My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

[acts238shaun]

I am just tired of online. I love offline and may keep it because of that, but online is still a joke. I wasted money thingking online was better because I bought the Old Foreman Klitch brothers pack. It's just too much to get a straight fight. I sent this to Mike Mahar.

Total Knockdowns 0 0
Punches Thrown 296 111
Punches Landed 218 56
Jabs Thrown 1 25
Jabs Landed 1 18
Punches Thrown to the Head 122 49
Punches Landed to the Head 84 24
Punches Thrown to the Body 174 62
Punches Landed to the Body 134 32

All but 26 punches were in the 3rd round. I DQ'd on purpose within the first minute of the third. He went up/down/up/down with Young Foreman, tossing constant hooks. I had them timed and it didn't matter. Stamina wasn't fixed in the last patch. He'd toss six, spin in place, toss six more, spin in place. That's a 69% connect percentage by the guy on the left. He was able to punch up/down faster than I was able to block up and down. This was in a quick ranked match, in case your are curious. I love the game offline, but I bought this for a 50/50 offline to online ratio. If you want, I'd love to help beta test any patches in the future, or FNR5. By the way, the new get up system, I do like that. Please have more cuts caused by jabs. I am not saying jabs should be overpowered like they were in FNr3, but please make them a viable option for FNR5.

Thanks for your time.

Shaun

I just wanted to pass this along and take any criticism I may deserve. I was honest with him and was constructive in my criticism, I feel. I don't know if I am trading this in or not, but it's not sim boxing online for the most part. If they made a sim boxing game, a true sim, it wouldn't have the online audience it does. Today's instant gratification crowd does not have the patience to learn boxing. Boxing strategy is not a good option online. I thought I was buying a sim, offline and online. I just don't want to commit the time and effort to learn to abuse the glitches and arcade nature of the game.

To prove this, I created a CAB and put no points on punch accuracy. With a smooth stance and balanced punching my accuracy was 54. I had 100 left hand power, 96 right hand power 100 speed, 95 chin and toughness, 100 chin, 90 block strength heart, cuts, head movement and foot speed. With a 54 rating in punch accuracy I landed almost 60 percent of my punches. That's how bad online is a joke. I just wanted to be transparent and open myself up to other's opinion. Thanks.

[acts238shaun]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

Total Knockdowns 2 0
Punches Thrown 438 670
Punches Landed 287 440
Jabs Thrown 75 200
Jabs Landed 43 136
Punches Thrown to the Head 311 419
Punches Landed to the Head 199 272
Punches Thrown to the Body 127 251
Punches Landed to the Body 88 168

I won this fight, but we both hit for 65%. Sad. Someone should have died before the fight went that far. The nice thing was a straight that caused a flash KO.

I may keep it for offline, I don't know, but somehting needs to be done. I win more than I lose, so I am not being a crybaby. I just expect more I guess, maybe too much.

[DaveDQ]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

Believe me, I'm with you. I'm trying to wrap my head around just what they did with the patch. You can still walk up to a guy and throw multiple body shots, without much consequence. The problem is, who wants to fight like that? We all want to win, so that adds to the frustration. When you do start beating a guy that abuses, he'll throw a headbutt or low blow. If that doesn't work, he will quit, and the problem with that is you don't always get a win.

Going a step further, this game (like others) gives a good perspective of video game culture. There are some foul people out there that play with zero sportsmanship, and if you do manage to win, they will message you with some very crude language. The concern I have is that the percentages tell me most people online are like this. Since the patch, I have yet faced off against a guy that respects the sport. That's what makes me want to walk away.

Something I have often thought about is why can't we have a fighting club where we gather together people that don't abuse? If we are so frustrated with online, but want to play online, why not structure something that offers us a fair fight every time? Is it because of the ease of connecting with someone via the WC or ranked match modes? You would think that if we want to keep the game, and compete on level playing fields, we'd arrange something and maintain it.

[goh]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

The concern I have is that the percentages tell me most people online are like this. Since the patch, I have yet faced off against a guy that respects the sport.

If we are so frustrated with online, but want to play online, why not structure something that offers us a fair fight every time?

Answered your own question before you asked it. People don't want to play fair and if they're made to play fair then they're not going to play. It happens with every game but people keep playing. I had it figured out in a 30 day trial.

[acts238shaun]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

That's why I started our league...fair play.

[acarrero]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

The game doesn't play 100% sim just like Madden or NCAA don't play 100% sim. A little worse than those titles, but video game boxing has not developed as much as video game football. FN4 provides the most sim-like boxing game I've played, but it still has some good arcade-like elements.

