Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

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  • DubTrey1
    MVP
    • Mar 2008
    • 1023

    #151
    Might as well add my two cents.... I love what I am reading this year from the EA devs. Specificall with Madden 10!!!
    Truly Blessed -

    Comment

    • LBzrule
      Hall Of Fame
      • Jul 2002
      • 13085

      #152
      Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

      Originally posted by adembroski

      Yes! A player changing positions due to defensive assignments should be replaced by his backup, not swapped with the player he replaced.

      I do hope the computer is programmed to use this option as well, in both varieties it comes in in the NFL.

      Madden players usually match their best CB on their opponents best receiver. NFL teams do this now and then, but not that often.

      More often, NFL teams will double the opponent's best receiver, and locked up their best on the opponent's #2. Usually far more effective.
      Actually this is not exactly what I meant. What I meant was this. In the older Madden's let's say I'm running 3-4 and I match up a particular OLB on the starting TE. What happened in those games was if the TE lined up opposite of where that OLB normally lined up, what they would do is automatically swap the other OLB out. I don't want that to happen. If it comes down to it, I want both of my OLB's lined up over the TE. This makes it easy for me to jump into a Bear front from the 3-4. That's why I do not want auto-swapping, so I can line people up the way I want and create fronts with my imagination. Same thing if I line the Safety up on the TE, I do not want a backer swapping out with the SS. That's how the old Madden's did it. The SS would be over the TE on the line, but then the OLB that is normally there now lines up at SS. I don't want that. I want both the SS and the OLB lined up over the TE, another version of a Bear front.

      Comment

      • scalise89
        Rookie
        • Feb 2009
        • 14

        #153
        I just thought of this idea....I think the makers of Madden should use ESPN, obviously, but also put in NBC and CBS since the games are played on those stations as well... HOWEVER, for whatever station your game is playing on, you should have a completely different Presentation, even commentators coudl be different for each station (idk how likely that is, but its a great idea)....also, for the superbowl or monday night games or just big games, have different presentation, have the commentators and fans and everything actually know whats going on instead of having the same OLD REPEATATIVE presentation, it makes the game get boring, we need CHANGE in the PRESENTATION!

        Comment

        • adembroski
          49ers
          • Jul 2002
          • 5825

          #154
          Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

          Originally posted by LBzrule
          Actually this is not exactly what I meant. What I meant was this. In the older Madden's let's say I'm running 3-4 and I match up a particular OLB on the starting TE. What happened in those games was if the TE lined up opposite of where that OLB normally lined up, what they would do is automatically swap the other OLB out. I don't want that to happen. If it comes down to it, I want both of my OLB's lined up over the TE. This makes it easy for me to jump into a Bear front from the 3-4. That's why I do not want auto-swapping, so I can line people up the way I want and create fronts with my imagination. Same thing if I line the Safety up on the TE, I do not want a backer swapping out with the SS. That's how the old Madden's did it. The SS would be over the TE on the line, but then the OLB that is normally there now lines up at SS. I don't want that. I want both the SS and the OLB lined up over the TE, another version of a Bear front.
          I see... my issue with that... if they don't move players in man/zone combos, and the WR moved to TE, and my CB is locked, all of the sudden whoever's taking that WR's place on the outside has nobody on him.
          There are two types of people on OS: Those who disagree with me, and those who agree.

          The first kind is wrong. The second is superfluous.

          The only difference between reality and fiction is that fiction needs to be credible.
          -Mark Twain.

          Comment

          • LBzrule
            Hall Of Fame
            • Jul 2002
            • 13085

            #155
            Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

            Originally posted by adembroski
            I see... my issue with that... if they don't move players in man/zone combos, and the WR moved to TE, and my CB is locked, all of the sudden whoever's taking that WR's place on the outside has nobody on him.
            Well what that does is forces you to call specific man zone combos against specific sets. If the offense only has two WR's you will not have to worry about there being a problem if you are running a 43, 34 man zone combo. Even if the WR subs out, it should auto-lock onto his sub. If they go 3 WR then it forces you to look for that same man zone combo out of the nickel and again you shouldn't have a problem.Secondly, what is a WR doing moving to TE? He should only be able to do that in a specific formation. But they tell us the personnel on the screen. If the WR moves inside, then the TE moves outside. That's where you make your adjustment manually or get out of that defense. At least that's how I'm understanding what you are saying and trying to respond to it.
            Last edited by LBzrule; 03-03-2009, 07:04 PM.

