End the Brand Split

[johnnywobbles]

I posted this in tonight's Raw thread but I wanted to hear some thoughts.

You don't realize how watered down the talent pool is until you see Swagger, Kingston and Riley competing for the WWE Title. That is disgraceful.

Keep Raw and Smackdown shows and stop the brand split. Add a TV title to go with US and IC title. There is not enough talent between the two brands to justify two "World" titles.

[Millennium]

Re: End the Brand Split

Why?

The brand split allows more wrestlers TV time. You like Zack Ryder? You better pray they keep the brands split.

[SoxFan01605]

Re: End the Brand Split

I posted this in tonight's Raw thread but I wanted to hear some thoughts.

You don't realize how watered down the talent pool is until you see Swagger, Kingston and Riley competing for the WWE Title. That is disgraceful.

Keep Raw and Smackdown shows and stop the brand split. Add a TV title to go with US and IC title. There is not enough talent between the two brands to justify two "World" titles.

I'm fine with consolidating to one world title, but not for the reasons you mentioned. I think it would add more prestige to being the champ if their is only one true heavyweight title.

As for the wrestlers, the only one I 100% agree on is Riley, who I think is there just to capitalize on him being over with the crowd right now anyway. Kingston is a very good mid-carder to step up into those "filler" roles and Swagger has already been champion and is a legit performer IMO.

The split is fine. If they combine the talent pool then a lot of the better wrestlers who mostly reside in mid-card status would get drowned out. The talent pool is not watered down (there is actually a fair amount of talent in WWE right now), it's just guys have been poorly booked and not given a shot to step up. What do you think a big part of Punk's whole e p i c angle was?

People thought Miz didn't have it, and now he's one of their better developed characters. You have to create opportunities for younger and/or lesser known guys to step up, which doesn't happen if you saturate both shows with the same players night in and night out.

[Millennium]

Re: End the Brand Split

And you say get rid of one big title, but at another mid card one when they can't keep both of their mid card belts relative at the same time?

Oh yeah, and tag champs.

How does this whole one brand thing work again?

[johnnywobbles]

Re: End the Brand Split

Why?

The brand split allows more wrestlers TV time. You like Zack Ryder? You better pray they keep the brands split.

Half of these guys do not deserve tv time I guess is the point. Half of their roster, all with a gimmick of some sort, would have been jobbers back in the day but now jobbers have gimmicks.

I have always been against the Brands how they are used and thought that a specific storyline or angle could be kept exclusive to one show if tv time for more performers was the issue. The talent pool is as weak as it as been since the early to mid 90's just before Austin.

There is not enough talent between both rosters to justify two world titles.

[ChaseB]

Re: End the Brand Split

Half of these guys do not deserve tv time I guess is the point. Half of their roster, all with a gimmick of some sort, would have been jobbers back in the day but now jobbers have gimmicks.

I have always been against the Brands how they are used and thought that a specific storyline or angle could be kept exclusive to one show if tv time for more performers was the issue. The talent pool is as weak as it as been since the early to mid 90's just before Austin.

There is not enough talent between both rosters to justify two world titles.

I'm not bagging on the Attitude Era by saying this, but your mindset is the reason why the World Title picture was stagnant for soooooo long. The 'E' needs to do a better job with the belts and talent around because right now they really do have a lot of guys who can go. I'm not saying you're wrong to say there are not enough high-impact guys, but ending the brand split just ends with Cena/Orton on top even more if you get what I'm saying. I doubt Christian gets his chance, or someone like Bryan wins MitB if it's any other way. The split creates opportunities.

[johnnywobbles]

Re: End the Brand Split

And you say get rid of one big title, but at another mid card one when they can't keep both of their mid card belts relative at the same time?

Oh yeah, and tag champs.

How does this whole one brand thing work again?

Are you looking at who they are telling you are "stars" or are you actually removing the guys that have no business being on tv?

It could be easily done. Actually, I digress about the mid card titles and say the get rid of the IC or US Title. Just like it was in the 80's.

I don't know why they even have Tag Titles now. The division is as bad as the singles division.

They are worrying about a jobber getting tv time? Jobbers can have gimmicks, but that is to make matches more interesting. I think they need to be much more selective about their priorities of who needs on tv.

[Millennium]

Re: End the Brand Split

Are you looking at who they are telling you are "stars" or are you actually removing the guys that have no business being on tv?

It could be easily done. Actually, I digress about the mid card titles and say the get rid of the IC or US Title. Just like it was in the 80's.

I don't know why they even have Tag Titles now. The division is as bad as the singles division.

They are worrying about a jobber getting tv time? Jobbers can have gimmicks, but that is to make matches more interesting. I think they need to be much more selective about their priorities of who needs on tv.

OK, I'll bite. Tell me the 50% of the roster you get rid of. The only rules are you must have all the belts still in tact (except only one world title), and feuds for them for at least 3 months.

[ILiveForThis]

Re: End the Brand Split

I agree, but in a different sense of the idea.

To me, they should be one big brand. If they did this, added another belt (European/TV Title/etc), it'd be perfect. This would make those belts ACTUALLY matter, and level off the talent in sections.

Mr. Perfect, Bret Hart, The Rock, Stone Cold, Shawn Michaels, HHH, hell, even John Cena all made their starts by winning lower-level belts and working their way up. As of now, I feel like the 'supposed' big-time talent is thrown into the WWE/WHC title picture way too quick.

Look at Shaemus, they bring him in to lure the WWE title away from Cena and now that the feud is over, it's hard seeing him in any other role.

