9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

[ODogg]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

Just completely randomize rosters


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[canes21]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

I think we all would support that. There's no need to compromise and leave out a roster editor. EA cannot be held responsible for user created rosters even if they are shared on a massive scale. EA got in trouble for having the rosters matchup in the way they did. Each position, player number, class, etc. matched up with the real player's, they just had no name. That got them into trouble.

But like the article states, the NCAA has a policy in place as of now that does not allow anymore NCAA video games to be made. I would love to see that be removed now and we get a random roster game next year, but we all know what is likely.

[McG]

Nobody buys the "student athlete" thing anymore. Maybe from the early '90's all the way back to the start of college athletics, then yes of course. Schools during that period weren't getting paid hundreds of millions of dollars annually back then. Also, professional athletes (with the same recognition as their "student athlete" counterparts) during that time frame, weren't getting paid much more than a successful college grad. So it actually made sense to try to sell the world on the, "free education to play for their university" idea. Well those days are long gone and a lot has changed since this was a legitimate way to compensate their athletes.

The earning potential for NCAA sports exploded in the late '80's-early '90's along with professional athletes and the entire landscape of sports overall changed. So at this point, of course the NCAA wants to keep the amateur status on their athletes. Just look at how they go after any player or institution like rabid dogs that tries to receive cash for play. For instance I'll use the "SMU Death Penalty" as precedent, it was handed down in 1987 and basically shut down the program. Why, because the NCAA knew that if the type of money that was being thrown around became commonplace, then the NCAA would cease to exist. The NCAA knew exactly what they had then and they know now more than ever, what they still have. They are clinging on to the idea of "student athlete" like someone holding on for life at the end of rope hanging over a cliff.

The NCAA use the whole "student athlete" argument and bring up how much a college education costs, then they act like it somehow is an actual cost to the university. The literal cost to put another few people in a class is minimal, especially when compared to what the average "big TV sport" athlete brings to the school annually. That's without even factoring in what a star player can bring in. The "student athlete" argument is an obvious copout by the NCAA and also for the colleges involved. They know that if they have to pay the players then it will effect the bottom line significantly. I mean has anyone been on a major universities campus lately? Any of you that attended that school even 10-15 years ago go, go have a walk around your former campus and tell me if you recognize it. I'm not even talking about the athletic facilities, I mean the department buildings. Sure, some of the money comes from alumni donations, but a huge chunk comes from the athletic department. It's like when a drug dealer drives around the hood in a pimped out ride. Everyone knows how they got a car that costs more than their home, but no one can do anything about it.

I know this is longwinded and if you made it this far, I thank you. What the whole point that I'm trying to make is this. Players should have been getting paid for the last 30 years. They are what you and I pay for when we buy a ticket, get a jersey, put flag on our car, or BUY A VIDEO GAME. Or what ESPN/ABC, CBS, FOX, etc. pays for when they hand over billions of dollars for the rights to show games on TV. We pay for the players name on the back of the jersey, because if they weren't good, very few would watch, if any. Sure, we all have love for whatever university we attended or that we grew up supporting. With that said, when push comes to shove, we wouldn't be spending our hard earned money if the team was full of average no-body's, aka regular students. No we are paying for ATHLETES, athletes that just happen to also be students. So it's time for the NCAA to give up this feeble notion and give the athletes that pay for their school what they deserve, proper financial compensation.

[Skyflame21]

I don't understand why NCAA football simply cannot have all the teams, leagues, bowls, etc and simply have players that are randomly generated.

Then allow guys from this forum or anyone that would like to edit the names, attributes, height and weight, etc. if they have an EA Share then no one will be making any money off players and we can get back to the best part... Fun and enjoyment of college football.

[canes21]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

I don't understand why NCAA football simply cannot have all the teams, leagues, bowls, etc and simply have players that are randomly generated.

Then allow guys from this forum or anyone that would like to edit the names, attributes, height and weight, etc. if they have an EA Share then no one will be making any money off players and we can get back to the best part... Fun and enjoyment of college football.

