Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

[Complex]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

The biggest improvement legacy can make is more focus on developing the condition and techniques of your fighter and not ratings. Learning to box, not get faster and stronger than the next man. And, lastly, navigating the world of boxing to gain income, notarity and money. In his prime folks weren't lining up to fight Tyson except bums and guys who needed a pay day.

[Complex]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Last post before lunch. We need to introduce the shady part of boxing more. I'm talking judges with varying styles, being denied a fight bc you are not an ideal opponent. Fine you want to fight the champ, he may demand the location, judges and ref.

[fistofrage]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Last post before lunch. We need to introduce the shady part of boxing more. I'm talking judges with varying styles, being denied a fight bc you are not an ideal opponent. Fine you want to fight the champ, he may demand the location, judges and ref.

Definitely need a large pool of judges who score the fights on different criteria. But have enough so you could get 3 that score on the same criteria ie true power shots landed or just plain volume of punces, physical damage shown, etc. As you fight, you get to know the judges tendencies. And you see who the judges will be before the fight.

That way if you are a power counter puncher and you see that 2 of the refs have a tendency to judge on just total punches landed, you better work on your speed, combos and jab or else you will pretty much have to rely on a KO to win the fight.

Need to have varying refs, some will call the fight quick, others ignore the rough stuff, some wait a bit before they start the count, etc.

[SHAKYR]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Last post before lunch. We need to introduce the shady part of boxing more. I'm talking judges with varying styles, being denied a fight bc you are not an ideal opponent. Fine you want to fight the champ, he may demand the location, judges and ref.

I have been pushing this and thanks for posting it. I say we should have a judge pool or list of judges with different criterias for a fight.

JUDGE
Judges are should be rated based on their actual score cards for their tendency to score even rounds and 10-8 rounds.

JUDGES BIAS
Judges should be chosen manually or randomly, a bias, if the player chooses.

The choices under Judges Bias should be as follows:
None: Self-explanatory. The judge does not lean in any direction and simply scores each
round on face value.
Bias Rating: Some judges should have bias in favor of a hometown fighter, defending champion, slugger or boxer, or any combination of the four.

Bias Descriptions:
Hometown: will have a tendency to give a close round to the fighter designated as the
hometown fighter and will often score detrimental 10-8 rounds 10-9 and 10-7 rounds 10-8
in favor of the hometown fighter.
Champion: will have a tendency to give a close round to the champion and will often score detrimental 10-8 rounds 10-9 and 10-7 rounds 10-8 in favor of the champion.
Boxer: will have a tendency to give a close round to the fighter whose style is that of a boxer and will often score detrimental 10-8 rounds 10-9 and 10-7 rounds 10-8 in favor of
a boxer.
Slugger: will have a tendency to give a close round to the fighter whose style is that of a
slugger and will often score detrimental 10-8 rounds 10-9 and 10-7 rounds 10-8 in favor
of a slugger.
Reputation: will have a tendency to give a close round to the fighter whose reputation (overall rating) is the higher and will often score detrimental 10-8 rounds 10-9 and 10-7
rounds 10-8 in favor of the higher profile fighter.

Judges Scoring TendenciesA judge should have a rating representing his tendency to give the benefit of the doubt to the high scorer in a close round, to call a close round even, or to give the benefit of the doubt to the low scorer in a close round.
Assume a judge has the following ratings: High Scores: 85; Even Scores: 3; and Low Scores: 12.
These number mean that in a close round, this judge will score the round 10-9 in favor of the High
Scorer 85% of the time; will score the round 10-10 only 3% of the time; and will score the round in
favor of the Low Scorer 12% of the time.

[Money99]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Last post before lunch. We need to introduce the shady part of boxing more. I'm talking judges with varying styles, being denied a fight bc you are not an ideal opponent. Fine you want to fight the champ, he may demand the location, judges and ref.

Absolutely! Or have guys just plain duck you.
Or present back-room deals that need to be considered in order to move fighters along.
For example if you want your middleweight to get a shot, you have to sacrifice your young welterweight to his champ. You know the kids not ready yet, but you want your middleweight to get a shot too.

As you improve as a manager/promoter, perhaps it's you who can force these decisions on more inexperienced managers.

These kinds of decisions would present the shady underside of boxing better than a story-mode where you fight skinheads in a shower.

[Complex]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Definitely need a large pool of judges who score the fights on different criteria. But have enough so you could get 3 that score on the same criteria ie true power shots landed or just plain volume of punces, physical damage shown, etc. As you fight, you get to know the judges tendencies. And you see who the judges will be before the fight.

That way if you are a power counter puncher and you see that 2 of the refs have a tendency to judge on just total punches landed, you better work on your speed, combos and jab or else you will pretty much have to rely on a KO to win the fight.

Need to have varying refs, some will call the fight quick, others ignore the rough stuff, some wait a bit before they start the count, etc.

Exactly, what if stun state was adjusted. I mean wobble too long and the fight gets called. My point is that boxing isn't just the bigger, stronger, faster gout wins...but that fights have tons of outcomes. I would fully expect to have to KO a champ in his home country.

