Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Pelicans hanging close

Way too close [emoji23]

[ojandpizza]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Damn Pelicans took the lead.

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

PelWHo??

Got to be careful here

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Grab a rebound.. maybe?

Chet with block number 5!!

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

SGA!!!! And1 for the lead!!!

https://twitter.com/NBA/status/1782257571165864014?t=IXGNp_2dOZ-_saxNNUvAvw&s=19

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

CJ had a decent look.

[ojandpizza]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Garbage last possession.

[jeebs9]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Chet is the piece that turned this Thunder team.

His blocks were huge down the stretch

https://youtu.be/3v0e8NmclBA?si=37jvz785uOvm5QC6

I can't imagine the next game is anywhere near as defensive

[ojandpizza]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Chet is the piece that turned this Thunder team.

His blocks were huge down the stretch

https://youtu.be/3v0e8NmclBA?si=37jvz785uOvm5QC6

I can't imagine the next game is anywhere near as defensive

Chet isn't nearly as freaky as Wemby but I actually think his defensive instincts might be better. He just seems to understand every help rotation, cover, angle.. Wemby just does things he can't do. Dude can be out of position and still get the block lol. That's why he's an alien.

I still think for OKC to become a elite team they need 2 things. An elite off-ball shooter that moves Giddey to a 6th man role. He's versatile enough to sub in for any starter 1-4 and it just makes sense to have a really great off-ball threat next to those guys in the line-up.. And an actual big body that can matchup with the bulkier bigs in the league. Chet is good enough to slide to the 4 next to a true center as well, so it's not like only one of them would be on the floor.. I think those two roster moves fill every gap for this team.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Jokic is tricky because like Pack said he’s just so different compared to most big men who have been great traditionally. But on the other hand it’s hard to really take away from him for that too. All any player can do in maximize their strengths in ways to make them and their team successful in their own eras. And if Jokic can use his strengths to play in ways that traditional bigs didn’t necessarily before him it’s not really a fault of his own.

I don’t really put much into these “he needs X amount of rings” or “he needs x amount of MVPs” for any player. You aren’t going to get voted MVP every single year you have an MVP-caliber season, and your team isn’t always going to win a championship unless it’s the best team in the league every single year.. just like this year for example, Boston SHOULD win. And if they do I don’t see how that makes Joker any more or less of player, just like him losing to Golden State two years ago when he was individually great shouldn’t take away from him when he didn’t even have Murray and MPJ available.. so much goes into winning a ring, you gotta have injury luck, win the coaching adjustments, role players hot/cold at the right time, avoid mismatches, etc..

What I do think though is he needs to sustain this level of play a bit longer. I think he’s ran off a great 5-ish years but to really enter those best center ever arguments I think he needs to continue that. He had a bit of a slower start to get to this point, similar to someone like Curry, and for me he just needs to keep on this path for a bit longer..

I do think he’s got an argument for the most impactful offensive big man ever. There is just so much he does well on the court, he’s so efficient, the passing, screens, shooting, he’s dominant inside, outside, mid-range, as the screener, as the ball-handler, makes his FTs... it’s easy to say he’s can’t defend Shaq in the post.. he doesn’t have to, he’s not playing prime Shaq, and to be fair nobody could defend prime Shaq.. but on the other side which of those traditional bigs covers him 30ft from the hoop, is able to hedge, recover, contest his jumper, keep him from slipping screens, and all that too? That’s why it’s so hard to compare guys who are never going to play against each other in a manner that tries to assume what either would do playing in eras where they didn’t actually play.

I do think he’s sorta separated himself from other players playing right now.. a couple years ago I think you could still push for Giannis and his two-way advantage, maybe you could still say you’d rather have vets like Bron or KD in a playoff series, but Jokic has improved in so many areas, the defense is actually good now, his on-court impact and what Denver has been able to build around that, the whole package is just elite at this point.