            Comment

            • adembroski
              49ers
              • Jul 2002
              • 5825

              #156
              Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

              Originally posted by LBzrule
              Well what that does is forces you to call specific man zone combos against specific sets. If the offense only has two WR's you will not have to worry about there being a problem if you are running a 43, 34 man zone combo. Even if the WR subs out, it should auto-lock onto his sub. If they go 3 WR then it forces you to look for that same man zone combo out of the nickel and again you shouldn't have a problem.Secondly, what is a WR doing moving to TE? He should only be able to do that in a specific formation. But they tell us the personnel on the screen. If the WR moves inside, then the TE moves outside. That's where you make your adjustment manually or get out of that defense. At least that's how I'm understanding what you are saying and trying to respond to it.
              When John Taylor made the touchdown catch from Joe Montana that beat the Bengals with 38 second left, he was lined up at tight end. In the original West Coast offense, there were rarely players subbed out by formation. The starting eleven were expected to be able to play multiple positions so that the offense forced the defense to stick with its base set... so even if the offense went with 2 tight (as they did on that play), the defense wouldn't know 2 TEs were in on the play until the offense reached the LOS.

              What I'm saying is, if you're not in man-lock... which is usually the case with combination coverages... and you have a corner locked on a WR, and that WR lines up at a position that would normally have a different position (such as a linebacker or safety) covering it, nobody's going to be covering the position the locked corner normally would.

              Now it sounds like you're saying "Then pay more attention and be ready to call audibles when necessary", and I guess I can't argue with that logic.
              Last edited by adembroski; 03-03-2009, 07:22 PM.
              There are two types of people on OS: Those who disagree with me, and those who agree.

              The first kind is wrong. The second is superfluous.

              The only difference between reality and fiction is that fiction needs to be credible.
              -Mark Twain.

              Comment

              • shttymcgee
                Pro
                • Jul 2005
                • 744

                #157
                Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                Originally posted by adembroski
                More often, NFL teams will double the opponent's best receiver, and locked up their best on the opponent's #2. Usually far more effective.

                Not really, the closest thing like this is when a team plays quarter-quarter-half coverage with the cloud coming to the identified receiver, effectively double-zoning him, but if #2 gets to the flat now, the cb will pass the wide out to the safety. You see some bracket coverage every once in a while, but not that much. You hear the "pundits" say so and so was double covered, but in reality it's often the double-zone concept.

                Comment

                • sooners52794
                  Rookie
                  • Feb 2009
                  • 177

                  #158
                  feel free to flame me if this was already said, as i dont feel like reading through the posts, but im counting on there being illegall contact. any chance of this? something was mentioned about the linebacker chucking the wr as he crosses the middle, and i was thinking that if the lb was (and is probably more than 5 yds downfield) that that's definitely illegal contact

                  Comment

                  • adembroski
                    49ers
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 5825

                    #159
                    Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                    Originally posted by shttymcgee
                    Not really, the closest thing like this is when a team plays quarter-quarter-half coverage with the cloud coming to the identified receiver, effectively double-zoning him, but if #2 gets to the flat now, the cb will pass the wide out to the safety. You see some bracket coverage every once in a while, but not that much. You hear the "pundits" say so and so was double covered, but in reality it's often the double-zone concept.
                    I was saying that CB2 and another vs. WR1 and CB1 vs. WR2 is more common than CB1 locked on WR1
                    There are two types of people on OS: Those who disagree with me, and those who agree.

                    The first kind is wrong. The second is superfluous.

                    The only difference between reality and fiction is that fiction needs to be credible.
                    -Mark Twain.

                    Comment

                    • kcarr
                      MVP
                      • Sep 2008
                      • 2787

                      #160
                      Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                      Originally posted by shttymcgee
                      Not really, the closest thing like this is when a team plays quarter-quarter-half coverage with the cloud coming to the identified receiver, effectively double-zoning him, but if #2 gets to the flat now, the cb will pass the wide out to the safety. You see some bracket coverage every once in a while, but not that much. You hear the "pundits" say so and so was double covered, but in reality it's often the double-zone concept.
                      An excellent example of a team covering the number 2 WR with a number 1 corner while having another corner cover the number 1 WR with help from a safety was the jets pats game that went to overtime this year.

                      The jets spent almost the entire game with either dwight lowery or ty law covering randy moss in press coverage with a safety over the top while darrelle revis stayed one on one with welker and the other corner not covering moss covered gaffney. This let welker and gaffney have pretty good games but also kept moss almost completely out of the game. Sure he had the catch at the end of regulation but that was on one of the few plays they didn't go with the previously described coverage. Before that moss had 2 catches for 10 yards.

