The LeBron James Thread

[da ThRONe]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Come on man, that's a horrible comparison, lol.

I won't ignore your point bc of it though... the thing is the man was just saying he was leaving the Cavs and going to the Heat. If you're going to turn that into an hour long TV event that's promoted for days in advance, what exactly did you expect? You say the unnecessary blah questions were wrong but it had no chance of being anything else but that. People are criticizing James bc he seemed to feel that he's so important that bc it's him, this would be interesting. In that sense, you agree with all of those people in that no, Lebron, you're not, lol.

Where you fall short is with the idea that since the benefits of this were so small, the consequences of what it did to the Cavs fans, the team, what the dragging out did to other teams in the hunt, etc, etc were made that much worse. It just wasn't worth it. You don't agree with that... it's cool. But you do recognize what was wrong with the idea in the first place.

My thing is he wasn't wrong for trying to self promote even at the expense of the FO's that were waiting to get his answer. That I fail to see the difference between and hour special and breaking update to inform Cleveland he was leaving. He tried something it back fired, but that doesn't make it wrong.

[KSUowls]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

How is it reaching to say he could give money out of his own pocket instead of what he did if he really was concerned about giving to charity? Barry Bonds is putting Bryan Stow's kids through college with no real gain in it for him. Braylon Edwards is sending 100 kids to college. Andrew Bogut just matched a reward for a missing kid in Australia. Celebrities everywhere do charity work that we don't hear a peep about all the time that isn't solely to promote something. Nobody is flat out criticizing the charity aspect of The Decision, but when someone tries to defend the thing with that part of it as if LeBron needed to do this to raise money then it's not a reach for someone to call them and LeBron's squad out for what they did...LeBron knowing what his decision was, knowing the way he was going about it was wrong and deciding to toss in the charity thing to cover his bases in case people got too pissed off about what he was doing. Thing is they didn't foresee the backlash being quite what it ended up being. Either way, it definitely isn't a reach for someone to say he didn't need to have the biggest ego stroke/screw you to a city in history to give money to charity.

Look a person can give their own money to charity in which case they get a tax break which is great, but they are limited to the amount of money in their possession. This kind of limits the amount of money that is typically donated (like in your examples) whereas "the decision" raised something like $2 million.

Yeah anyone can donate money, but they aren't obligated to do so. So if someone does something that raises money for a good cause whether it was out of their own pocket or is it a promotional event like "the decision" the how isn't so important. What is important is that an organization like the boys and girls club received a bunch of money that they wouldn't have otherwise received. So yes, if you result to criticizing that aspect of the LBJ saga then you are reaching.

Someone mentioned robbing a bank and then giving the money to a charity. The problem with that comparison is that stealing a bunch of money from a bank is an illegal act. You would forcefully be taking money from one group to then give to another which is obviously very different from what went on with the decision.

[BlastX21]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

For everyone who is in the "LeBron is better than Jordan/is Jordan's equal" camp....if Dirk and Chris Paul join Dwight Howard in Orlando in 2012-13....and the Magic win the title...does that mean Dirk is automatically Larry Bird's equal? Or (gasp!) better than the Legend?

This is a really poor comparison. LeBron's numbers are not that far off of Michael's, whereas Dirk's rebounding, blocking, and other things are nowhere near Bird's. If Dirk averaged 28 and 12 throughout his career, then did the same in Orlando despite being with two other dominant players, then yes.



I'm just going to throw this out there: Pippen probably said LeBron is better just to give people more ground to bash him. After all, saying LeBron is better than Great Player X will just cause haters to flock to a post about it and bash him.

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

My thing is he wasn't wrong for trying to self promote even at the expense of the FO's that were waiting to get his answer. That I fail to see the difference between and hour special and breaking update to inform Cleveland he was leaving. He tried something it back fired, but that doesn't make it wrong.

I know that's your point, and though I disagree with it I'm not going to discuss it anymore. I was just explaining that you said there was nothing wrong with The Decision when you also found something wrong with it, and what you found wrong with it is related to the other things that people have a problem with... you just don't have a problem with those other things.

