NBA Off Topic Thread

[ojandpizza]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Not to mention the Lue thing.. they could currently have one of the best coaches in the league with Laker-ties as he used to play for them, won championships with them.. instead they gave him a slap to the face insinuating he can only coach if Bron is around to just hire some other guy who’s never even been a head coach before the contact they should have offered Lue.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

I mean yes, but I think the takeaway is he’s not wrong either.

The takeaway is that

>LeBron wanted Rus
>LeBron wanted to trade Rus
>LeBron wanted Ham
>LeBron does not want Ham

Don't even pretend that its only the front office that plays the leak to the press game. And this isn't the first time LeBron has worked to undermine his coach behind the scenes either.

[Master Live 013]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Feel 0 sympathy for Bron, he had a chance to sign elsewhere and decided to re-sign with the Lakers.

Wanted to retire with the Lakers, why? You have won rings elsewhere and left, so it can't be that. Want to live in LA? I thought you were all about winning Bron? You can live in LA when you retire.



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[Master Live 013]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Also, what is this with LeBron playing for the Olympics? The dude is a million years old and have won many times over. No, they don't need your leadership or experience, plenty of others with leadership and experience too. Stop thinking you are indispensable, let others eat.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Also, what is this with LeBron playing for the Olympics? The dude is a million years old and have won many times over. No, they don't need your leadership or experience, plenty of others with leadership and experience too. Stop thinking you are indispensable, let others eat.

They want to do it as a "Last Dance" of sorts for his generation of stars. Send a bunch of 35 year olds to Paris for a future documentary lol

[ojandpizza]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

The takeaway is that

>LeBron wanted Rus
>LeBron wanted to trade Rus
>LeBron wanted Ham
>LeBron does not want Ham

Don't even pretend that its only the front office that plays the leak to the press game. And this isn't the first time LeBron has worked to undermine his coach behind the scenes either.

I’m not pretending that it’s “only” I’m saying they are the ones resisting fixing something that isn’t working and not willing to go all in with their money. Not every move you make is going to work out, but you can’t just sit on the bad ones and have one foot in and the other out so you aren’t the ones who look bad..

Also I don’t believe Bron ever “wanted” Ham. According to teammates he liked Frank. Ham was hired for Russ. LeBron may have signed off on Ham given what all else was available after the way they fired Frank and cheaped out on Lue.

[Master Live 013]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

So Bron wanted Lue and the Lakers couldn't (wouldn't?) hire him? Bron liked Vogel but they fired him? And didn't ever "wanted" Ham but signed off on him? How the mighty have fallen. Maybe he is too old indeed

[ojandpizza]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Feel 0 sympathy for Bron, he had a chance to sign elsewhere and decided to re-sign with the Lakers.

Wanted to retire with the Lakers, why? You have won rings elsewhere and left, so it can't be that. Want to live in LA? I thought you were all about winning Bron? You can live in LA when you retire.



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Oh I don’t have sympathy for him either. He wanted to go to LAL and had a hand in everything that has happened since. I’m not saying boo-hoo I feel so bad for Bron, I’m more so saying the Lakers have played this half in/half out game long enough that I get his frustration.

And it would be a bit more eye-roll if it was only Bron who had issues with Ham but it’s not. It’s basically the whole team. Coaches who lose the locker room get fired, it’s that simple. We just saw it with Griffin. But Lakers are too cheap to pay two coaches, and have a year over year trend of trying to make every roster mistake they’ve made (not them solely before someone says it again lol) look like it wasn’t their fault at all.

A lot of this started when Frank was still coaching and they dumped all their defensive players while having a defensive coach to go-in on guys like Trez, Dennis, Matthews, Drummond, Monk, Melo, Ellington.. let Caruso walk, and valued THT over KCP who started for them to win a ring. Not saying Bron/AD wouldn’t be signing off on some of that but all of that was moving backwards. Russ experiment might have even worked with Caruso and KCP on the team rather than THT.

[ojandpizza]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

So Bron wanted Lue and the Lakers couldn't (wouldn't?) hire him? Bron liked Vogel but they fired him? And didn't ever "wanted" Ham but signed off on him? How the mighty have fallen. Maybe he is too old indeed

Not everything is that black and white..

But yes Lakers insulted Lue by only offering him a contract that lined up with LeBron’s years insinuating the only reason he had been successful was because he had LeBron. They also wanted to dictate Lue’s staff and the money they offered him was half what Cleveland had paid him.

I only know that Jared Dudley claimed LeBron liked Frank, he also publicly blamed the players when asked about the **** Vogel was dealing with. Speaking of Dudley, Kidd and Dudley is another pairing they didn’t give a shot to. Didn’t let Dudley stay on as the last roster spot or an assistant, which was supposedly something Bron and AD both wanted as well.

I believe Bron did sign off on Ham, but at the point what was the alternative? He has backed him recently as well so either that’s playing the media or the assumption that he’s one of the players frustrated with him is just false.. but from watching, it seems as if he is one of the players who has grown tired of him. As far as him “never wanting Ham” I meant I don’t believe Bron ever wanted them to fire Frank to just go get Ham in the first place. I think once it got to the point that he was a serious candidate Bron backed the hire, but that’s about it. Ham hire was for Russ.

[ggsimmonds]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

I’m not pretending that it’s “only” I’m saying they are the ones resisting fixing something that isn’t working and not willing to go all in with their money. Not every move you make is going to work out, but you can’t just sit on the bad ones and have one foot in and the other out so you aren’t the ones who look bad..