This is perfectly legal and had EA went this route from the beginning, we would possibly not be here. What is stopping EA from making a game right now is the fact that the NCAA has a policy in place that restricts the production of anymore collegiate sports video games I believe and the article here also states that.

If the policy can be removed, EA or anyone else that is willing can get the licenses from the CLC and the schools themselves and get everything they want into the game and then run generic rosters that can be edited and shared.

[Junior Moe]

This is perfectly legal and had EA went this route from the beginning, we would possibly not be here. What is stopping EA from making a game right now is the fact that the NCAA has a policy in place that restricts the production of anymore collegiate sports video games I believe and the article here also states that.

If the policy can be removed, EA or anyone else that is willing can get the licenses from the CLC and the schools themselves and get everything they want into the game and then run generic rosters that can be edited and shared.

I think that's just for the NCAA itself not licensing. The schools and universities are free to do whatever they like. So if EA or 2K could get all schools onboard (probably impossible at this point) then it could be feasible. It just wouldn't have the NCAA seal, name or logo anywhere. It would probably be a legal nightmare to put together and wrangle up all the schools.

I don't think the universities paying the players is the right move. Sure, the Alabama's and Ohio State's of the world could afford it, but most schools wouldn't be able to. Also, the universities and NCAA are providing them the stage to showcase their talent ( of which about 1% go pro) and offer an education. The players should be able to make money off their likeness, though. If Pepsi want's to pay Cardale Jones 10K for a commercial, let him! If someone wants to pay Todd Gurley 4 grand for some autographs, let him! At the same time, the NCAA gets to use their likeness in videogames and on TV while they are enrolled. The NCAA is clearly making money off the players just spread the wealth and stop hoarding it. There's enough for everyone.

[ODogg]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

We do NOT pay for the name in the back of the jersey in these games because no NCAA game has ever shipped with rosters with names. In fact, the vast majority of the public never even knew you could get named rosters for NCAA.

Having worked with Fairdale for years I can say these statements with utter certainty.

I think EA and the NCAA are wrong on this, that the public would be just fine with NCAA games with rosters that are not indicative of real life. Most people just want to play a college football game with their team and for those who do desire the full experience just include an editor and allow roster share.

I mean seriously I watch college football each year to see Ohio State not Braxton Miller.


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[Kodos]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

I mean seriously I watch college football each year to see Ohio State not Braxton Miller.


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As an aside here: Go Hoosiers this weekend!

[ODogg]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

As an aside here: Go Hoosiers this weekend!

I'm sure OSU will make it interesting being as they are so odd this year vs last. I've been betting on them to NOT cover the spread and I've made a good bit of money this year, LOL.

[GlennN]

This is perfectly legal and had EA went this route from the beginning, we would possibly not be here. What is stopping EA from making a game right now is the fact that the NCAA has a policy in place that restricts the production of anymore collegiate sports video games I believe and the article here also states that.

If the policy can be removed, EA or anyone else that is willing can get the licenses from the CLC and the schools themselves and get everything they want into the game and then run generic rosters that can be edited and shared.

I have to respectfully disagree. Again, I love having the ability to edit, create and share rosters, but if EA built this into an NCAA game, they would absolutely be sued again. The argument would be that EA accomplished the same end, having the player likenesses, and it is moot who made those rosters (the bottom line is that the game is played with real players, and EA sold copies of the game due to that reason). Would EA lose (again)? Hard to say, but they would spend hundreds of thousands of dollars just to defend. Plus there is an absolute risk they would lose (again). They would be much safer just not having creating, editing or (especially) roster sharing in this game. And, as many above have said, we root for the laundry, not the named players. To me, that would be a perfectly fine compromise. Of course, this all assumes the NCAA would license the schools (and, realistically, has the NCAA ever turned down money for anything?).

[jeebs9]

When you think your that these guys are students and scholarship is there payment. The first that pops into my head is that you've probably never been on these kind of teams/situation before. I think it's funny that people who went to school complain about having to study. hahahaha.... I'm sorry but someone people will say anything.