Look a person can give their own money to charity in which case they get a tax break which is great, but they are limited to the amount of money in their possession. This kind of limits the amount of money that is typically donated (like in your examples) whereas "the decision" raised something like $2 million.

Yeah anyone can donate money, but they aren't obligated to do so. So if someone does something that raises money for a good cause whether it was out of their own pocket or is it a promotional event like "the decision" the how isn't so important. What is important is that an organization like the boys and girls club received a bunch of money that they wouldn't have otherwise received. So yes, if you result to criticizing that aspect of the LBJ saga then you are reaching.

Someone mentioned robbing a bank and then giving the money to a charity. The problem with that comparison is that stealing a bunch of money from a bank is an illegal act. You would forcefully be taking money from one group to then give to another which is obviously very different from what went on with the decision.

I made the bank robbing comparison, and I also presented a different way the charity could be introduced into the convo without getting any flack from anyone... but you seem to have skipped the reply to that post.

[Bellsprout]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

Fact: All Cleveland fans should be rooting for LeBron because it's the only way to guarantee he'll lose.

Cold hard facts, Ohioans.

[KSUowls]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I made the bank robbing comparison, and I also presented a different way the charity could be introduced into the convo without getting any flack from anyone... but you seem to have skipped the reply to that post.

When I was making that last post I remembered the thing about the bank comparison. So I brought it up to derail that argument being presented again. Sorry I did not go back and look for the exact post and any replies that may have been presented. Was going off of memory.

[Kashanova]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

"People" are criticizing the notions that LeBron's Decision was for charity and that the charitable aspect was the intention rather than a throw-in for PR.

That was the justification for The Decision. That it was charity.

What I and others are saying is that the charity part was only for PR and was a complete afterthought.

Nobody is saying LeBron isn't charitable or whatever else. The only person reaching is you.

again I Don't agree with the "they did that for the press."

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I still can't believe after all these months we are still going on about this lol.

[Kashanova]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

I still can't believe after all these months we are still going on about this lol.

yeah me either, im sure its going to go on for another year or two

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

You mean even if the Heat win a championship this year. People are going to still talk about "the decision". I wonder when it will stop.

But I will say that sound bite of LeBron saying "not one champion 1,2,3,4,5,6,7..." I getting on my nerves lol

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

When I was making that last post I remembered the thing about the bank comparison. So I brought it up to derail that argument being presented again. Sorry I did not go back and look for the exact post and any replies that may have been presented. Was going off of memory.

lol, my point is in that same post I said people aren't criticizing giving anything to charity, they're just frustrated at the argument that the Decision was fine because the money went to charity. I presented an example of how it could be stated that the charity part of it was good and nobody would argue with it.

[brahmagoul]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

You mean even if the Heat win a championship this year. People are going to still talk about "the decision". I wonder when it will stop.

But I will say that sound bite of LeBron saying "not one champion 1,2,3,4,5,6,7..." I getting on my nerves lol

For me, it will always be a topic until the comparisons to Jordan stops. Yes, I know many greats played for multiple teams, but I think true greats are associated with just one team. I'll make exceptions for Wilt and Kareem, but you associated Jordan with the Bulls, Bird with the C's, Magic with the Lakers, etc.

I hold it against Shaq that he left Orlando for L.A.

So, naturally, I'm always going to hold this against LeBron since I'm from Ohio. Therefore, I will always criticize the Decision because I believe it dulls his legacy.

[jeebs9]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

But I don't know how something off the court. Can effect his legacy on the court. Lets say LeBron is worst at everything. He is the Ron Artest of the league off the court only difference is that he has LeBron's talent. I can understand not respecting him as person. But there is no denying what he does on the floor.

But the worst part is fans hold these thing on the players when the people to blame are the management of the team. Yes they give LeBron whatever he wanted. But at the end of the day they didn't get anyone to deliver.

The Decision idea wasn't wrong. It was the fact that he left teams hanging.

Winning is the most important thing at the end of the day. You play to win. And rings are the difference between Hall of Famer and Greatest of All time.

