So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

[Complex]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Yeah I agree. Complex is alone on an island in this discussion. If Calzaghe fights and beats Dawson ur talking about a man who defeated everyone he faced, and u can't say he dodged someone either. Undefeated young fighters, ATG's in their prime (IMO Hopkins is still in his prime!!) and past their prime RJJ. Kessler could be a great champion, great fighter easily outclassed by Calzaghe.
Its ridiculous to even argue this, he's defeated great fighters, and showed tremendous heart and skill while doing it. He may not have fought as many fighters that you believe are great. But thats ur opinion.

Name 2 SMW who are better than him all-time?

He hasn't fought many guys that YOU all think are great. LOL. Arguably his best wins are versus two fighters way past their prime (Kessler) the only exception. Name anyone on his record better?

Dawson would be a great win.

[edaddy]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

He hasn't fought many guys that YOU all think are great. LOL. Arguably his best wins are versus two fighters way past their prime (Kessler) the only exception. Name anyone on his record better?

Dawson would be a great win.

He beat a red hot Lacy who was exposed only after he fought Calzaghe..and yes he was the underdog in that fight..He fought a red hot Kessler who he punished after figuring him out..He beat a Bernard Hopkins that just destroyed Pavlik..really split with Taylor..beat winky Wright and for all technical purposes is probably a better fighter now that he was when he fought Jones..He just punished Roy Jones and made him look like no other fighter has..He has beatten every body put in front of him..He has the heart of a champion and is the one of the best in-fight adjusters that I have ever witnessed..he will not only beat Dawson he will stop him..what more does he have to do?...And remember there were a buch of people picking Jones to win..I guarantee nobody expected Calzaghe to do what he id to Jones..He outspeeded him and made him look like an amatuer..Who else in the division can beat him if you don't mind me asking?...

[Complex]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

He beat a red hot Lacy who was exposed only after he fought Calzaghe..and yes he was the underdog in that fight..He fought a red hot Kessler who he punished after figuring him out..He beat a Bernard Hopkins that just destroyed Pavlik..really split with Taylor..beat winky Wright and for all technical purposes is probably a better fighter now that he was when he fought Jones..He just punished Roy Jones and made him look like no other fighter has..He has beatten every body put in front of him..He has the heart of a champion and is the one of the best in-fight adjusters that I have ever witnessed..he will not only beat Dawson he will stop him..what more does he have to do?...And remember there were a buch of people picking Jones to win..I guarantee nobody expected Calzaghe to do what he id to Jones..He outspeeded him and made him look like an amatuer..Who else in the division can beat him if you don't mind me asking?...

When did Jeff Lacy get so great? Jeff Lacy is one of the most over-hyped boxers in history. Not many experts picked him to win, only folks who had not heard or followed Calzaghe did. Jeff Lacy had 21 fights against who? What made him a great fighter? Please tell me?

As for Joe, you can not be a GOAT imo and your two of your 3 top wins are against fighters that were well past their primes (Roy and Bernard). Does that mean Joe is not a good fighter, of course he is. Does that make him a GOAT, nope.

As yourself, when Hopkins was in his prime, where was Joe? When RJJ was in his prime, where was Joe? The only argument that you make is by some association of Joe's wins over aged Hopkins and Roy he is great?

[marq]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Agreed. Joe beating a faded RJJ shouldn't actually enter into the equation. It's just a resume padding win, not truly substantial.

[Vast]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

When did Jeff Lacy get so great? Jeff Lacy is one of the most over-hyped boxers in history. Not many experts picked him to win, only folks who had not heard or followed Calzaghe did. Jeff Lacy had 21 fights against who? What made him a great fighter? Please tell me?

As for Joe, you can not be a GOAT imo and your two of your 3 top wins are against fighters that were well past their primes (Roy and Bernard). Does that mean Joe is not a good fighter, of course he is. Does that make him a GOAT, nope.

As yourself, when Hopkins was in his prime, where was Joe? When RJJ was in his prime, where was Joe? The only argument that you make is by some association of Joe's wins over aged Hopkins and Roy he is great?

Although B-Hop's age should signify him being way past his prime. His performances in the ring especially that thrashing of Pavlik demonstrate hes better than ever. We can argue till the cows come home but that fight is proof that hes better than ever..... u can try to counter it by saying Pavlik was overrated, and that is simply not true.
Hopkins against Calzaghe looked like the bigger, stronger guy and still didn't win.

He may not be in your top 20 but hes the best SMW ever. He's also past his prime with brittle hands. Its not like dude is 28, hes 36 and if he fights again he might be 37 or 38 years old by then.

He embarrased an older RJJ who was still fast and strong, he just didn't have the stamina or mental toughness to beat Calzaghe. No one has.
Some people just don't give credit where its due.

[Complex]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Although B-Hop's age should signify him being way past his prime. His performances in the ring especially that thrashing of Pavlik demonstrate hes better than ever. We can argue till the cows come home but that fight is proof that hes better than ever..... u can try to counter it by saying Pavlik was overrated, and that is simply not true.
Hopkins against Calzaghe looked like the bigger, stronger guy and still didn't win.

