Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

[hanzsomehanz]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

While I appreciate the outline of Rex's direction: I still suspect suctioning, and blatant (static) holding that does not get called.

One thing I did value from the pocket vids was the impact of the pushing and shoving in the trenches.

From here I would like to see speed rushes blow by the edges untouched and even thru the A gaps on stunts and blitzes. This is something I could see on M13 at 0 Min speed threshold.

In M25 the roided blocking system actually watered down the effect of the run free tools as it has very much restrained the critical need for ball carry vision and special moves - just beeline to the edge and s-swerve.

The same can be said for next gen trenches if the average blocker continues to maintain his hold with no dynamic footwork in the pocket: sliding and warping to protect the blindside, static holds, tackles leaving their ground only to magnetize w the edge rusher.

There is QB avoidance (still needs work) & RB avoidance: we still need *defender avoidance.

*Defenders must try to avoid and elude blocks, especially those who lack power moves and or cannot win the leverage battle (next gen logic).

The pocket must collapse and it peeves me to oftentimes see it so flat and "static" -- the o-line tackles must bend and dig deep (rex knows this).

Instead of the warped blitz pickups and overdosed static holds: why not allow us to use the qb avoidance tool?

This is football and the same kids who play Madden also play COD and Halo - I am sure they can handle the violence of the game and "war" in the trenches.

→I wish the trench battle were more arcade like: implement some nfl blitz + battlefield tech.


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[regroc88]

where the HELL is the gameplay videos for this game it come out next week !!! EA still on that Bull**** !!! is the game not ready yet???? Sould bee all kinds of videos by now!!!

[woody2goody]

I say they should make it as realistic as possible and if the casual/arcade gamers don't like it then tough. They all watch football. They all realise that rolling out on every play doesn't happen.

I think they'll adjust, and to be honest a lot of casual fans might be glad for the changes as it will look more like real football. In past years I've tried to make a conscious effort to pass more from the pocket but if we're forced to do so in the name of realism then I'm all for it.

Also, it will mean that if people do want to run a lot, for once they'll have to be smarter about it which will make a great Michael Vick play a lot more rewarding.

[wordtobigbird]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

As long its fun, people will play it. We all know real football is fun. If they recreate real football it will be fun.

[ghettogeeksta]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Im not sold their will be a real pocket in this game. Its probably another half done, over hyped feature.

[ruttentud]

Re: Will People Adust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

I think some people will complain, but some people have always complained. If what Kolbe has in mind for this game gets implemented, I've been told some people (casuals) are going to HATE Madden in the future. They have been talking about making some drastic changes towards simulation with Kolbe. He's all about simulation, so if he has much to say about it, I would expect a lot of casuals to be very upset with the direction this game is heading.

From what I've been told by people who have played next gen Madden 25, is that you will have a 2-3 second window to throw the ball and make your reads, due to the realistic pocket forming now. The pocket is not going to be forming artificially at all, Clint Oldenburg has been working day and night on this line play stuff and I think people need to be more appreciative of what he's doing. If everyone over there worked as hard as he has, this game would be something very special.

The last thing we want to do is start bashing him and push him away, instead of encourage what he's trying to do, especially before we have ever even played the game.

I'm unsure, but doesn't Clint just kinda sit there and tell people what to do? He's not actually programming or anything like that, is he?

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

I can assure all of you the new pocket collapse system has a direct and immediate impact on gameplay.

Here are a just a few of the ways it changes the game:

1) It is now critical to read blitzes pre-snap, as slide protection is now a big component of protecting yourself against the blitz.

2) With 5 man protection, you can only block 5 defenders. If they send 6, one will get through. This makes hot routing TE's and RB's in to block another key strategy in running an effective offense.

3) Understanding the concept of a 'hot read' receiver with a short curl, hitch or smoke screen route is often necessary against the blitz.

4) Less time in pocket means less time to go deep. Expect to adapt and hit your check down routes like shallow drags and RB's leaking out into the flat.

There are also huge upgrades in pass defense, making it more important than ever to make good reads.