Shaq wouldn't be in the convo of GOAT if he didn't win rings. Might he have won in Orlando? Who knows? But do I think his legacy as a player is messed up. HeLL No lol

[wwharton]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

For me, it will always be a topic until the comparisons to Jordan stops. Yes, I know many greats played for multiple teams, but I think true greats are associated with just one team. I'll make exceptions for Wilt and Kareem, but you associated Jordan with the Bulls, Bird with the C's, Magic with the Lakers, etc.

I hold it against Shaq that he left Orlando for L.A.

So, naturally, I'm always going to hold this against LeBron since I'm from Ohio. Therefore, I will always criticize the Decision because I believe it dulls his legacy.

I don't think you can hold it against Shaq if you don't against Kareem and Wilt... maybe it's different bc they made the switch before we were paying attention (assuming you're not that old).

It looks like Gibson decided to speak up against his former teammate... http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index....ires_back.html

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Daniel Gibson took issue with some of LeBron James' comments about his former teammates in Cleveland.

After Miami defeated Chicago last week to advance to the NBA Finals, James talked about his decision to join Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh in Miami.

"I wanted to team up with some guys that would never die down in the moment," James said. "The opportunity presented itself with this great organization and we made it happen."

Speaking on The Dugout Sports Show Podcast on Wednesday, Gibson said, "The way it's said, you can't help but take it personal. ... I don't think great players should feel the need to say this about a team or say that about a team. I think what it all boils down to if you're great, you go play great, be great and everybody will realize you're great. And you wouldn't have to let it be known that everybody else was less great.

"Great players shouldn't have to do that.

"So I feel like it's kind of an admission. He might have needed some help. He might have needed to go somewhere and find someone who is a little greater so maybe he wouldn't die down in those moments."

[King_B_Mack]

Re: The LeBron James Thread

But I don't know how something off the court. Can effect his legacy on the court. Lets say LeBron is worst at everything. He is the Ron Artest of the league off the court only difference is that he has LeBron's talent. I can understand not respecting him as person. But there is no denying what he does on the floor.

But the worst part is fans hold these thing on the players when the people to blame are the management of the team. Yes they give LeBron whatever he wanted. But at the end of the day they didn't get anyone to deliver.

The Decision idea wasn't wrong. It was the fact that he left teams hanging.

Winning is the most important thing at the end of the day. You play to win. And rings are the difference between Hall of Famer and Greatest of All time.

Shaq wouldn't be in the convo of GOAT if he didn't win rings. Might he have won in Orlando? Who knows? But do I think his legacy as a player is messed up. HeLL No lol

I still think The Decision was wrong. It was wrong because it was a giant ego stroke for LeBron. He and the other two had made they're decisions and like a day before the Decision, Wade and Bosh were on Sportscenter together and made the announcement that they were signing with Miami. LeBron could have been on Sportscenter with them to announce that the three of them were going to sign together in Miami. But no no, LeBron had to have the extra ego stroke of this hour long special and everybody talking about JUST him.

I still don't get why when it comes to LeBron people act like he's being treated so differently or something. People simply do not like the kind of arrogant, pompous attitude that he's displayed in recent memory. It's been no different in any factor of life really. People kill guys like Chad Johnson all the time for his dancing and off the field stuff, but for whatever reason there isn't some secret society of defenders jumping at every sign of negativity thrown at Chad like they do LeBron and the Heat. People can't stand Terrell Owens for the exact same behaviour that LeBron is exhibiting but not a damn person breaks they're neck trying to uphold everything he does because he's treated unfairly. Bottomline The Decision didn't have to happen and pretty much every possible reason for it's inception is a negative one. They wanted to keep up the charade of the three of them having not preplanned where they were going and the 'free agent tour' was a sham. LeBron wanted to show he was bigger than Wade and Bosh and Miami was going to be his team. He was pissed that Cleveland fans booed him during the Boston series and he wanted to stick it to them and Cavs management by clowning them on national television. Eitherway, the Decision was a bad idea, which is pretty much a fact at this point considering it hasn't helped LeBron in any way and turned out to be a career damaging move.