Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

[Thunderhorse]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

My biggest gripe is the hit detection in this game. My God, the HD is awful. Players running into each other with no triggered animation. Instead, they just flop like fish out if water. I like physics-based gameplay because it feels more natural, but the physics in M18 are borderline broken. But some animations are nonsensical, too, like the corner shifting three yards to get into the animations.

Remember when the old Maddens were purely animation based? I’m talking ‘01, ‘02. The game looked less natural but played better, IMO. Are these devs sacrificing natural gameplay for realistic looks?

I think they tried to accommodate the community's wants with Madden 13 when they first put in the ragdoll physics stuff.

They don't have enough animations in the game, and the ones they do have oftentimes trigger at inappropriate times. In a game of inches, every step matters. I've felt for a long time Madden lacked enough "failure" animations. They need more animations that accurately and realistically illustrate players losing position or an individual physical contest.

As it is now, momentum means very little when in reality momentum and angles are some of the most important things in football. So the product will often times lie to your eyes in order to play out an animation that can only be based (logically) on a dice roll.

I think people who are ignorant of the game and the nature of it have a much easier time overlooking this because they don't understand how much angles and momentum play into the actual x and o's strategy of a play.

[ForUntoOblivionSoar∞]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

Doesn't cheat, AI just changes tactics down the stretch + you're observing a bug or two and/or shoddy system (challenges) to leave you with that impression.

I think there is one way in which it does "cheat" late in the game, particularly on All Madden: fatigue. I am pretty sure fatigue does not affect the CPU the same way it affects the user controlled team. And I think THIS, if true, is a very big reason why it seems the CPU seems to cheat late in games.

[Ranger Fan]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

Count me in as a firm believer that if there is chance for the computer to do something stupid and for you to lose it will happen. Case in point. Last night i moved the ball down to attempt a 41 yard game winning FG. By the way this has to be the stupidest animation the game has. I get ready to kick the FG and it zooms in on the kicker. Once you hit the button for power the meter just disappears so you really have no clue where to stop the accuracy at. FG gets blocked I lose. If I could see the black accuracy marker like any other FG I would have made it. Ive had guys fumble inside the redzone when all I need is a FG. Miracle comebacks from down 20 with 3 minutes left and all of a sudden they just can't be stopped. Madden needs to do something about the FG camera. Its rediculous. I guess I will just supersim all game winning fg's from now on

[mykelmosinee]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

Count me in as a firm believer that if there is chance for the computer to do something stupid and for you to lose it will happen. Case in point. Last night i moved the ball down to attempt a 41 yard game winning FG. By the way this has to be the stupidest animation the game has. I get ready to kick the FG and it zooms in on the kicker. Once you hit the button for power the meter just disappears so you really have no clue where to stop the accuracy at. FG gets blocked I lose. If I could see the black accuracy marker like any other FG I would have made it. Ive had guys fumble inside the redzone when all I need is a FG. Miracle comebacks from down 20 with 3 minutes left and all of a sudden they just can't be stopped. Madden needs to do something about the FG camera. Its rediculous. I guess I will just supersim all game winning fg's from now on

That's created that way when you or the CPU "ice the kicker"....sure there was a timeout before you kicked...it makes the meter for accuracy disappear, so you have to rely on muscle memory.
It's one of the little things they've done that I actually enjoy.

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[Darth Aegis]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

That's created that way when you or the CPU "ice the kicker"....sure there was a timeout before you kicked...it makes the meter for accuracy disappear, so you have to rely on muscle memory.
It's one of the little things they've done that I actually enjoy.

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I agree this feature is awesome. Actually makes you feel like you accomplished something.

[DaveDQ]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

You have to remember that these games are programmed, and anytime something is programmed, anything can be made to happen. With that, all you have to do is play MUT to know that the game absolutely manipulates scenarios to produce possible results. The programming is obvious in those scenarios, but it sort of has to be.

I think there is a blurred line though that has to do with what might be the "ethics" of creating a game that should be considered. The line is, "has and does Madden programming rely on manipulation of scenarios to help adjust difficulty?" I believe it does, and the reason being is it is difficult to program absolute realism. But, does that mean Madden cheats? I don't believe so.

[NinersFan49]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

You have to remember that these games are programmed, and anytime something is programmed, anything can be made to happen. With that, all you have to do is play MUT to know that the game absolutely manipulates scenarios to produce possible results. The programming is obvious in those scenarios, but it sort of has to be.

