whos better

[J_Train]

Re: whos better

ive gone for Kobe, cause well......he's better

[Admiral50]

Re: whos better

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Yeah,AI respects his team enough not to show up for practice



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...and Kobe saying he is the best player on the team and the offence is being wasted while they continue to go to Shaq, is that respect?

How about McGrady... during the playoff series against Charlotte (yes, not after - during!) he says the reason Baron Davis is playing well and getting triple doubles is because he has a much better team around him and McGrady says he can't do the same on his own team because they suck.

...yeah much respect.

Iverson sticks up for every player on his team and does the same for coach Brown, even though he continues to say crap about Iverson all year.

Get some knowledge before you post...

[bubbachuck]

Re: whos better

nice comeback admiral! I was gonna say the same thing!

[JayH1285]

Re: whos better

Alright Hat, how can you even say that AI is not in Kobe's league? Kobe had a MUCH better supporting cast. If he was doubled, he could just dump it into Shaq for the easy slam or swing it out to Fox/Horry for a trey. Hell, because of his cast, he was barely doubled, so he constantly faced 1v1. What the hell did AI have? Nobody, with the exception of McKie. AI is NOT overrated. He carried the team on HIS BACK. He knew that he had to score 40+ a game in order for his team to win. How bout Kobe? The burden laid on him isn't nearly half as heavy. He could just rely on Shaq to take over the game. AI coudln't rely on anybody else.

Here's how imma lay it down
1. AI - hands down
2. T-Mac - gonna get better with Hill coming back
3. Kobe - lets see how you do when Shaq's out for surgery this season

Oh yeah, and Hat, i'm not a "hardcore AI supporter". And I'm still waiting for your reasons why kobe is better.

[ZigZag]

Re: whos better

Here's how imma lay it down
1. AI - hands down
2. T-Mac - gonna get better with Hill coming back
3. Kobe - lets see how you do when Shaq's out for surgery this season
JayH1285, Im which you all the way son. There are a LOT of Kobe riders on this board. And another thing I guest a lot of those "Kobe" "fans" wasnt watching the 01 playoffs because if they were they would of seen the 8 minutes runs of no scoring. Yes, Im aware of there awards but they dont mean a dam thing come playoff time. Its either you win or go home. Every team takes their gameto another level. So 6-8 min. of no scoring doesnt cut it. So you cant tell me that that Sixers team wasnt garbage. And you cant tell me that A.I. didnt carry that team into the playoffs. And have you forgot that the Sixers barely made the finals. Does Carter's last second shot ring a bell? or Maybe, Allen's 3pt frenzies ? So dont come talking about Kobe's better just because he won 3 titles. So until he proves to not only me but to fans and to himself that he can carry a team then he will never truly be the best 2g in the L.

P.S. Yall need to stop watching ESPN highlights, and watch an actual game.

P.S. I aint a Kobe ***** &amp; I aint a A.I. rider, Im just a fan of the game. THATS MY WORD.

[Admiral50]

Re: whos better

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
P.S. Yall need to stop watching ESPN highlights, and watch an actual game.

P.S. I aint a Kobe ***** &amp; I aint a A.I. rider, Im just a fan of the game. THATS MY WORD.



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Well said. I'm similar to that second point.

[swigfall]

Re: whos better

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
P.S. Yall need to stop watching ESPN highlights, and watch an actual game.

P.S. I aint a Kobe ***** &amp; I aint a A.I. rider, Im just a fan of the game. THATS MY WORD.

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couldn't of said it any better

1-TMac-hes just a complete player,he does it all
2-AI-He has a low fg% not only because of bad outside shots, but because he misses alot of high percentage shots, he misses alot of those ugly floaters and layups. But to be a 6'0" 2guard and play the way he does, puts him atleast #2
3-Kobe-inconsistant, had to be punked by shaq to pass the ball, and he think he's better than his other teammates but without them, he wouldn't even be thought about even being cosidered a decent 2guard.

[HatTrick]

Re: whos better

Most of the obvious Kobe arguments have already been made. When I said that Iverson is overrated, I agree that was a bit of an overstatement on my part. He IS a great player, but neither he nor T-Mac has hit anywhere near the number of big shots Kobe has.

Sure it wouldn't be as easy without Shaq, but Shaq sure as heck couldn't do it without Kobe either. Yes, Iverson took his team to the Finals - carried them on his back, as someone said. But the thing you're overlooking is that THEY CAME OUT OF THE EASTERN CONFERENCE. There were easily at least three other teams in the west besides the Lakers that were better than the 76ers that year.

And Kobe puts up huge numbers despite having Shaq out there sharing the offensive load with him. Both Iverson and T-Mac don't really have any other major offensive weapons around them (with the exception of Hill if he's healthy).

All three are excellent defensive players, so that's a wash, although Kobe and T-Mac are at a bit of an advantage because their size allows to be more versatile in who they guard.

Anyway, all I'm trying to say is that all three are great players, but think about it this way. If you were building a team, and had to start with one of the three, would you really choose Iverson before the other two?

For my money, Kobe and T-Mac are clearly better "franchise" type players that you would want to build a team around. But hey, to each his own.

[HatTrick]

Re: whos better

Oh yeah, and to say that Kobe is a "hopeful" that "hasn't proven himself" over the course of several years is pure ignorance. He's what, a seven year veteran now who has won three straight titles, hitting tons of huge shots along the way. If that's not proving yourself, then I don't know what is.