[fistofrage]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Exactly, what if stun state was adjusted. I mean wobble too long and the fight gets called. My point is that boxing isn't just the bigger, stronger, faster gout wins...but that fights have tons of outcomes. I would fully expect to have to KO a champ in his home country.

Yep thats the rule. To be the champ, you must KO the champ. Also, rising stars get the benefit of the doubt to keep their perfect streaks alive versus journeymen.

Did anyone see the HBO fight Adrien Broner vs. Ponce De Leon. I guarantee those judges were paid off, well at least 1 of them was. Here you have an up and comer, the next star in Broner vs. a veteran who is probably past his time moves up in weight to give the youngster some cred on his resume. Even a blind man could see that De Leon had him utterly frustrated for the 1st 3 rounds and then outworked him in the last 3. One jusge had it 99-91 Bronner. I could possibly see a case for the 96-94 that the other 2 judges had, but Broner started out so slow, only landing 24 punches in the 1st 3 rounds, that there is no conceivable way he won any of the 1st 3.

[Money99]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Yep thats the rule. To be the champ, you must KO the champ. Also, rising stars get the benefit of the doubt to keep their perfect streaks alive versus journeymen.

Did anyone see the HBO fight Adrien Broner vs. Ponce De Leon. I guarantee those judges were paid off, well at least 1 of them was. Here you have an up and comer, the next star in Broner vs. a veteran who is probably past his time moves up in weight to give the youngster some cred on his resume. Even a blind man could see that De Leon had him utterly frustrated for the 1st 3 rounds and then outworked him in the last 3. One jusge had it 99-91 Bronner. I could possibly see a case for the 96-94 that the other 2 judges had, but Broner started out so slow, only landing 24 punches in the 1st 3 rounds, that there is no conceivable way he won any of the 1st 3.

LOL, yeah I saw that fight. I had it 96-94 Ponce De Leon. But I wasn't opposed to the same scores being given to Broner.
But whoever gave it 99-91 should have his license revoked. No way that guy is legit and wasn't paid off.
It was nearly as bad as the Holyfield-Lewis I fight.

[Complex]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

One ability or attribute that should be measured is the ability to stay and get in shape. I don't know how it would work but some guys like Hopkins and the Klits always look great. I've seen a Briggs look chilled in one fight and the michelein man the next.

Make online have some of this too.

[fistofrage]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

One ability or attribute that should be measured is the ability to stay and get in shape. I don't know how it would work but some guys like Hopkins and the Klits always look great. I've seen a Briggs look chilled in one fight and the michelein man the next.

Make online have some of this too.

Thats funny that you say that because Fight Night Round 2 had that, it wasn't that well implemented but if you didn't dow well in the training your boxer came in pretty out of shape and fat.

I just want training to matter, the mini games should play less of an important role, I understand you need them, but focusing on a camp and how much you wanted to train, the length of the camp, the tasks, etcc.

There should be a possibilty to be injured during camp too if you are trying to overtrain to build up stamina, etc.

[gravity62]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

I read about half the posts on the second page so I'm just gonna weigh in on that discussion about fighter's punching power. I happen to disagree with the notion that a fighter's power is pretty much set his entire career. Your power largely depends on your your size (mostly weight), technique, accuracy, and more importantly, your metality. If you're a pretty fighter chances are you're going to float like a butterfly and sting like a bee. On the other hand, if you're a strong, agressive fighter you're typically goin to hit harder. The size and strength of a fighters hands actually play a huge role in thier punching power. Also deit and traiing, high protien intake and a strength reginmine can add muscle and increase power dramically. The condition of a boxer's fists definately factor greatly. Some fightes might start off thier career with decent power, hurt thier hands and have to move to a lighter punching style. A good example of that would be Paul maliginaggi and his career. Let me give you an example of just what I'm talking about when I say a fighter's mentally matters, if Mike Tyson got back in the ring I don't think he could KO any heavyweight right now. He's lost his hunger to do any real damage to a fighter, while George Foreman could KO most of the division even in his forties. There can be major differences in the way fighters train or maintain thier health and mentallity, which might cause a fighter to sustain or fluctuate, or even increase punching power throughout thier career. Especially if weight, and or body muscle percentage goes higher.

[Money99]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

I read about half the posts on the second page so I'm just gonna weigh in on that discussion about fighter's punching power. I happen to disagree with the notion that a fighter's power is pretty much set his entire career. Your power largely depends on your your size (mostly weight), technique, accuracy, and more importantly, your metality. If you're a pretty fighter chances are you're going to float like a butterfly and sting like a bee. On the other hand, if you're a strong, agressive fighter you're typically goin to hit harder. The size and strength of a fighters hands actually play a huge role in thier punching power. Also deit and traiing, high protien intake and a strength reginmine can add muscle and increase power dramically. The condition of a boxer's fists definately factor greatly. Some fightes might start off thier career with decent power, hurt thier hands and have to move to a lighter punching style. A good example of that would be Paul maliginaggi and his career. Let me give you an example of just what I'm talking about when I say a fighter's mentally matters, if Mike Tyson got back in the ring I don't think he could KO any heavyweight right now. He's lost his hunger to do any real damage to a fighter, while George Foreman could KO most of the division even in his forties. There can be major differences in the way fighters train or maintain thier health and mentallity, which might cause a fighter to sustain or fluctuate, or even increase punching power throughout thier career. Especially if weight, and or body muscle percentage goes higher.