[Greatness]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

The whole notion of "amaueturism" that the NCAA tries to project is nonsense. Are these kids student-athletes? Yes. But this idea that a full ride is adquate compensation and other rules resctrictions under the guise that it is unfair to the student population as a whole is garbage. The NCAA makes a near billion dollar profit of the labor of "amateurs". ESPN doesn't have a 8 billion dollar tv deal for the student body, they have it for "amateurs". These universities make millions of dollar on "amateurs". Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, Kevin Ollie make 5+ mill to coach "amateurs". The money they make their schools well covers their free rides.

These kids should have a right to their individual brand on things outside of university revenue. They should be able to sell rings and sign autographs. Those things are valuable because of the work THEY did. They should get a cut of their jersey sales and they should be compentsated for things like video games.

They need to resolve this, because no one is winning, both in video games and real life.

I mean college hoops 2k17?! Nuts

I agree with everything you have written.

[ODogg]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

I have to respectfully disagree. Again, I love having the ability to edit, create and share rosters, but if EA built this into an NCAA game, they would absolutely be sued again. The argument would be that EA accomplished the same end, having the player likenesses, and it is moot who made those rosters (the bottom line is that the game is played with real players, and EA sold copies of the game due to that reason).

Not true, there's legal precedent as Microsoft was sued in the earlier days of MS Word for plagiarism and courts upheld that MS was just supplying the tools and had no control over how they were used. The courts directed the lawsuit to the person who stole anothers work, as they would do here if someone was selling rosters.

Even if this is true, just make it so there's the ability to edit rosters but no way to online share and we can all just go back to the gameshark days. I'm cool with that.

[Junior Moe]

I have to respectfully disagree. Again, I love having the ability to edit, create and share rosters, but if EA built this into an NCAA game, they would absolutely be sued again. The argument would be that EA accomplished the same end, having the player likenesses, and it is moot who made those rosters (the bottom line is that the game is played with real players, and EA sold copies of the game due to that reason). Would EA lose (again)? Hard to say, but they would spend hundreds of thousands of dollars just to defend. Plus there is an absolute risk they would lose (again). They would be much safer just not having creating, editing or (especially) roster sharing in this game. And, as many above have said, we root for the laundry, not the named players. To me, that would be a perfectly fine compromise. Of course, this all assumes the NCAA would license the schools (and, realistically, has the NCAA ever turned down money for anything?).

I think the thing is whether or not the rosters could be shared. Especially considering everyone already knows how easy it is to edit and put out accurate rosters and I can't see EA or 2K taking that risk. That's the first thing people would do and so I think they could be on the hook because the mechanism has already been used to download accurate rosters. Even though EA did themselves in with totally accurate avatars on the stock rosters. I can't see a scenario where we'd be allowed to share rosters again collegiate games. It just seems too risky. Editing, maybe. But sharing I think is over until, unless, they get the player likeness as EA has said.

[ODogg]

Re: 9th Circuit Upholds NCAA Can't Restrict Athletes

I think the thing is whether or not the rosters could be shared. Especially considering everyone already knows how easy it is to edit and put out accurate rosters and I can't see EA or 2K taking that risk. That's the first thing people would do and so I think they could be on the hook because the mechanism has already been used to download accurate rosters. Even though EA did themselves in with totally accurate avatars on the stock rosters. I can't see a scenario where we'd be allowed to share rosters again collegiate games. It just seems too risky. Editing, maybe. But sharing I think is over until, unless, they get the player likeness as EA has said.

EA can't be responsible for what all people do with their purchased product. And it's easy? Yeah have you ever tried editing rosters? LOL...it took me an entire day just to do Ohio State. It takes roster editors usually a full week of nonstop editing to produce those rosters! I don't think any court would find it's "easy" or even likely the average consumer is going to go through that process.

And even if EA thinks they could be held responsible, as I said, there is an easy fix, just don't include an online roster share. We can go back to how i2 and just exchange save files which is far more trouble than the average EA consumer is going to go to.