                      This was the Jets way of forcing the rest of the Pats team to beat them and taking what they figured to be the most dangerous player on the pats roster out of the equation. When you consider the jets were covering an impressive and dangerous group of recievers while they had one good corner, a 4th round draft pick rookie, and a washed up former star corner.

                      Comment

                      • Glorious Arc
                        MVP
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 1875

                        #161
                        Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                        Did anyone notice how in the route running vid the 2010 player started his sprint in a more realistic manner? Not only was his acc and speed changed to be more real but he also looked like a real player getting off the line. He is bent over and is pumping his arms hard until he gets more vertical because he is at speed.

                        Great stuff, I really dont know how in the world EA plans to keep giving stuff out thats better.:wink:

                        Comment

                        • cowboy_kmoney
                          MVP
                          • Jun 2008
                          • 1621

                          #162
                          Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                          Originally posted by Glorious Arc
                          Did anyone notice how in the route running vid the 2010 player started his sprint in a more realistic manner? Not only was his acc and speed changed to be more real but he also looked like a real player getting off the line. He is bent over and is pumping his arms hard until he gets more vertical because he is at speed.

                          Great stuff, I really dont know how in the world EA plans to keep giving stuff out thats better.:wink:
                          Your right bro I really would like to see whats in store for next week...

                          Comment

                          • kcarr
                            MVP
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 2787

                            #163
                            Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                            Originally posted by Glorious Arc
                            Great stuff, I really dont know how in the world EA plans to keep giving stuff out thats better.:wink:
                            I have a couple guesses how they can improve for a couple weeks. Maintaining if for the next few months though, that could be tough.

                            I could see maybe a week on part two of the receiving game. There are a few more things that I think need to be looked at here. This could include but not be limited to:

                            1. Jump balls, there actually needs to be receivers going up for the ball. Maybe animations with players on both sides competing for the ball in the air. Some decision making for the DB in terms of going for the ball vs. going after the receiver. Also something to avoid things like in the Apex vid where Dawkins goes for the ball and then turns while in air to hit the receiver. There needs to be a decision before the jump is made. Also, hitting the receiver is not the only way to force a drop, make players try to strip the ball as it comes in, try to hit it out of the receivers hands and what not.

                            2. A complete reworking of hit while in the air animations. Make more realistic results on these hits. Go away from the spectacular in favor of realistic here. The spectacular animations should be reserved for rare occasions.

                            3. Allowing more control over the touch on passes and more variety of passes to help with properly throwing to the jump ball or dropping a ball over a defender.

                            I could see a week on reworking the running game and tackling animations.


                            1. There is a lot of reworking animations that needs to be done here, some need removed and some added especially in tackles and stiffarms.

                            2. Making agility and acceleration come into play when running and making cuts.

                            3. The ability to push the pile, they said it was in there but I am just not feeling it. It needs to be there.

                            4. Reworking how defenders attack the run. Straight ahead between the tackles runs should not be stopped in the backfield with the exceptions of extrodinary plays by dlinemen and linebackers which should be rare. A solid strong back should be able to force you to move an extra man into the box to stop the running game. Outside runs shouldn't be stuffed by corners in the backfield. Most corners have to stick with their receivers to closely to be able to step up and be a dominant and consistant force stopping the run. There are certainally more things that belong here but I can't think of them now.

                            OLine/Dline Interaction is a huge thing and could definitally cover 2 weeks. One for pass blocking/pass rushing and one for run blocking/run defending.

                            This really doesn't need explanation as it has been discussed in several threads, probably more than any other topic besides presentation.

                            Special Teams although not a huge topic of discussion is also really in need of some reworking. Franchise mode will definitally cover a couple weeks and maybe more.

                            Comment

                            • RGiles36
                              MVP
                              • Jan 2008
                              • 3957

                              #164
                              Re: Madden NFL 10 Blog - Improvements to WR/DB Interaction

                              Originally posted by kcarr
                              3. The ability to push the pile, they said it was in there but I am just not feeling it. It needs to be there.
                              Truth! I hope Ian took heed to this several months ago. I made a thread about how there needs to be collision animations for players on the same team. I know the emphasis is on player control, but I don't have a problem with the CPU stepping in for animations that keep the immersion going. I loved this in NFL2K5: ball carriers squeezing between blockers, pushing the lineman, colliding and being knocked backwards, etc.
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                              • DJDReW3102
                                Rookie
                                • Mar 2005
                                • 79

                                #165
                                Re: Latest Madden NFL 10 blog - WR/DB Interaction

                                i'm liking these improvements...can't wait to see the "big 'back of the box' improvements"

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