NBA Off Topic

[phenom1990]

Re: NBA Off Topic

That being said..there is nothing fundamentally wrong with either Crawford nor Wall's jump shots.

A time has to come when we stop making excuses for professional athletes.

How bad do they want it?

I didn't make an excuse for Crawford but for Wall. some times you can only improve so much. If Crawford has been in the league for so long; while other guys that have worked much harder than him have struggled. I think it speaks to the fact that some things you can control and others you can't. Some guys are just naturally more talented than others. This past 2 seasons may have finally been the time where Lamar Odom candy diet caught up to him.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: NBA Off Topic

I didn't make an excuse for Crawford but for Wall. some times you can only improve so much. If Crawford has been in the league for so long; while other guys that have worked much harder than him have struggled. I think it speaks to the fact that some things you can control and others you can't. Some guys are just naturally more talented than others. This past 2 seasons may have finally been the time where Lamar Odom candy diet caught up to him.

Yup.

I'm sure Rondo has been working on his jumper for the last few years, especially with hearing from folks how horrible it is, but that doesn't mean he'll all of a sudden become some great or even good from outside.

I mean Duhwight was working with Hakeem on his postgame and it still doesn't look much better than it was and now supposedly, he's working with Kareem. Even Tyson Chandler and Amar'e Stoudamire JUST started working with him(guys that been in the league 10 years and are NOW putting an emphasis on that part of their game)but I don't expect their postgames to look THAT much better than it was before.

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: NBA Off Topic

I didn't make an excuse for Crawford but for Wall. some times you can only improve so much. If Crawford has been in the league for so long; while other guys that have worked much harder than him have struggled. I think it speaks to the fact that some things you can control and others you can't. Some guys are just naturally more talented than others. This past 2 seasons may have finally been the time where Lamar Odom candy diet caught up to him.

And that clearly separates the elite players from the middle of the pack.

I refuse to believe you can only improve so much if you refuse to put the work in to do so.

Tons and tons of guys with 'natural talent' that never made the league. You could easily pick the players that are just relying on natural talent and not taking the necessary steps to enhance their game.

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: NBA Off Topic

Yup.

I'm sure Rondo has been working on his jumper for the last few years, especially with hearing from folks how horrible it is, but that doesn't mean he'll all of a sudden become some great or even good from outside.

I mean Duhwight was working with Hakeem on his postgame and it still doesn't look much better than it was and now supposedly, he's working with Kareem. Even Tyson Chandler and Amar'e Stoudamire JUST started working with him(guys that been in the league 10 years and are NOW putting an emphasis on that part of their game)but I don't expect their postgames to look THAT much better than it was before.

Who said they need to be great, or even good. How about improved.

If you're saying that Dwight is not an improved post player since working with Hakeem..then me and you disagree on the subject.

What about arguably 2 of the best (and most talented) players in the league..Kobe and LeBron..working on their games each summer. Clearly to them relying on their natural talent wasn't good enough for them.

LeBron worked with Hakeem and to me didn't even have a good post game. But it was improved. And it expanded his game.

I'm sure Larry Bird didn't sit around in his summers playing pickup games like Jamal Crawford.

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: NBA Off Topic

Amare Stoudemire out 2-3 weeks with a ruptured cyst in his left knee. Will miss season opener minimum.

[The 24th Letter]

And that clearly separates the elite players from the middle of the pack..

So where does that leave players like Timmy or Pierce who typically take the summers off? I'd say they have held up pretty well...

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: NBA Off Topic

So where does that leave players like Timmy or Pierce who typically take the summers off? I'd say they have held up pretty well...

I have no idea about Pierce. Could it be why he starts seasons so slowly? I don't know.

Duncan is probably the most fundamentally sound big man to ever play the game. A guy that can hit shots off the glass as easily as others do lay ups. I'd say he is the ultimate exception to the rule.

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: NBA Off Topic

That being said..there is nothing fundamentally wrong with either Crawford nor Wall's jump shots.

A time has to come when we stop making excuses for professional athletes.

How bad do they want it?

For what it's worth, I think Wall's shot in particular is fundamentally ****ed up. His footwork is incredibly bad and if I remember right, he kinda palms the ball when he shoots it. It's just ugly all-around.

[Jukeman]

I cant help but think about the scene from Above The Rim where the old head told Kyle Watson to spread his fingers and since then he's been nailing jumpers throughout the entire movie lol.

I know its a movie but you have to wonder about the little details in a player's mechanics that may be holding him back despite shooting 1000 jumpers a day in the offseason.

Rondo's hands are so big that he tends to palm the ball while shooting and the John Wall comment about his footwork is spot on too!


-Juke

[bigeastbumrush]

Re: NBA Off Topic

For what it's worth, I think Wall's shot in particular is fundamentally ****ed up. His footwork is incredibly bad and if I remember right, he kinda palms the ball when he shoots it. It's just ugly all-around.

So why not work on it?

#1 draft pick can't afford to hire a shooting coach?

[Yeah...THAT Guy]

Re: NBA Off Topic

So why not work on it?

#1 draft pick can't afford to hire a shooting coach?

Oh, I'm not saying he can't work on it. I'm just saying he has a ****load of changes to make to his shot. Might just be better to always be a below average shooter and just work on building up the rest of his game.

[The 24th Letter]

I cant help but think about the scene from Above The Rim where the old head told Kyle Watson to spread his fingers and since then he's been nailing jumpers throughout the entire movie lol.

I know its a movie but you have to wonder about the little details in a player's mechanics that may be holding him back despite shooting 1000 jumpers a day in the offseason.

In the same breath, some players have some terrible forms fundamentally, but are still effective shooting the ball...

Paul Pierce, Kevin Martin come to mind...

Touch is just as important as form...and some players just naturally don't have that touch...

[phenom1990]

Re: NBA Off Topic

So why not work on it?

#1 draft pick can't afford to hire a shooting coach?

Evan Turner worked with Herb Magee (a shooting savant), last summer and his jumper didn't significantly improve.

[KG]

Re: NBA Off Topic

In the same breath, some players have some terrible forms fundamentally, but are still effective shooting the ball...

Paul Pierce, Kevin Martin come to mind...

Touch is just as important as form...and some players just naturally don't have that touch...

You think PP's form is that bad?

I think it's pretty decent, slow as hell, but pretty good considering that when he came into the league he was purely a slasher. His footwork IMO is/was second best to Kobe's. I saw a lot of him in college and he's a player who improved over his career, must have put some time in.

Wall's shot will improve WHEN he slows down and learns to play at different speeds.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: NBA Off Topic

Evan Turner worked with Herb Magee (a shooting savant), last summer and his jumper didn't significantly improve.

Exactly. Working with every legend in the world isn't going improve your overall game right away. This isn't 2K where guys can go to the Larry Bird Shooting Drill and have their shooting rating improve by 20-30 pts just like that.

With Wall, if he develops just an average jump shot, then he'll be fine. He's never going to be a guy where you have to respect his jumper from anywhere and with his style and his game, he doesn't need that. He just needs to develop it as a fallback option in case he can't "Hold Right Trigger" his way into the paint for a layup every time.

As for Hakeem, I've asked this question before and never got an answer but what is the hype about working with him and how many players have came back looking significantly better than they did prior to working with him?