Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

[Vast]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

He fought Marquez after Pac fought him twice. He did a million with Marquez when Pac couldnt do 500k against Marquez. The only person you can make the "luster" argument with is Hatton and even thats shaky. Oscar was coming off a losses in 2 of his last 4 fights when he fought Floyd (Mosley and Hopkins). Why does he have luster then but loses it when he lost a close fight to Floyd?

Floyd has a few arguments why he should be paid more:

1) He is a bigger draw. The numbers show that no matter how you try to spin it.

2) The only reason Pac is #1 P4P is because Floyd retired. Its not as if Floyd lost and Pac became #1. He retired and Pac took his spot.

3) Pac's tenouous grasp on the english language and nationality forces Floyd to carry most of the promotional load.

When Pac fought Marquez he was nowhere near a household name and the p4p #1 that he is now.
When Floyd fought Marquez he was coming out of retirment against the man who arguably beat the current #1, Pac. People wanted to see PBF either lose or to see if he still had skills.

If it was Pac vs Marquez III instead of Pac vs Hatton, it would've destroyed the #'s PBF did vs Marquez.

[aholbert32]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

When Pac fought Marquez he was nowhere near a household name and the p4p #1 that he is now.
When Floyd fought Marquez he was coming out of retirment against the man who arguably beat the current #1, Pac. People wanted to see PBF either lose or to see if he still had skills.

If it was Pac vs Marquez III instead of Pac vs Hatton, it would've destroyed the #'s PBF did vs Marquez.

HUH? Manny fought Marquez in March of 2008. Marquez was as well known among boxing fans as he is now. The last Marquez/Pac fight did 400k. Are you seriously trying to argue that a third fight would have generated 600k more fans? Really?

Those reasons you listed are the reasons everybody orders PBF fights. That doesnt change the fact that he is a bigger draw.

Seriously...stop trying to spin it. The numbers dont lie. Marquez isnt anymore well known than he was in 2008. Floyd's numbers were just better.

[aznpnoy]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

You guys should also take into account that when Pac fought Marquez Illegal Sattelites were still working and when PBF fought Marquez those same Sattelites were not working anymore.

[mattlanta]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

Obviously Floyd's trying to protect that undefeated record. All fighters try and stay undefeated. He knows Manny is as dangerous as it'll get for him, and as an undefeated fighter, he'll do every thing he could so he doesn't have to get that "pretty face" of his battered.

I'm a [Filipino] Pacquiao fan by the way, but I also am a fan of Mayweather.

The Super Fight as many would call it, did not happen because of both of them. Mayweather shouldn't really have asked for extensive drug testing as Pacquiao already agreed to extracurricular testing. But on the other hand, if Pacquiao really has nothing to hide, he should have accepted the testing anyway. I understand Pacquiao not wanting to be scared to lose his 'strength' though so I can't really say I'm blaming one or the other - but both of them.

[Vast]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

HUH? Manny fought Marquez in March of 2008. Marquez was as well known among boxing fans as he is now. The last Marquez/Pac fight did 400k. Are you seriously trying to argue that a third fight would have generated 600k more fans? Really?

Those reasons you listed are the reasons everybody orders PBF fights. That doesnt change the fact that he is a bigger draw.

Seriously...stop trying to spin it. The numbers dont lie. Marquez isnt anymore well known than he was in 2008. Floyd's numbers were just better.

Im not trying to spin it. Floyd's numbers were better for sure. The thing is Pacs fight with DLH is what put him on the map. It was his first 24/7, which is the king of boxing promotion on HBO. And the ticket sales of that fight generated the second largest gate revenue in boxing history.

So to the general publics eyes, he was a relative unknown until December of 2008 (when he fought DLH).
The same can be said of Floyd, he fought Oscar in May of 2007. He never sold a million PPV's until he fought Oscar and was featured in HBO 24/7.
After that fight he was a household name and was the #1 draw in boxing.

[aholbert32]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

Im not trying to spin it. Floyd's numbers were better for sure. The thing is Pacs fight with DLH is what put him on the map. It was his first 24/7, which is the king of boxing promotion on HBO. And the ticket sales of that fight generated the second largest gate revenue in boxing history.