None of us here are saying that punching power can't go up or down a tick here or there.
But there is absolutely nothing on this planet that can be done to give Sergio Mora power.
The only chance he would have is to cut weight and become a Bantamweight. But then, he'd be so fatigued from cutting weight, he'd be gassed after 10 seconds.

And look at a big strong guy like George Chuvalo. Many historians said if he had a decent punch, he would have been champ simply because his chin was made of cinder-block.
But he never possessed that dynamic one-punch power that guys like Frazier or Foreman had.

I've never boxed professionally, and I only messed around with it when working out at a gym during my college years.
But talking to other fighters and trainers, they know instantly who has what skills and what can be worked on.
There were guys that joined our club that no matter what they did, they couldn't punch themselves out of a wet-paper bag. Yes, trainers can work with them on punching off angles, counter punching or combinations. But there is absolutely nothing they can do to make them into a 1-punch KO artist. Or give them enough power to back guys off.
Once you've learned proper technique, your power is basically set in stone.

You are what you are. Just like nobody can turn Tim Wakefield into a fireball throwing pitcher. It's not going to happen.

It's true that if you go down in weight, you'll gain added power. But again, it's not going to be a dramatic change. Someone like Sven Ottke is never, ever going to scare guys with his cross.

Complex, I love the idea of having training habits play a factor. That's why having a managers mode would be awesome. Give each fighter a personality. Some will be gym rats, and others will have to be dragged to the gym.
So while some guys will never have a problem staying in shape, you'll have a few that will hardly ever step through the ropes with 100% stamina.
That's the next step for EA to take. A true 'franchise' mode like that where you run a stable of fighters and work on building them up, signing new prospects and making sure all are trained to the best of their ability. And working around their personalities would be another pitfall to handle.

[SHAKYR]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

I read about half the posts on the second page so I'm just gonna weigh in on that discussion about fighter's punching power. I happen to disagree with the notion that a fighter's power is pretty much set his entire career. Your power largely depends on your your size (mostly weight), technique, accuracy, and more importantly, your metality. If you're a pretty fighter chances are you're going to float like a butterfly and sting like a bee. On the other hand, if you're a strong, agressive fighter you're typically goin to hit harder. The size and strength of a fighters hands actually play a huge role in thier punching power. Also deit and traiing, high protien intake and a strength reginmine can add muscle and increase power dramically. The condition of a boxer's fists definately factor greatly. Some fightes might start off thier career with decent power, hurt thier hands and have to move to a lighter punching style. A good example of that would be Paul maliginaggi and his career. Let me give you an example of just what I'm talking about when I say a fighter's mentally matters, if Mike Tyson got back in the ring I don't think he could KO any heavyweight right now. He's lost his hunger to do any real damage to a fighter, while George Foreman could KO most of the division even in his forties. There can be major differences in the way fighters train or maintain thier health and mentallity, which might cause a fighter to sustain or fluctuate, or even increase punching power throughout thier career. Especially if weight, and or body muscle percentage goes higher.

I totally disagree with you especially as I said before I have boxed for over 13 years amateur and pro. I remember Shannon Briggs from the amateurs. He was lean, fast, and a strong puncher. When turn pro he was the same way until he bulked up. He didn't become a bigger puncher because he was knocking people out in the amateurs. When he bulked up all he was able to do is absorb punches better because of a bigger neck and he was also able to muscle his opponents around with his weight.

There isn't a huge increase in strength by bulking up. Most boxers power comes from speed, with speed come power. I said before speed doesn't increase that much from your amateurs. You get better in technique and delivery.

Some boxers have pro styles as an amateur already so what they bring in the amateurs will be really leveled off already. Oscar De La Hoya was basically set in stonbe already He just had technique adjustments implemented into his style when he went to different trainers.

Yeah, gain weight only benefits a select few boxers because of height, but doesn't guarantee a power increase or anything else, examples Chris Byrd and Roy Jones Jr. I'm not saying because you gain weight or move up you shouldn't be able to KO someone but their chin can't be up above the 70's or mid 80's. Unless you are moving up with a solid KO power and percentage.

[Complex]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

Boxing is about learning your strengths and maximizing them to develop your style. Its not about being a 2 in power and getting to 99 by the time you get a belt.

EA needs to focus on developing a career of a fighter and managing that career. Arcade style can be a mode in the game too, but we need to get more sim in the game.

[gravity62]

Re: Legacy Mode Wishlist/Suggestions

So your theory is that you actually gain power by losing weight ? Okay, complex! I won't even waste my time countering with a witty comeback even though you tried to imsult my intelligence.

... Toughness doesn't equate to how many punches or punshment you can take, it comes down to how you can swim out of deep waters when your going through adversity, or in other words, a tough fight and come out with a win. Who has done that more than Muhamad Ali? Name me one fighter. Maybe you could say Sugar Ray Robinson but I honestly don't think he was the underdog in any of his fights.