He may not be in your top 20 but hes the best SMW ever. He's also past his prime with brittle hands. Its not like dude is 28, hes 36 and if he fights again he might be 37 or 38 years old by then.

He embarrased an older RJJ who was still fast and strong, he just didn't have the stamina or mental toughness to beat Calzaghe. No one has.
Some people just don't give credit where its due.

Hopkins beat a green Pavlik. A guy that has power and will but not much in terms of skills. Pavlik still has a chance to improve though.

Post after post, you guys keep saying the same thing. Joe beat Hopkins, Joe beat RJJ. Two fighters STILL way past their prime. You can try to argue different but it wont work.

Joe is not a top 20 boxer all-time in many folks minds. Notice I did not say he was trash, I am saying that he is not a top 20 GOAT.

Too many times guys want to label everyone a GOAT. I listed the accomplishments of RJJ earlier, Joe's pale in comparison.

[JayBee74]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

GOAT status is reserved for a very select few in my book.

RJJ won an olympic medal, titles at middleweight, super-middleweight, lt heavyweight and heavyweight. Throw in the fact that for several years no opponent he faced went the distance with him. That makes him an easy fit for GOAT status.

First off Calzage gets my nod for being ranked over RJJ under any circumstances. Out of curiosity are you ranking RJJ a Top 20 GOAT globally, middleweight, light heavy or what?

[marq]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

First off Calzage gets my nod for being ranked over RJJ under any circumstances. Out of curiosity are you ranking RJJ a Top 20 GOAT globally, middleweight, light heavy or what?

Don't agree with this, but to each his own.

[Complex]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

First off Calzage gets my nod for being ranked over RJJ under any circumstances. Out of curiosity are you ranking RJJ a Top 20 GOAT globally, middleweight, light heavy or what?

RJJ is a goat. I am looking at a his career body of work.

[PSU_DW2]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Don't agree with this, but to each his own.

I agree with you in that I don't agree with Joe being ranked all time above Roy.

Calzaghe did not fight the quality fights that Roy fought in his prime, period.

RJJ may not have fought every single boxer of his era, but he has better wins on his record than Calzaghe.

I think the Roy Jones Jr Joe Calzaghe fight was a lot closer of a fight on the scorecards than most people think. Roy was very competitive in those rounds.

Calzaghe may have out-thrown Roy, but Roy landed the sharper, cleaner shots on Joe at a higher percentage. And he knocked Joe down.

Calzaghe is a volumn boxer. Roy Jones Jr has never been a volume high output boxer. He is a devastating counter puncher and was a much more dangerous fighter than Calzaghe ever was when Roy was in his prime. Still, he knocked Joe to the canvas just like BHop did at 39 years old.

Ya'll musta forgot!

[marq]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Dan Rafael: (12:42 PM ET ) Historically speaking, I would rank Jones, Hopkins and Calzaghe in that order.

[Complex]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Dan Rafael: (12:42 PM ET ) Historically speaking, I would rank Jones, Hopkins and Calzaghe in that order.

This is a no-brainer in my eyes.

[marq]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

Gets better:


Do you think Roy Jones would have beaten Joe at his best?

Dan Rafael: (1:38 PM ET ) Absolutely.

[allBthere]

Re: So is anybody watching Calzaghe/Jones 24/7??

I agree with you in that I don't agree with Joe being ranked all time above Roy.

Calzaghe did not fight the quality fights that Roy fought in his prime, period.

RJJ may not have fought every single boxer of his era, but he has better wins on his record than Calzaghe.

I think the Roy Jones Jr Joe Calzaghe fight was a lot closer of a fight on the scorecards than most people think. Roy was very competitive in those rounds.

Calzaghe may have out-thrown Roy, but Roy landed the sharper, cleaner shots on Joe at a higher percentage. And he knocked Joe down.

Calzaghe is a volumn boxer. Roy Jones Jr has never been a volume high output boxer. He is a devastating counter puncher and was a much more dangerous fighter than Calzaghe ever was when Roy was in his prime. Still, he knocked Joe to the canvas just like BHop did at 39 years old.

Ya'll musta forgot!

Roy got his arse kicked. I didn't think that was debateable here. Look at his face...first time ever cut ... also the knockdown was a fore-arm.

I agree that JC doesn't own the GOAT spot at the top, and that RJJ has MORE impressive wins that JC....but you saying that fight was close is completely from left field. JC OWNED roy in that bout ---- anyone who watched the fight should agree on that, I just don't see how anyone could think that slaughterfest was even close Joe hurt Roy, and landed some very nice hard punches - much much more than roy did, and he made roy miss badly...I don't think what you said about cleaner more effective an accurrate had the right name beside it.

If they fough in their primes....no one can be certain, and it didn't happen so there is no point saying for CERTAIN that it would have gone either way. The fact that Joe beat him so bad should make either camp pretty even in votes for who would have one.