Rookie and Pro are still pretty safe for the casual, but for everybody else the hope is that they change their play style and employ real football strategies to adapt to the change in direction.

Excellent information if it all works in actual gameplay....A big concern of mine is the proper use of player attributes; as we have all seen from online videos that just with the offensive line, you can replace all the players with 5'6" 160lb linemen with all ratings set to "5" and there is no difference in blocking...Just hope that size/weight and all attributes will be playing a true and effective role in M25 NG...

[mestevo]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Im not sold their will be a real pocket in this game. Its probably another half done, over hyped feature.

Given the videos we've seen I don't see how anyone can think that. Drop back too far or ignore the pocket and you will be eaten alive as far as we can tell.

Looking forward to having to actually step up rather than roll out or back further whenever there is pressure.

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[msdm27]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Given the videos we've seen I don't see how anyone can think that. Drop back too far or ignore the pocket and you will be eaten alive as far as we can tell.

Looking forward to having to actually step up rather than roll out or back further whenever there is pressure.

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You mean the videos manufactured by EA under controlled circumstances that could only show positive aspects of what they were touting? And even in those we could see some sliding/canned animations :/

I'd say we have no proof, positive or negative, as to whether these changes work.

[NDAlum]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

I have to agree with the above. I'm just holding out judgment for a few more days. If I had to put money on it I'd say that the game will be exploitable and the tourney/arcade guys like sgibs and all them will find ways to exploit the game for high percentages of success.

[24]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

I have to agree with the above. I'm just holding out judgment for a few more days. If I had to put money on it I'd say that the game will be exploitable and the tourney/arcade guys like sgibs and all them will find ways to exploit the game for high percentages of success.

I think that people will always find a way to exploit something. It's impossible to make it perfect so someone with enough time on their hands will find a bug and find a way to exploit it.

I'm trying to withhold judgment as well. I'm hoping something magical happens and EA completely blows us away with something we've never seen before. At the same time I'm not expecting it to happen.

[TeeDogg]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Rex if you are still reading. It would be nice to have the animations put back in for LBs and DBs biting on Play Action. I see the would be ball carrier tackled occasionally in the back field, but I haven't seen a second level defender bite in years. occasionally one should peruse the run, then stop and scramble back into coverage. We will also need occasional bite on pump fake animations. preferably the flow of the game and awareness ratings would be big factors in frequency.

if playing QB is truly going to the nxt level in difficulty we need these tools to be more than just for show.

[wordtobigbird]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

http://www.ign.com/videos/2013/11/08/lets-play-madden-nfl-25-cowboys-vs-saints

Watch how these guys play. How the guy rolls out with Brees every single play. Hopefully this stops on next gen.

[ThunderingHerd06]

I don't know much about the whole oline/dline thing in the game because well it never has been realistic. Passing game in general over the past few years has just been way too easy. I mean I actually stopped playing this year because just to try and make realistic #s I had to purposely throw the ball away. I was playing on all madden difficulty with the Falcons and still completing 85% of my passes, rarely getting sacked and definitely no INTs. My biggest problem isn't animation or pockets or any of that.. it has to do with realistic passing (QBs need to be less accurate and throw to spots instead of at receivers.. the DBs need actual reaction ability too) the best way the QB accuracy has been done was with the QB cone in Madden 06. Still was my favorite madden of all time because of this feature that so many people seemed to hate. Fact is better QBs had better window to pass and if you weren't in the cone looking your receiver you were inaccurate it made the whole passing more realistic. Maybe if you could at least do something not quite like that but similar that helps. Or for that matter the HORRIBLE reaction in general by defensive players not being controlled by users needs to be fixed. The game is way too offensively focused and that needs to be fixed.

[Jetpac]

Re: Will People Adjust to the Pocket in Next-Gen Madden?

Wow Rex actually responded on the forums. If THAT doesn't tell you he cares about what we think, then besides not seeing it in the game itself, I don't know how anyone could feel like the devs don't care what we say.

Prob because we have yet to see ANY gameplay footage of a game that will release in 4 days...

Not saying he doesnt care because I honestly think the guy works very hard, but his employers sure don't. And it shows.