While it's hard to get a pure sim opponent in FN4, the counter system always gives you a chance to hurt your opponent no matter how many punches they throw. Actually, the more they throw the more chances for counters. I think it creates a balance. But just like there are years where Madden is more geared towards offense than defense, FN4 might be more on the offensive side online so you should just adjust your style, but the counters, and the defense you have to play to get them, is always there as an equalizer.

I mean, you're talking about a young Foreman coming at ya, there's nothing un-sim about him coming after you hard.

[SHAKYR]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

The game doesn't play 100% sim just like Madden or NCAA don't play 100% sim. A little worse than those titles, but video game boxing has not developed as much as video game football. FN4 provides the most sim-like boxing game I've played, but it still has some good arcade-like elements.

While it's hard to get a pure sim opponent in FN4, the counter system always gives you a chance to hurt your opponent no matter how many punches they throw. Actually, the more they throw the more chances for counters. I think it creates a balance. But just like there are years where Madden is more geared towards offense than defense, FN4 might be more on the offensive side online so you should just adjust your style, but the counters, and the defense you have to play to get them, is always there as an equalizer.

I mean, you're talking about a young Foreman coming at ya, there's nothing un-sim about him coming after you hard.

You know Madden gets work done on it than the Fight Night series and they give each player their tendencies in that game. Fight Night Round 4 does have every boxer's tendencies and styles down. It Fight Night was a total sim it would sell. I'm an EA Moderator and EA Community leader who goes to every site on te internet with Fight Night Round4 talk. Everyone is complaining about how unrealistic this game plays...The keyword unrealistic! This sounds like fans want a sim to me.

[DaveDQ]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

The game doesn't play 100% sim just like Madden or NCAA don't play 100% sim. A little worse than those titles, but video game boxing has not developed as much as video game football. FN4 provides the most sim-like boxing game I've played, but it still has some good arcade-like elements.

While it's hard to get a pure sim opponent in FN4, the counter system always gives you a chance to hurt your opponent no matter how many punches they throw. Actually, the more they throw the more chances for counters. I think it creates a balance. But just like there are years where Madden is more geared towards offense than defense, FN4 might be more on the offensive side online so you should just adjust your style, but the counters, and the defense you have to play to get them, is always there as an equalizer.

I mean, you're talking about a young Foreman coming at ya, there's nothing un-sim about him coming after you hard.

Good post. I agree that it's a good simulation. It's just that it takes you so far and stops. Take for instance, knockdowns. I know that when I'm in a fight, and I knock a guy down, he's going to be able to get up the first time by the count of 3-4. Why couldn't that program some type of logic that offers less of a routine with knockdowns? It's just too predictable. The way these fighters animate in some of these knockdowns, and then get up on a 3 count is silly. That needs more work.

That's just an example where the game takes you down the road, show you the horizon, but then stops.

[Jesus]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

sorry man, but you just dont seem to be good.

[acts238shaun]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

My deal with Foreman is he has 76 hand speed (94 rating for a heavyweight CAB, hello!) when Ali's is 80 (100 for a CAB). There's one of my problems with Young Foreman. The other is his unreal stamina. He doesn't tire fast enough online, period. Another issue overall is the lack of effect ratings have in the game, especially with head movement and hand speed. A player with 60 hand speed (40 global heavy weight rating) is not slow enough compared to a 95+ (78-80 global for heavy). I fought a Valuev CAB in my legacy and with speed on zero, where the speed differential is the most noticeable, he was still too fast with his hands. This was on Champ, not GOAT.

Head movement ratings fail terribly on weaves as Foreman on the game weaves as fluidly and easily as Ali, and it's sad. I have no issue with Foreman users coming hard, but they don't tire. Staying on the outside is not happening with an 82" reach, the same as the maxed out reach on the game with a CAB. I don't have an issue with his reach, but he is too effective inside online and there isn't an advantage to having a shorter reach or longer reach, period. It's all about landing counters and hitting more hooks and uppercuts they they do. The jab is a useless tool online, unless you have a power punching style with a smooth/speed stance and power in the lead hand is at least 95+ with best punch as jab. The jab is eye candy, because it doesn't cause enough cuts or damage, offline or online. I am not saying make it overpowered like it was in FNR4, but make it count for something other than a tally on the fight totals. A Sonny Liston, Ali and even a Foreman jab was feared.

It's also ignorant how a stun fighter can move backwards faster going backwards than a well fighter can move forward at times.

