QB vision:

[Donovangian]

Re: QB vision:

Any SIM player should have wanted MADDEN to keep the vision cone! Please allow me the chance to explain. At the time the vision cone was inavative and a step in the right direction to fight off cheesers. Because if u recall at the time the game lacked any type of pass rush. And without an addiquate pass rush this caused players to go to the NANO BLITZING. Also im of the mind set that it was a feature that should not have been optional. My reasoning behind this was it would have forced most cheesers to stay in the pocket and actually pass the ball. Also it was a realistic idea that all QBs dont see the field the same. Though I felt that the cone could have been presented better and been a little more transparent. But I have to state that at this time the feature could be good just not as effective as before. The ability to look off LBs and FSs is a major part of any organized football. So as far as Defense is conserned I should be able to play as a safety and follow the QB through his progression and try and jump the route. From a QBs perspective If a defender cheats too much in an attempt to jump a route it leaves a very large passing window. But unless you have a user risk/reward system then you are leaving it to chance or some crappy stat that would force my safety to be out of place. So I think that this feature could be a jump in the right direction if done properly.

[red butler]

Re: QB vision:

It will be harder to bring back since they assigned the right stick as the maneuver stick, ala 2K series.

Personally, I never used the right stick anyway. I used the double tap. I really liked the feature, it seperated the good quarterbacks from the bad ones and made playing the QB position more satisfying.

[mr_president]

Re: QB vision:

i thought the cone was a good idea but horribly implemented. it was supposed to represent field vision, not field of vision.

field vision is a term used to represent how well a QB reads the defense not how big his straw is.

when a QB audibles it usually means he has read the D and has picked up a wrinkle.
there were many ideas in this forum of how much better field vision could be represented bu none better than the user being the determining factor.

if the cone is there just to rep a QB progression through his receivers then all flashlights should be the same size, because now it represents his field of vision and not field vision.

to this day read and lead of the fever series is still the best.

[steph]

Re: QB vision:

i thought the cone was a good idea but horribly implemented. it was supposed to represent field vision, not field of vision.

field vision is a term used to represent how well a QB reads the defense not how big his straw is.

when a QB audibles it usually means he has read the D and has picked up a wrinkle.
there were many ideas in this forum of how much better field vision could be represented bu none better than the user being the determining factor.

if the cone is there just to rep a QB progression through his receivers then all flashlights should be the same size, because now it represents his field of vision and not field vision.

to this day read and lead of the fever series is still the best.

Everybody has the same Field of vision (barely 180°)
But on those 180°, your eyes only focus on the central part of those 180°, the remaining being a bit blury.
So for football, QB vision is how narrow is you focus mode.
I've played a bit at QB, and sucked at it because my vison of the field was too narrow. I would only focus on one receiver and could only see what happened near this receiver. I could miss an open receiver that was running a route 10 meters from the receiver i was focused on. (did i mention i sucked at QB ?)

That's what the cone tried to represent. QB with a better vision/awareness will be able to be aware on what is happening on a bigger part of the field (which was represented by the cone size).

But like another post mentioned, i do simulate the QB reading, by doing the reading myself,, and the cones was just another stuff to handle that just make me lose time.
Problem was, doing the reading for peyton or for Jamarcus with my eyes would lead to the same results.
Maybe something like QB vision helps could be implemented, like a color flashing green on open receiver and red for receiver not opened.
Then this flash would appear quicker with QB having a great awareness (representing the fact they have a good and quick vision) whereas it would take more time to appear for QB with lower awareness, maybe even appearing in the wrong color to represent situation where a QB think a receiver is opened, whereas it's not.

Just an idea...

[Mbalmer]

Re: QB vision:

I wish they would bring it back too. I really liked it. It made me feel the difference in the quarterbacks. I loved how I could lead the receivers with good qb's and with poor qb's it wouldn't work as well. At least give us the option. This is the 1 thing I wish they would bring back more than anything.

[prettyrik]

Re: QB vision:

co-sign.

People who weren't good at it moaned and complained so they got rid of it. I enjoyed it and used it. I wish they would put back in Madden as well.

+1
It was a skill that forced gamers to be a real QB or at least tried to. You could look off the coverages and check down through reads it was SIM ball that required strategic play not brainless cheese.

[nosaints26]

Re: QB vision:

I co-sign with everyone who thinks it should be bought back. It separated the men from the boys and more so the more experienced quarterbacks from the least ones. I'd like to see that AWR rating actually mean something again. Ian jokes about how much of a flop the feature was, but I think many will agree that it was one of the most innovative ideas the Madden team has put forth lately.

[prettyrik]

Re: QB vision:

Any SIM player should have wanted MADDEN to keep the vision cone! Please allow me the chance to explain. At the time the vision cone was inavative and a step in the right direction to fight off cheesers. Because if u recall at the time the game lacked any type of pass rush. And without an addiquate pass rush this caused players to go to the NANO BLITZING. Also im of the mind set that it was a feature that should not have been optional. My reasoning behind this was it would have forced most cheesers to stay in the pocket and actually pass the ball. Also it was a realistic idea that all QBs dont see the field the same. Though I felt that the cone could have been presented better and been a little more transparent. But I have to state that at this time the feature could be good just not as effective as before. The ability to look off LBs and FSs is a major part of any organized football. So as far as Defense is conserned I should be able to play as a safety and follow the QB through his progression and try and jump the route. From a QBs perspective If a defender cheats too much in an attempt to jump a route it leaves a very large passing window. But unless you have a user risk/reward system then you are leaving it to chance or some crappy stat that would force my safety to be out of place. So I think that this feature could be a jump in the right direction if done properly.