Also I don’t believe Bron ever “wanted” Ham. According to teammates he liked Frank. Ham was hired for Russ. LeBron may have signed off on Ham given what all else was available after the way they fired Frank and cheaped out on Lue.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10036469-a-safe-bet-a-wild-card-and-lebrons-guy-insiders-scout-lakers-head-coach-hopefuls

Even before hired Ham was known as "LeBron's choice"

My main point of contention with what you said was that LeBron isn't wrong. Of course he's not, because he is a media master.

You say the Lakers never went "all in." I ask how much capitol did they spend to acquire AD and then Russ? LeBron is fickle as hell. Do as he wants today only for tomorrow he wants you to undo what you just did.

Lets look at each one of LeBron's "gripes"

• Started when Lakers failed to hire Ty Lue.

And they got a championship out of it

• Second time was Pelinka leaking to outlets that it was LeBron and AD’s idea to trade for Westbrook, when Pelinka was actually all-in as well. (Note: Magic also noted he quit because he was tired of Pelinka’s backstabbing)

Fair, I don't object on this one

• Third time was when LeBron explicitly asked the Lakers to trade Westbrook during the summer. But management did not, instead hired a coach for Westbrook, only to wait til the the deadline to trade Westbrook anyway.

wtf is LeBron doing "explicitly asking" the front office to trade away another player?

• LeBron was happy with the trade that he was excited to run it back last summer with the new guys… but unfortunately Darvin Ham didn’t get the memo.

Memo being "King James has decreed..."

• Fourth time is when LeBron made it known within that Ham isn’t working out, and Lakers should get someone else. But Pelinka then immediately leaked to everybody that Lakers are not firing Ham.

wtf is LeBron doing telling the Lakers to fire the coach? The coach that was his choice to begin with. And its not a leak to say you are not firing a guy lol, come on now

• Irwin believes not firing Ham could be the one time too many that LeBron has had enough with Lakers ownership. “LeBron wants to retire a Laker but he also doesn’t want to be taken advantage of.”

I.e. LeBron really wants to be "King" James

I wouldn't go all in at this point either if I were the Lakers for 2 reasons

1. I don't think there is a trade to be made that puts LA into championship contention
2. Why spend all your money when, if the past is any indication, before long LeBron will do a 180 and want to go a different direction. And if you don't he's going to play the media ringmaster game of "being taken advantage of"

[zello144]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

Feel 0 sympathy for Bron, he had a chance to sign elsewhere and decided to re-sign with the Lakers.

Wanted to retire with the Lakers, why? You have won rings elsewhere and left, so it can't be that. Want to live in LA? I thought you were all about winning Bron? You can live in LA when you retire.



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Clippers would have been a better option instead of the Lakers. Gets to live in LA without the pressure of the Lakers legacy and make your own legendary moments with them. I also think they have a better front office too.

[ojandpizza]

Re: NBA Off Topic Thread

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...coach-hopefuls
Even before hired Ham was known as "LeBron's choice"

I know, but at that point Frank had been fired and they were down to however many choices. I'm not disputing that during the process of hiring who was available and the Lakers were willing to spend on that James didn't vouch for Ham. I'm disputing the notion that he really wanted a new coach in the first place, or that just because he vouched for him and they hired him that he is still the right option now.

You say the Lakers never went "all in." I ask how much capitol did they spend to acquire AD and then Russ? LeBron is fickle as hell. Do as he wants today only for tomorrow he wants you to undo what you just did.

True but they knew that when they got LeBron and I'm sure there was a mutual understanding from both sides of what the goal was.. Getting AD and Russ was going 90%.. They were fine with going that far, so long as they didn't spend too much money or do things in a timeline that made them look worse.. They aren't going to spend like GS, Clippers, they've let players walk over tax and made signings/trade to stay under certain aprons..

Lets look at each one of LeBron's "gripes"

• Started when Lakers failed to hire Ty Lue.

And they got a championship out of it

It's not JUST about Lue. It's also about not being willing to hire a coach for the amount of years/money it would take to get a coach at that level.. Frank's contract details after that weren't even made public. Frank ended up being a good hire, it worked, but the whole situation was still about them being cheap from the start.

• Third time was when LeBron explicitly asked the Lakers to trade Westbrook during the summer. But management did not, instead hired a coach for Westbrook, only to wait til the the deadline to trade Westbrook anyway.

wtf is LeBron doing "explicitly asking" the front office to trade away another player?

True but IDK how exaggerated this statement actually is either.

• Fourth time is when LeBron made it known within that Ham isn’t working out, and Lakers should get someone else. But Pelinka then immediately leaked to everybody that Lakers are not firing Ham.

wtf is LeBron doing telling the Lakers to fire the coach? The coach that was his choice to begin with. And its not a leak to say you are not firing a guy lol, come on now

Again, how much of that statement is word for word what was said vs exaggeration.. Regardless I think this bullet is less about LeBron barking orders and more about LeBron being the voice the others don't' have. Players have been upset over lack of roles, continuity, etc all year long. Most notably DLo but it's seemed to trickle through to the rest as well. Very much reminds me of what Pack was saying about the Nets with Vaughn, and players at times being checked out..

I wouldn't go all in at this point either if I were the Lakers for 2 reasons

1. I don't think there is a trade to be made that puts LA into championship contention

1. There isn't a trade like that. I don't even think they should make a trade aside from maybe moving Gabe as he isn't playing. The going all in is a totality of it all over the past few years not necessarily right now, and lingering into the issues they have now which is Ham not a home-run trade. I don't believe they look at Ham right now and view him as their future (how could you) them not moving on from him is about money and damage control on their end to not look like they made another bad move especially one players also endorsed.
   
   

2. Why spend all your money when, if the past is any indication, before long LeBron will do a 180 and want to go a different direction. And if you don't he's going to play the media ringmaster game of "being taken advantage of"