement there?

Edit-prob should have combined with my post above, soz, mod can do that if they want.

[P2K]

Re: The Allen Iverson Saga

Well they're ranked 21st in ppg and 20th in opp ppg, so about equally mediocre in both categories. Jrue is gettign what 13 mpg, with ai coming in i wouldnt be too worried that'll be much different. They're also currently on a 7 game losing streak, so can't harm them bringing him in. Personally i hoped he'd wait a little longer and sign with a contender, ah well maybe next year. P2k remember when you said you would not watch a sixers game all season and boycott the team if AI was brought back, you gonna stick to your definitive pronouncement there?

Edit-prob should have combined with my post above, soz, mod can do that if they want.

But offense is still not their problem. It isn't. Not at the moment, at least. They scored over 100 on a nice Western squad in OKC on 50% shooting and were bombing it from the arch...AND STILL LOST. What does that tell you? Same against Mavs.

The problem is defense. Iverson isn't fixing that problem. They don't need him.