Also, saying that he "wouldn't even be thought about even being cosidered a decent 2guard" (sic) without his teammates belongs in the same category. Yes, Kobe has learned some tough lessons about putting the team first, but to say that he'd be no good on another team shows a pretty obvious lack of NBA knowledge. I mean, I'm not a big Iverson fan, and even less of a Vince Carter fan, but I'm not going to sit here and try to make the argument that they flat out suck or are only good because of lucky circumstances. That's just plain weak.

P.S. - And he's only 24. Imagine how good he'll be when he's 27 or 28. Same argument can be made for T-Mac, of course.

[Admiral50]

Re: whos better

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
has won three straight titles, hitting tons of huge shots along the way


<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

No, Kobe hasn't 'won' three titles. He's been a good contributer on a team with the most dominant player in the league, that won three titles.
There were plenty of guys in other teams over the years that did the same and collected rings, but they were never hailed as one of the best players. As long as he has Shaq, he won't be rated by me. Swap Kobe with the dodgy team that Iverson took to the finals, and that 76ers team probably doesn't even make the playoffs.

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Re: whos better

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Swap Kobe with the dodgy team that Iverson took to the finals, and that 76ers team probably doesn't even make the playoffs.


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that's probably one of the stupidest things i've heard yet. I hope you don't actually believe yourself. Anyways, one point, everyone is saying that AI is better because he's so small and has to work so hard for shots, rebounds etc. The was i see it, the fact that he's small is one of the reasons why he's not as good as Kobe and T-Mac. So the fact that Kobe and T-Mac are both 6-8ish gives them even more of an advantage over AI and is another plus in their columns.

[Admiral50]

Re: whos better

Of course I believe it you goose, why the hell would I bother saying it? And even though that's a personal opinion and everyone has one, I've seen enough NBA over the last 15 years to know what I'm talking about.

Have you, do you?

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Re: whos better

well if you believe that then maybe you need to watch the NBA for another 15 years, 'cause that's just stupid. And you can't use the excuse "it's my opinion" because opinions can be uninformed, in this case your's obviously is.

[Scoop 24]

Re: whos better

Kobe ,Iverson, and Tmac which one is better? heres my opinion on it.

Iverson took his team on his back to the finals? So what did Aaron Mckie do to be the 6th man of the year and Deke do to be defensive player of the year. i guess they didnt do nothing to help.

Tracy Mcgrady- CArry his team to the playoffs w/o grant hill well if memory serves me correct D.Armstrong and co went to the playoffs the year before mcgrady got there.So if mcgrady was carring his team he needs to take them out the 1st round.

Kobe-Only a good contributer..but only win championships b/c of shaq. well i dont see shaq taking the clutch sshots to win the game. if you wanna be technical they werent winng sh!t till PJ got there. and y didnt shaq win the championship in orlando.So my thinkings he does a bit more than just contribute.

IMO Kobe and tmac are on the same level. Tmac is a better 3 point shooter but is not better than kobe with the mid range jumper kobes fade away is damn near unstoppable. hell even in the slam magazine Tmac said kobe is closet player to his level after saying himself was best player in the game.

as iverson he's no sloch he will light that a$$ any night but he does it in about 20-25 more shots than tmac and kobe do it. if you argument is iverson may not have the hieght and he still does all of that scoring you also have to remember iverson is probly the fastest player in the nba and with his dribble he can get to the basket just as easy as kobe and tmac can.

Defensivly kobe is a all-league defender and iverson is always one of the top 3 stealers in the game. Mcgrady is good defensivly put he is like carter doesnt play defense game in game out.
so heres how i ranked them

1. Tmac&amp;kobe
2.Iverson

P.S if you feel u can jude kobe of what the team does in the beginning of the season your way off. the team is not built for kobe the team is built to compliment shaqmost of the guys are shooter on the lakers kobe is the X-factor for shaq. and with hill at a 100% orlando should easliy take the east and lets see if Mcgrady can tune down his game for grant hill.

Like i said just my opinion

[JayH1285]

Re: whos better

Nokio, your post is VERY misleading.......

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
Iverson took his team on his back to the finals? So what did Aaron Mckie do to be the 6th man of the year and Deke do to be defensive player of the year. i guess they didnt do nothing to help.

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Ok, what the hell is up with you guys and your obsession with award"? Defensive player of the year? Do you really think that 2-3 blocks a game makes that much of a difference? Sure, Deke was a tight defender, but a few stops don't mean jack if YOU CAN'T SCORE. Do you not understand the basic concept of basketball? Whoever has the most points wins. As for McKie, considering he was basically the 2nd most productive player on the Sixers and was Sixth Man of the Year, what the hell does that make the starting lineup with the exception of AI? TRASH!

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
well i dont see shaq taking the clutch sshots to win the game.

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lol dude, games that Kobe hit clutch shots on wouldn't even have been close had Shaq not been on the team. Wow, Shaq doesn't hit clutch shots. He only scores at least 30-40 points a game, dominates the paint defensively, brings the oppositng team into foul trouble, and creates good looks for his teammates.

</font><blockquote><font class="small">In reply to:</font><hr />
as iverson he's no sloch he will light that a$$ any night but he does it in about 20-25 more shots than tmac and kobe do it.

<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Yeah the thing is, AI has to light that @$$ EVERY night in order for the Sixers to have reached the finals. Hell, if Kobe had off days, which he did, the lakers could've just relied on Shaq or Fox/Horry to step it up.

Imma say this one last time... Kobe has YET to prove that he has the ability to carry a team without the help of the best player in the league. AI has. You can talk all you want about how talented Kobe is. But until he proves otherwise, AI WILL ALWAYS BE NUMBER 1