I’d say historically speaking Kareem, Russell, Wilt, Shaq, Duncan, and probably Hakeem and David Robinson would be the “bigs” I would have ahead of him for his career.. obviously Kareem has had a GOAT tier career so much would have to be done to over-take that but I don’t know that any of those other guys are players I would completely put out of his reach. I think these last 3-4 years from him would rival any of those players best 3-4 years (possibly not Shaq) just on an island individually. He just needs to sustaining this and keep providing MVP-level impact in playoff runs for a few more years.. obviously the back end of his career is going matter some too. I absolutely think Kareem and Duncan built up their career by providing huge value to championship caliber teams even after their primes faded.. Jokic relies so little on athleticism now that this seems almost easy for him to achieve though if he’s healthy and has the desire to play that long.

This is where I land.

Uh, he has multiple MVP awards too.

He should honestly have 4 in a row, but silly narratives won out last year.

Winning more titles would strengthen his case, but those are team accomplishments.

His individual greatness is easily up there with the best big men ever, IMO.

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All MVPs are mostly won on narratives, his included lol

[J_Posse]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

This is where I land.


All MVPs are mostly won on narratives, his included lol

Nah, I think that's completely wrong.

I'd say plenty of players have won the award based on being the 'best' player that given season.

The raw stats, advanced stats or other metrics can and will point that out.

Sometimes (Nash's 2nd, Westbrook, Harden, and Embiid) narratives are used to justify giving it to someone else usually because of 'voter fatigue.'

Jokic wouldn't be winning another MVP unless he's having another monster season and is still the best player in the league. Plenty of forces in the media (i.e. Kendrick Perkins) are more than ready to prop someone else up.


And I don't think he's the best center ever yet, but I think he's nearing that conversation. He'll need to continue to do it at this high level into his 30's.
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[dubcity]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

Jokic wouldn't be winning another MVP unless he's having another monster season and is still the best player in the league. Plenty of forces in the media (i.e. Kendrick Perkins) are more than ready to prop someone else up.

I don't know if we can bring up the inordinate influence Perk has on the MVP vote while also saying that narratives don't rule the day on all of this. I'm not sure you are actually disagreeing with Pack here.

[J_Posse]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

I don't know if we can bring up the inordinate influence Perk has on the MVP vote while also saying that narratives don't rule the day on all of this. I'm not sure you are actually disagreeing with Pack here.

I just gave him as an example as a prominent voice last season against Jokic (for Embiid).

He wasn't the only one - another example is former teammate Cousins - against Jokic winning 3 in a row.

I am disagreeing with Pack since he stated that all (or most) awards are based on 'narratives,' I wholeheartedly disagree.

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[ProfessaPackMan]

Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

I just gave him as an example as a prominent voice last season against Jokic (for Embiid).

He wasn't the only one - another example is former teammate Cousins - against Jokic winning 3 in a row.

I am disagreeing with Pack since he stated that all (or most) awards are based on 'narratives,' I wholeheartedly disagree.

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I said “most MVPs,” didn’t say anything about all awards lol.

But THAT award in particular is definitely based *mostly* around narrative with some play included. Thats 100% fact and we can look at Westbrook’s MVP as an example and I’m a huge fan of his lol. Hell, voters have admitted that narratives play a factor in this award.

And if it’s not a factor, then explain how Lebron ONLY has 4 MVPs in his 21 years? [emoji23]

I don't know if we can bring up the inordinate influence Perk has on the MVP vote while also saying that narratives don't rule the day on all of this. I'm not sure you are actually disagreeing with Pack here.

Right lol.

Like do we not remember what narrative Perk was playing last year when it came to Embiid and Jokic? He pretty much played the race card and it went from Jokic being the favorite from voters at the ASB to Embiid winning it the last 2 months despite Jokic being the favorite/leading candidate for most of the season lol. Perk played a nasty game lol

[Vni]

Re: Western Conference Playoffs - 1st Rd Discussion Thread

I feel like Denver is gonna end the Lakers tonight.