+1 well said. That's why morphing/warping in the backfield is so unrealistic we're allowing the madden slot machine to decide the outcome of the play no matter off it may look.

[ZoneBlitz]

Re: QB vision:

People who weren't good at it moaned and complained so they got rid of it. I enjoyed it and used it. I wish they would put back in Madden as well.

I agree. QB vision, to use a popular term, keeps it real. In the NFL, the cat-and-mouse game between the QB's eyes and the defense is an extremely important dynamic of the sport. In some ways, it's a big part of what makes the sport fun, challenging, physical and a chess-match. Even though I was not good at it, I appreciate the realism and was getting better.

I think they should bring it back. It makes the game very realistic. In my opinion, if they can put out a game with huge bugs and sales don't take a big hit, they should leave in QB vision - with no way to turn it off - for a few years so people can get used to it.

Inevitably, the march to realism will have to address the importance of where the QB is looking in the game. That's an essential component of football that no true simulation of the sport can omit.

[2kmaster]

Re: QB vision:

How about this setup. You have to hold down the right bumper button and press the corresponding face button to change which receiver you are looking at. The "chosen" receiver would be represented by a highlighted/glowing icon.

This is a pretty good system (imo) for a couple of reasons: a) it still allows you to play using just the face buttons. The trade off being you can't look off safeties and maybe there should be a hit on the accuracy of your passes. b) You would have to move your trigger finger away from the turbo.sprint button thereby further decreasing the qb scramble cheese. It would also make it much harder to throw accurate passes while on the run since you would have to go back and forth between hitting the RT and the RB. c) It would be a fast/responsive system. In my mind it would almost feel like cycling through receivers in Tecmo Bowl.

Taking it a step further, the highlighted/glowing icon around your "chosen" receiver could be tied into you QB's awareness rating. If you have Peyton, and you are looking at an open receiver the highlight around the icon would glow green. I he is covered it would glow red. Guys with lower awareness ratings would either not get the benefit of the glowing color or have the glow be very faint. What do you guys think?

[Donovangian]

Re: QB vision:

IMO i don't think their is any other way to IMULATE the strategy that goes into looking off receivers, and playing the QBs eyes. When I was a younger man (thinner man:wink I played some DB and FS. And watching a QBs eyes and which way his facemask turned was vital. You see its not just on the QB he may have to show his cards when he has inexperienced WRs who do not run sharp routes. (He has to look for them because they are not where the play needs them to be) This feature done correctly could also be utilized to seperate receivers who run exceptional routes from someone who is simply a Hayward Bay. its easier for a QB to lead a WR,RB or TE when he know where they are going to be.

[Donovangian]

Re: QB vision:

How about this setup. You have to hold down the right bumper button and press the corresponding face button to change which receiver you are looking at. The "chosen" receiver would be represented by a highlighted/glowing icon.

This is a pretty good system (imo) for a couple of reasons: a) it still allows you to play using just the face buttons. The trade off being you can't look off safeties and maybe there should be a hit on the accuracy of your passes. b) You would have to move your trigger finger away from the turbo.sprint button thereby further decreasing the qb scramble cheese. It would also make it much harder to throw accurate passes while on the run since you would have to go back and forth between hitting the RT and the RB. c) It would be a fast/responsive system. In my mind it would almost feel like cycling through receivers in Tecmo Bowl.

Taking it a step further, the highlighted/glowing icon around your "chosen" receiver could be tied into you QB's awareness rating. If you have Peyton, and you are looking at an open receiver the highlight around the icon would glow green. I he is covered it would glow red. Guys with lower awareness ratings would either not get the benefit of the glowing color or have the glow be very faint. What do you guys think?

Well its a good start, but think of this do we really want the gams AI to assist with highlights (green/red etc) this appears to give users to easy of an advantage and the whole purpose on SIM is the strategic game between two players. because who would ever throw to red? the completion would be off the chart.

[blocknose]

Re: QB vision:

i hated the vision cone the idea is a good one but it just isnt something that can be done correct because you look at a diffrent WR by moving your eyes not moving your fingers the way a QB is supposed to look downfield is with their head completely straight ahead and you look of defenders with your eyes

[2kmaster]

Re: QB vision:

Well its a good start, but think of this do we really want the gams AI to assist with highlights (green/red etc) this appears to give users to easy of an advantage and the whole purpose on SIM is the strategic game between two players. because who would ever throw to red? the completion would be off the chart.

I envision it being a very subtle glow, almost akin to the batters eye thing that was in MVP baseball. Maybe on the higher difficulties it would be turned off.

[Jimixiii]

Re: QB vision:

Why should I have to scan the field with my QB when I am scanning the field with MY OWN FREAKIN' EYES!!! lol

Also, the controls weren't intuitive enough. It was an ok idea that failed in it's execution.

this is how i felt about it, i already have my own vision of the field, no need to add a QB vision to simulate a QBs head moment and line of sight to make it more complicated than it is in real life.

the people that do actually like it seem to appreciate it b/c it added realism. but if you really want realism people would be amazed how a simple foot plant & more realistic passing (like not being able to throw a pass across the field with such ease) could make the game more sim than any cone on the field.