NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

[Kashanova]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

Here's what the players should tell jordan.

According to players, Pollin said about his fellow owners, "You just have to trust us."

Jordan fired back, saying, "You've got to trust our negotiators." Jordan also blasted owners for not bargaining in good faith in the offseason and said to Pollin, "If you can't make a profit, you should sell your team."

[23]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

SAS interviews David Stern on ESPN radio

http://espn.go.com/espnradio/play?id=7205800

Its a good listen

I'd outline some talking points but would rather guys listen themselves...actually here are some

Abridged version

Stern admits there is a contingency of owners who want a deal better than 50/50 that favors them. Stern says he's satisfied negotiations went to 50/50 even though some owners don't like it.

SAS plays devil's advocate and voices NBPA cocerns: We, as the players, have given back everything from BRI, MLE, sign & trades, etc. Where do we draw the line?

Stern goes back to the argument that NBPA is highest paid union in the world. While 50/50 draws the avg. salary back from $5.4+ million to a little over $5 million but the avg. salary will rise to over $7 million over the life of the contract. NBPA needs to understand that a time when national unemployment is at 9% and people are hurting. THey need to realize

After Stern leaves the interview, SAS says Stern isn't joking and that the BRI will drop to 47% and implement a hard cap.

SAS: Those who have leverage dictate things.

SAS disputes that Stern is racist. NBA has way more black players (% wise), coaches, and upper management than MLB, NFL, and NHL.

He says that this is a black issue. Nationally, there is 30% black male unemployment, 50% black youth unemployment, etc. and yet the players want to call Stern a racist.

SAS quotes Anthony Parker (Cavaliers) Decertification does not mean that we don't want a season. We can decertify and still have time for a season.
-SAS says Parker is stupid and that time is up.

Takes callers:
Caller #1 - says that players will have to take 8% paycut. That's not fair.
SAS says that he even agrees 8% is a lot but the players are in a special category. THey don't have any more leverage.

Caller #2 - Which teams will benefit from a short season

Caller #3 - Won't the players have to accept even less BRI 10 years from now when the deal is over.
SAS says don't talk about 10 years from now when we have problems in the present. No one knows what will happen in 10 years. You'll get to that, when it comes.

Caller #4 - What happens if NBPA decertifies?
SAS - Union no longer exists and individual players can sue the league a la the NFL with Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, and Drew Brees (although they really didn't decertify). Also the NFL went from giving the players 60% BRI to 48% in their agreement.

[TN3LL]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

alanhahn Alan Hahn
If #NBPA wants to turn the tables, just emerge today saying "We'll take this deal if.." and name a few changes. Pressure now on owners.

i wonder if the players would consider doing this

[23]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

There is no pressure on the owners, but im not sure even if that'll happen if reports are correct that Billy Hunter is definitely not looking to even consider this one.

[WTF]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

If that happens, the owners will laugh, and we'll be locked out even further... Please... someone let them know that "this" is as good as it's going to get.

[23]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

Its an ultimatum so there is not too much tweaking the players can do

The offer is going to drop if they keep up the same business as usual attitude and we've talked about this extensively already

Kash..what if the MJ leak was purposely done to give the players a heads up to let them know hey guys take the deal the owners are serious and really united

Even Magic has said take the deal

Also I didnt know the league gave Ron Artest all of his money back from the suspension from the Palace fight because of his medical condition and his not being able to afford anything afterwards

[aholbert32]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

If that happens, the owners will laugh, and we'll be locked out even further... Please... someone let them know that "this" is as good as it's going to get.

I actually disagree. If the players came back with "You get the BRI, just give us what we want on length of guaranteed contracts and sign and trade for tax teams..we will accept the deal", the owners would be foolish not to accept that and public sentiment would flip.

[Kashanova]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

Its an ultimatum so there is not too much tweaking the players can do

The offer is going to drop if they keep up the same business as usual attitude and we've talked about this extensively already

Kash..what if the MJ leak was purposely done to give the players a heads up to let them know hey guys take the deal the owners are serious and really united

Even Magic has said take the deal

Also I didnt know the league gave Ron Artest all of his money back from the suspension from the Palace fight because of his medical condition and his not being able to afford anything afterwards

I can definitely see that leak being a heads up for the players.

[WTF]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I actually disagree. If the players came back with "You get the BRI, just give us what we want on length of guaranteed contracts and sign and trade for tax teams..we will accept the deal", the owners would be foolish not to accept that and public sentiment would flip.

To each their own, I just don't see it happening. I think its an ultimatum... this... or it gets worse from here. I hope I'm wrong, and we can salvage the season, or what's rest of it, so they can go back to showing the NBA Cares commercials...

[aholbert32]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

To each their own, I just don't see it happening. I think its an ultimatum... this... or it gets worse from here. I hope I'm wrong, and we can salvage the season, or what's rest of it, so they can go back to showing the NBA Cares commercials...

One thing to remember is that even with all this talk of hardliners...there are only 10-12 of them. There are an equal number of teams willing to do what it takes to make a deal. That leaves 6 teams that can swing the balance of the deal and I doubt they would be willing to kill a season over small system issues especially if the players fold on BRI.

[cjonesfan921]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I'm honestly all in on no season. I think it's clear the NBA needs to fix the system and that means to do away with guaranteed contracts, hard cap, etc.

[23]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I dont think they want to lose a season either, but I do think the deal is about to get worse if players dont accept

Why?

Time

[23]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I can definitely see that leak being a heads up for the players.

From MJ...

[aholbert32]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I'm honestly all in on no season. I think it's clear the NBA needs to fix the system and that means to do away with guaranteed contracts, hard cap, etc.

I'm not in for it at all. I dont believe that a hard cap and guaranteed contracts does much for competitive balance. A hard cap isnt going to make Lebron James want to play in Charlotte. I think the current system offer by the NBA strikes enough of a balance between what the league wants and what the players want.

[cjonesfan921]

Re: NBA Lockout and Collective Bargaining Agreement Discussion

I'm not in for it at all. I dont believe that a hard cap and guaranteed contracts does much for competitive balance. A hard cap isnt going to make Lebron James want to play in Charlotte. I think the current system offer by the NBA strikes enough of a balance between what the league wants and what the players want.

While I agree with the bold-ed part, my opinion is just based on what I think is right, not necessarily whats a fair balance between two sides.

I have seen too many instances where players play 'hard' on their contract year, bank on it, and then, never live up to it. Owners/Teams need some protection in this area.

Also, players may not want to go there, but a hard cap makes sense. While I agree that yes it will not make certain players go places, it will also assure if a Miami Heat situation occurs, those guys will all take SEVERE pay cuts.