Now, if they did make it one big brand, think of all the opportunities of tag teams and alliances it can bring. I feel if they bring it back to becoming one big brand, the TV time can still be split but for the better. They can still headline with big names, not changing the story much because of the fact the roster is, essentially, the same while giving those who want/deserve TV time, the time of day.

[goh]

Re: End the Brand Split

Well lesse...

Rey Mysterio
John Morrison
Kofi Kingston
Evan Bourne
Mike Mizanin
Alberto Del Rio
Dolph Ziggler
R-Truth
Jack Swagger
Drew McIntyre
Zack Ryder
C.M. Punk
David Otunga
Husky Harris
Michael McGillicutty
Kane
Christian
Daniel Bryan
Sin Cara
Yoshi Tatsu
Sheamus
Cody Rhodes
Mark Henry
William Regal
Alex Riley
Wade Barrett
Justin Gabriel

...all of them have talent somewhere. If it's used or not,that's a different thing.
Didn't include Big Show or Kane since they're just there to put people over at this point and Cena's talent varies a lot.

[rangerrick012]

Re: End the Brand Split

Even with the brand split a guy like Drew McIntyre can't even get TV time. Ending the split would make it even worse.

And to the people who are saying some of these guys/characters would be jobbers back in the day - please point to specifics as to who would be a jobber and why they would be a jobber.

[johnnywobbles]

Re: End the Brand Split

OK, I'll bite. Tell me the 50% of the roster you get rid of. The only rules are you must have all the belts still in tact (except only one world title), and feuds for them for at least 3 months.

I understand why they are in there. My point is, the talent pool is weak. But I will entertain you to an extent. I am not going into in depth scenarios.

I am not saying get rid of them, but don't split brands to get jobbers with gimmicks tv time. They are necessary to a roster but their role is to lose matches to stars, not be a priority to get tv time

I had the same "Iron" Mike Sharpe's and Barry Horowitz's I saw as jobbers when I was a kid. Same concept as the old WWF Superstars of wrestling except the jobbers today have more of a gimmick.

Part of being a star is being able to sell a story in and out of the ring, on the mic. Lacking significantly in one or the other means you don't get that push. Mic skills and charisma seriously are lacking in the world of wrestling. There used to be managers to speak for wrestlers lacking on the mic. I don't know why managers have gone away. It is definitely an era that could use some good talkers.

Main Event Guys
Del-Rio
Christian
Punk
Rhodes (almost in the picture, has the total package)
Cena
Orton (I feel is overrated and boring but he is in)
Sheamus
Miz
Barrett (will be there)
Triple H and Undertaker (who have been off tv for a while)

The above people are the best you have. You have to split them up now on two shows? That is fine, but don't restrict yourself by saying you can never be on Raw because you are on Smackdown.

You can run a Orton and Christian storyline on Smackdown but then when it is over, Orton could start a program with Miz on Raw.

I am not saying that they need to get rid of someone. Just recognize who your jobbers are and make the people listed above the focus of the show.

Bryan, Ziggler, Bourne, Morrison, Truth, Kingston, Mysterio, Henry are the mid card. Have not seen enough of Mason Ryan, McIntyr or Gabriel but I think they have the look. McIntyre needs to get better on the mic from what I remember of him. Dibiase is there on name mainly. Very weak on the mic.

I love the New Nexus as Tag champs but they have no one interesting to compete with. I would love to see a good tag team division again. It has been lacking for a long time.

Your giants like Khali, Show, and Kane have been misused for years and I don't think you can ever make them believable in a big push again.

If I HAVE to work with what WWE currently has, then that is how I see it.

[rangerrick012]

Re: End the Brand Split

I think the brand split has been more good than bad. I say this every time people bring it up, but if it wasn't for the brand split, guys like Eddie, Benoit, RVD, JBL, Miz, Edge may have never been main eventers.

[woody2goody]

Re: End the Brand Split

I don't see what the OP's problem is with Kingston and Swagger. Riley maybe because he's not been around a long time, but Swagger won the WHC and had a good reign with it, and Kingston's been around for 4 years and won several titles.

People complain about the ratings and buy-rates and whatever else when Cena and co aren't involved, but in the same breath they will complain when WWE throws new people into the title picture.

It's ok, Cena will be back in the title picture at the next PPV, there's no danger of that. That's what annoys me. People like Rey and Show do spend a fair amount of time in the mid-card between their title challenges, but Cena never does. I can guarantee that he will be involved in the Summerslam title match instead of the guys who were in the tournament. I bet the guy who gets beaten in the final won't get to S/Slam instead of Cena.

That's the problem, it's not that Cena isn't good enough or worthy or whatever, but that he never gets pushed down the pecking order like everyone else does. The only way he should wrestle in the Summerslam main event is if somehow Punk is involved.

The new stars need to be pushed otherwise we'll never find another guy who is at Rock/Austin/Cena levels of popularity.

[The GIGGAS]

Re: End the Brand Split

I would almost go the complete other direction, and make the brand split more rigid. I loved the idea of having brand-specific PPV, as you'd get guys that weren't going to be on a dual (or tri-) branded PPV onto the show, and getting some exposure.

There are a lot of characters that didn't amount to much, like Jimmy Wang Yang, and, honestly, most of the cruisers. But having brand exclusive PPVs allowed them to get some time in the spotlight to make their case. That, and it made the big PPVs even more special.

Sure, perhaps some of them are "jobbers with better gimmicks", but they get paid just like everyone else. I say you use their talent, and who knows, they can become a star. Maybe not Scotty 2 Hotty, but who knows what might happen.

OK, you got me... I just really miss the cruiser division on SmackDown.