The game isn't completely terrible, it is just unbalanced and it feels more like Ready to Rumble at times than a boxing sim. Offline with sliders I can get it sim. Online it's just crazy and if they make it a sim online there will be a mass outcry. I don't have a problem with a fighter throwing 100 punches a round, just the fact they don't tire throwing that much. I fought a guy recently in unranked who threw 450 punches in 3 rounds. He was a noob button user and got KO'd at the end of the third, but he hadn't slowed down hardly at all by that time. I can sit in one spot and they can spam my guard still hurt me. Blocking is ineffective. I know punches glance, go through guards, etc, but not to the tune of a 50% or more connect percentage on a consistent basis when you look at a real match. Too many blocked punches get through and on top of that the blocking going from up to down and vice versa is too slow. I know people spam that, but speed up the blocking animation by half and lessen the timed block window by half. I bought this game to play a boxing sim. I don't care if I fight someone aggressive, but make it where you have a situation like the Bute-Andrade fight where though he owned Andrade for 11 rounds he was dead tired trying to get the KO in the 11th and barely made it out of the fight with a win, suffering the first knockdown in his career. Bute' has a good chin and good stamina, but he punched himself out.

It's all about balance. This game is frustrating like NCAA 09. It's a good game that is almost a great game, but there are two or three glaring weaknesses and a few small issues that keep it from being a really good like, like NCAA 10 appears to be. I know this is the first cycle on the new engine, and the devs did say they are going to be doing constant updates every few months (with all the ads on my screen when I play Fight Night there had better be...Final Destination sickened me, and I didn't even watch it), but there is a severe lack of balance. Just like NCAA 09, all about offense, not much required in the way of defense. NCAA 09 had breakaway speed, FNR4 has weaving without getting hit mid weave. NCAA 09 had Robo QB's, FNR4 has Robo punching. Even the defense is about offense, as counters are the best way for a KO. How often is there a flash knockdown on a non-counter clean shot? It's rare. The most telling sign is I can land 100+ haymakers and 70 counters in the same fight and lose because my opponent throws the same punch to my head over and over and over and the fight is stopped because his blocked punches are getting though and causing my damage meter to go red. He threw right hooks to the head the whole fight into my raised guard. This is post patch. I'd weave, counter straight or uppercut and it didn't faze him. Screw that. That's sim? Whatever. I landed 68% of my punches, he landed 42%. I stood in the middle of the ring and made a fool of this guy. My visiting brother in law, an avid gamer, though not a boxing fan he's a pre-med major, couldn't believe it. The was in WC mode, by the way, where stats are leveled for the sake for fairness, and I lost.

Even in judging decisions it's all about who throws the most punches. I've lost, landing 60% of my punches to their 38%, landing two less punches and knocking them down twice. I stayed on my feet the whole fight and he lost two points on headbutts. It's all about throwing more punches, whether in knocking someone out or winning the decision. No balance. Smart boxing strategy is a waste online period. It's nothing more than Rockem Sockem Robots with some Ready to Rumble/Killer Instinct (Combo Breaker!!!, i.e. counter punching from a weave or timed block) mixed in.

[acts238shaun]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

I am not elite by any means, I admit that, but a sim boxing game should allow someone with better than average stick skills to take on a complete noob using good Tekken/Street Fighter stick skills and using solid boxing strategy and give them a good fight or win. I am better than average and if I wanted to take time to learn how to spam/glitch/cheat/weave constantly and clean house, but I refuse to do that.

I'm a decent fighter online, how else would I beat a level 18 as a level seven? My average AOL is about 6-8. Yet the same day I beat a couple 6's 8's and an 18 I lost to two level one's because they smammed. Ask anyone that's fought me, I am a tough fight. I own a decision win against one of the top 200 WC mode heavyweights and a KO versus a top 300 middleweight (WC as well). My overall winning percentage online is around 55-60%. I win more than I lose and I do it without being cheap.

[dorismary]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

I finished a while back but I want EA to buy me two new controllers as my sticks took a beat without the buttons on ps3

[DaveDQ]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

Great points, Shaun.

[acts238shaun]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

Don't get me started on my controller doris, lol.

I don't ask that EA make people play like me, but I am forced to play like the spammers to win, so what's fair about that? It's not.

[LingeringRegime]

Re: My email to an EA dev...a parting letter as I am almost done with FNR4.

Great letter.

I have yet to play online with this game. I think with sports games the online is pretty much awful. Not to excuse it, but there will always be ways to exploit the game engine. My favorite online sports game was All-Pro Football 2K8. That game was pretty hard for the exploiters to abuse.

Sad, that online sports gaming has come to this.