You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

I think he's waiting for ANYONE to mention Gasol (old, young, whatever), lol. Honestly though, he's right, Gasol deserves a mention with the older group. I also don't think his post game is fading... they've gone away from it but I bet he still has it in him.

I still don't understand why he started to float away from the Basket because it wasn't like his post game was declining.

Maybe he wanted to prove to people that he could do more than just play in the post, who knows.

[VDusen04]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

The Post game isnt Lost.

Pau Gasol
Kevin Garnett
Greg Monroe
David West
Roy Hibbert
Lamar Odom
Kobe Bryant
Zach Randolph
LeBron James
Dwayne Wade
Rasheed Wallace
Amare Stoudamire
Carmelo Anthony
Andrew Bynum
Jermaine O'Neal
LeMarcus Aldridge
Tim Duncan
DeMarcus Cousins
Al Jefferson
Nene Hilario

Are they on McHale's level? Nah, but they still get their from the elbow down if needed.

That's a solid list. I think there's a wide variation of post ability among players on that list, but it's a solid list nonetheless. Kevin McHale's clearly on a different level than 99% of post players throughout history (not just modern day). But just regarding the idea of posting up as an art, Greg Monroe was one of the first young bucks to come to mind.

I wouldn't say being on the block is the primary weapon of any of those guys outside of maybe Bynum and Nene, its an after thought. Back in the day there were guys who just went to work on the block on virtually every possession, you don't see that anymore.

Not including the older guys, I feel as though Monroe, Aldridge, Hibbert, Jefferson, and Randolph are also post-first guys. I suppose I'll have to admit I don't see a ton of Aldridge though so I don't know for sure.

Of course, as I already mentioned, their post moves pale in comparison to McHale's, but that's going to happen when comparing guys to one of the top post players of all-time.

Sometimes I wonder if any of the guys in today's game could do some work on the block.

It's tough for me to say they can't because I've actually rarely saw any if them even have the opportunity.

Post play just isn't utilized the way it once was.

If you look back, guys like Ewing, Shaq, Robinson, etc were averaging as many shot attempts as guys like Kobe, Melo, Durant.. Big men just aren't used the way they once were.

Dominating post men have diminished, but as a huge David Robinson fan, I'm not sure if I can say in good faith that his back-to-the-basket game was absolutely incredible. It was still effective, but he kind of moved like a baby deer in that position and very much preferred facing up.

[SteelersFreak]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Not including the older guys, I feel as though Monroe, Aldridge, Hibbert, Jefferson, and Randolph are also post-first guys. I suppose I'll have to admit I don't see a ton of Aldridge though so I don't know for sure.

You're right on Monroe, I forgot about him a bit, he's got some potential to be a solid post player throughout his career. Aldridge I feel like plays about 50/50, he's also a 4 so his game is a bit different, but you're right, his post game is solid. Hibbert is pretty bad offensively, that's clearly not his strong point. You're right on Jefferson but I still see Randolph as a face-up guy, he gets a lot of points down low because he busts his *** down there but he still seems like a guy who would rather shoot over you.

[wwharton]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

I still don't understand why he started to float away from the Basket because it wasn't like his post game was declining.

Maybe he wanted to prove to people that he could do more than just play in the post, who knows.

Did he though? I don't watch enough Lakers games to really say, but it seems like a combination of not fitting into the offense as well and not gelling with another big clogging the block. That's obvious with Dwight but I always thought he was better when Bynum wasn't on the floor too, even though they worked okay together.

As for the whole discussion, are people distinguishing between being able to get great post position (to catch and shoot/dunk) and great post play (catch, see there's no double team, put together a string of moves for a bucket)?

[TajDeni]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

If you look back, guys like Ewing, Shaq, Robinson, etc were averaging as many shot attempts as guys like Kobe, Melo, Durant.. Big men just aren't used the way they once were.

this is exactly what i posted awhile back when i posted that it seem that ppl only keep track of how many shots attempts you take per game if your a backcourt player and your the #1 option.

because nobody ever seemed to complain when centers were taking 20+ shots per game. obviously they are alot closer to the basket. however if said center is good enough to demand 20+ shots/g, then he is also taking his fair share of shots against double teams.

and whether front or backcourt your #1 option has to be able to score against double teams or he's not a true #1 scoring option.