I think there is a blurred line though that has to do with what might be the "ethics" of creating a game that should be considered. The line is, "has and does Madden programming rely on manipulation of scenarios to help adjust difficulty?" I believe it does, and the reason being is it is difficult to program absolute realism. But, does that mean Madden cheats? I don't believe so.

That depends on your definition of cheating. Imo having things result from truly random dice rolls isn't cheating, but scripted outcomes are. Interfering with user control also is cheating. Also, calling a play based on knowledge of the user's play as opposed to some kind of strategic ai.

[Thunderhorse]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

That depends on your definition of cheating. Imo having things result from truly random dice rolls isn't cheating, but scripted outcomes are. Interfering with user control also is cheating. Also, calling a play based on knowledge of the user's play as opposed to some kind of strategic ai.

The bolded has been one of my biggest gripes with the product, period.

The way the AI will pull your players out of position, slow them down, or flat out give them useless animations sucks so much of the immersion right out of the experience.

I think "cheating" is a poor word because it insinuates the AI wants to win. I don't really think the AI or devs care about how much the CPU wins, they just want to "simulate" what they perceive to be a realistic stat line or outcome and it forces the gameplay to illustrate that whether the scenario actually warrants those outcomes or not.

[NinersFan49]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

The bolded has been one of my biggest gripes with the product, period.

The way the AI will pull your players out of position, slow them down, or flat out give them useless animations sucks so much of the immersion right out of the experience.

I think "cheating" is a poor word because it insinuates the AI wants to win. I don't really think the AI or devs care about how much the CPU wins, they just want to "simulate" what they perceive to be a realistic stat line or outcome and it forces the gameplay to illustrate that whether the scenario actually warrants those outcomes or not.

Yes, I think it just wants to control the flow of the game more than which team wins. It also "cheats" a lot to help the user by making dumb play calls, etc.

I remember years ago I could fly all over the place with Patrick Willis making plays. Nowadays I'll user a high spd/acc/agil safety or lb and they'll move like they're underwater.

[4thQtrStre5S]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

The game is coded to play a certain way depending on situation, whether that be harder hits or rope like passes to the outside, and maybe it has to do with traits or maybe it is just logic for the CPU so it makes the game difficult?

I know that if we could all win each game by 21+ points, we would all abandon the game rather quick except for those who play online.

My position that the game is coded for come backs or whatever you want to call it, is the fact that the basis for situational game play is in MUT challenges. The logic in MUT challenges has to be in the coding and thus can be accessed from any game mode, so my conclusion is that there is indeed comeback style coding - something that gives the CPU a boost and it is determined by situations coded into the game.

For example - MUT challenge is: Do not let the CPU pass for more than 30 yards and rush for more than 20, this half. (notice the rule has nothing to do with winning or losing, just yards)

The CPU usually starts with the ball, and if you stop them, the CPU will let you run or pass against any defense because all it needs to do is get the ball back...It knows this and plays accordingly...The best way to beat the CPU when this happens is to just gain a few yards and drop to the ground. It is a lame way to play, but it is just one example of how the MUT system plays, and that system is available to all parts of the game..

[JayCutlersCig]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

I used to not think it was bad.

That all changed in a game against Kansas City. I have a CFM as a QB with Cleveland, we’re actually on the up-and-up with a 4-2 record. I have adjusted sliders, so even as a QB with 95/93/89 accuracy ratings, I have errant throws (accuracy set at 45).

Out of nowhere, my passes start going in the opposite direction that my stick is pointing. I tried to throw a sideline dart to Corey Coleman, the pass sails well off to the left and is intercepted. It’s not even close to the WR.

We’re still in the game and it happens *again*. Stick down and to the left, pass goes way off right and is intercepted.

It happened a third time at the end of the game. Dagger route across the middle, I go to drop it in the bucket, and the pass is wildly under-thrown and intercepted. We lose 17-14.

I’m not okay with this dice-roll system; this is on Sim setting on All-Pro. Every other pass since has been wild and uncontrolled, even in setting the slider back to 50. Gonna be taking a looong break from Madden, now.


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[burnwood]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

This is not a thinking man's game. Quite numb if you ask me.

[Thunderhorse]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

This is not a thinking man's game. Quite numb if you ask me.

Probably the best way to describe it.

[mykelmosinee]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

Probably the best way to describe it.

How sad is that clip in this day and age of technology....smh

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[Xpider]

Re: Does Madden Cheat so CPU wins?

Anyone else sick of the mandatory false starts from the AI offense whenever they get close to the red zone?