So to the general publics eyes, he was a relative unknown until December of 2008 (when he fought DLH).
The same can be said of Floyd, he fought Oscar in May of 2007. He never sold a million PPV's until he fought Oscar and was featured in HBO 24/7.
After that fight he was a household name and was the #1 draw in boxing.

If Pac was a relative unknown at the time to the general public that means only Oscar, Mosley and PBF were "known" fighters at that time. I just dont buy that. Pac had wars with Morales, Barrera and Marquez at that point. He was a known fighter to most sports fans at that time. Was he on Oscar's level? No, but he was headlining PPV's and HBO cards for a long time before 2008. Sports fans (not just boxing fans) knew him then. He just wasnt a draw then.

I'm not saying Pac isnt a huge draw. I'm just saying he isnt a bigger draw then PBF. Pac couldnt pull Marquez to a 1.05 buyrate now.

[Vast]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

If Pac was a relative unknown at the time to the general public that means only Oscar, Mosley and PBF were "known" fighters at that time. I just dont buy that. Pac had wars with Morales, Barrera and Marquez at that point. He was a known fighter to most sports fans at that time. Was he on Oscar's level? No, but he was headlining PPV's and HBO cards for a long time before 2008. Sports fans (not just boxing fans) knew him then. He just wasnt a draw then.

I'm not saying Pac isnt a huge draw. I'm just saying he isnt a bigger draw then PBF. Pac couldnt pull Marquez to a 1.05 buyrate now.

You're right, he wasn't a draw then... but he is a draw now. And that's what we're debating.
i just disagree because, i believe Before Floyd destroyed a bloated overweight Marquez, with the right promotion. a.k.a. HBO 24/7.. a Pac vs Marquez III could've been sold to the public to the tune of over 1.05 PPV buys.

[aholbert32]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

You're right, he wasn't a draw then... but he is a draw now. And that's what we're debating.
i just disagree because, i believe Before Floyd destroyed a bloated overweight Marquez, with the right promotion. a.k.a. HBO 24/7.. a Pac vs Marquez III could've been sold to the public to the tune of over 1.05 PPV buys.

What we are debating is if he is a bigger draw than PBF not if he is a draw at all. HBO would have never done a 24/7 on Pac/Marquez because Marquez doesnt speak English at all and Pac doesnt speak it well. Americans dont want to watch 4 episodes of subtitles. Also, 24/7 doesnt automatically equal 600k more buyers for the fight and thats what Pac/Marquez would have need to pass 1.05.

I know you like Pac but you have nothing concrete to back up your argument. Just alot of "If Pac had 24/7" "If Pac fought Marquez a 3rd time". I have numbers. Numbers against the same fighters as Pac and the numbers show Floyd is the bigger draw. If Pac pushes Clottey to 800K, that will change my mind a little but right now the numbers show PBF is the bigger draw

[Vast]

Re: Mayweather Setting Up Excuse Not to Fight Pacquio?

What we are debating is if he is a bigger draw than PBF not if he is a draw at all. HBO would have never done a 24/7 on Pac/Marquez because Marquez doesnt speak English at all and Pac doesnt speak it well. Americans dont want to watch 4 episodes of subtitles. Also, 24/7 doesnt automatically equal 600k more buyers for the fight and thats what Pac/Marquez would have need to pass 1.05.

I know you like Pac but you have nothing concrete to back up your argument. Just alot of "If Pac had 24/7" "If Pac fought Marquez a 3rd time". I have numbers. Numbers against the same fighters as Pac and the numbers show Floyd is the bigger draw. If Pac pushes Clottey to 800K, that will change my mind a little but right now the numbers show PBF is the bigger draw

True. I don't have numbers. But you're comparing Floyd's post-DLH numbers against Pacs pre-DLH numbers. Pac is averaging over a million PPV buys post DLH.

This fight against Clottey is being promoted poorly tho, and Arum dropped the ball by not having a 24/7 done for this fight, but i guess he gets what he deserves for not getting the deal with Mayweather done. lol