--------

far as gasol his post game is still there, he just not used like he should be. you see when dwight was out and he was the featured big, he got right back to putting in that work on the block.

also if i said that id take prime hakeem/duncan/gasol's post game over prime mchale's is that crazy talk? and if so, how so,cause im not sold that it is?

[Streaky McFloorburn]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

also if i said that id take prime hakeem/duncan/gasol's post game over prime mchale's is that crazy talk? and if so, how so,cause im not sold that it is?

It's not crazy talk. McHale's moves as an entire body of work are unrivaled, but he got away with a TON of traveling. More than half of the OP's video showed obvious pivot foot lifting/switching prior to the first dribble, or the same plus two or more steps after picking it up. Watch Hakeem closely and you'll see much better pivot foot planting, with only slightly less creativity and greater athleticism, while Duncan and Gasol are less exciting and agile but consistently more accurate (and legal) with their footwork.

Blake Griffin hasn't been mentioned, but he's actually shown some good post footwork at times, just not the touch to score over people when he can't use his leaping ability or the willingness to go down there often (probably in part due to his free-throw difficulties). I think he actually has the potential to develop into a great post player once he realizes that nearly every athletic phenom, shooting specialist, or undersized star player in NBA history had to develop a reliable back-to-the-basket game or team up with a good post player before they won a championship.

[d11king]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Did he though? I don't watch enough Lakers games to really say, but it seems like a combination of not fitting into the offense as well and not gelling with another big clogging the block. That's obvious with Dwight but I always thought he was better when Bynum wasn't on the floor too, even though they worked okay together.

As for the whole discussion, are people distinguishing between being able to get great post position (to catch and shoot/dunk) and great post play (catch, see there's no double team, put together a string of moves for a bucket)?

I don't know if you're referring to Pau but I doubt Pau went to the coaches and said hey I wanna shoot 3's haha. He's really been forced out of the post the past 2 seasons which IMO is why he's struggling and why the Lakers have struggled as well. He and Bynum were a perfect fit together, but as Bynum got better and became the #2 option, both Mike Brown and Mike Antoni must've felt that he would be much better 15 feet away from the rim. Plus, Pau was the perfect power forward for the Lakers, especially in the Triangle offense which I still don't understand why they went away from it, with Pau's terrific post play and his excellent passing skills, he was at his best and the Lakers went to 3 straight Finals.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

I started noticing him doing that in Phil's last year towards the end of the season and into the playoffs.

[InthePaint]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Pau is 32, he's not a member of the young generation either, and his abilities in the post have faded considerably.

I don't see what you're arguing, I never said there weren't any players in the league with abilities to play down on the block, I said there aren't any young guys, and there aren't.

The OP said the art was dead. I listed players old and young who are still committed to the inside game.

Your interpretation as just young players is on you.

[SteelersFreak]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

The OP said the art was dead. I listed players old and young who are still committed to the inside game.

Your interpretation as just young players is on you.

If no one young is practicing the art, the art is essentially dead.

[InthePaint]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

If no one young is practicing the art, the art is essentially dead.

There are a handful of young players "practicing" the ART. Just because they arent the focal point of the modern offense or scoring like McHale doesnt mean its dead.

[JazzMan]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Tim Duncan is not a player from this generation. There are NO young big men with any sort of solid back-to-the-basket post game. Roy Hibbert is borderline terrible offensively and the rest are all face up guys or are in the league due to their defensive capabilities.

Al Jefferson anybody?

He came straight out of high school with a great back-to-the-basket post game.

He's nearly unstoppable on the left block.

[d11king]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Al Jefferson anybody?

He came straight out of high school with a great back-to-the-basket post game.

He's nearly unstoppable on the left block.

I've heard his name countless times when the conversation of whose got the best post game in the league.

[ojandpizza]

It's hands down Jefferson.. But the inside game isn't used enough anymore for him to become a big time factor.

I think plenty of big men in today's game would actually be better players if they played in the 80s or 90s..

Sure they'd face some better low post competition but their skills would develop nicely if they got fed the ball the way players did then... Plus this zone stuff messes everything up as well.

[SteelersFreak]

Re: You don't see post men with an unstoppable game like this anymore!

Al Jefferson anybody?

He came straight out of high school with a great back-to-the-basket post game.

He's nearly unstoppable on the left block.

You must've missed the post where someone mentioned Jefferson and I told him he was right about Jefferson being a solid post player.

No need to get all upset every time someone takes a perceived shot at your boys in Salt Lake.