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Re: Backbreaker Preview
so madden is a tech demo w/ a franchise mode then in that case... oh and by the way, wii sports isn't a tech demo - just thought i'd let you know :wink:
instead of mentioning our most anticipated games, we should all change it to the seemingly now-interchangeable term - our most anticipated tech demo's.
did you'all hear rockstar's new tech demo is getting 10/10s?
gta4 is a great tech demo.Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
A tech demo (technology demonstration) is a prototype, rough example or an otherwise incomplete version of a product, put together with the primary purpose of showcasing the idea, performance, method or the features of the product. They can be used as demonstrations to the investors, partners, journalists or even to potential customers in order to convince them of the viability of the chosen approach.
This game seems to fit that definition based on the media released.Originally posted by BlzerComment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
jmood wrote :
"A tech demo (technology demonstration) is a prototype, rough example or an otherwise incomplete version of a product, put together with the primary purpose of showcasing the idea, performance, method or the features of the product. They can be used as demonstrations to the investors, partners, journalists or even to potential customers in order to convince them of the viability of the chosen approach."
do you know that Backbreaker is an 'incomplete version of a product'?
if this is the case, we can say that any game made by a company that uses an in-house developed engine where we do not have a full understanding of what the game will offer - is a tech demo. Gears of war then is a Tech Demo showcasing unreal engine 3 etc.. Do you believe this?
If the game has the same exact feature set as APF - will it be considered a tech demo? It's like the game is being faulted for using a new engine
Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
Actually Wii sports is not a tech demo. It was packaged with the system -so what? I've played it.
What would you rather own; NFL tour or Wii Sports? Which game has more gamplay options, more lastability, and is higher quality?
People play wii sports because it's a fun game, and continue to play it well after buying the console.
Just because a game showcases an engine/control scheme etc.. doesn't mean that it can in fairness be reduced to a 'tech demo' in title. I think we can say "this game can also be seen as a tech demo because ______" but in this case we can clearly say the same thing about AAA titles like Gears of War.Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
It's not being faulted for anything, people just aren't buying into this being an actual game yet when we've seen bits and pieces of things and a clip of a possible minigame. I don't know what Backbreaker is but I do know that they've released videos that have no sound(because it wasn't ready yet), they've shown very short clips of two or three people, and part of a minigame. Have we even seen different teams yet? All I remember seeing are the same two teams every single time.
No you really can't say that. People are saying that this game is a tech demo because of the lack of things shown.if this is the case, we can say that any game made by a company that uses an in-house developed engine where we do not have a full understanding of what the game will offer - is a tech demo.
You're really reaching for comparisons. The tech demo video for Unreal 3 is actually pretty close to what we've seen of this game, just bits and pieces highlighting the engine.Gears of war then is a Tech Demo showcasing unreal engine 3 etc.. Do you believe this?Originally posted by BlzerComment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
bold#1
this is my problem - there are hundreds of game with a lack of 'things shown' yet they are not called tech demos. It seems people are saying this AS A RESULT of the fact that the new and exciting euphoria engine is being used.
Bold#2
I used the gears example to prove a point which is: the logical line of reasoning used to call backbreaker a tech demo can be used in crazy scenarios like epics gears of war - by exposing this i was hoping to show that it's the line of reasoning itself which is crazy. Also natural motion already has a bunch of actual tech demo vids, the backbreakergame.com website is not an extention of those, but it's own entity.
You actually sound as if you're skeptical that they are making a football game; is that the case?
Do you think the dev diaries about the control scheme were lies?
I didn't even think it was debatable that they're making a football game for consoles, - I'm pretty sure though that the main point you guys are making is that they are making this product to shop the engine, but you are not clear as to what that meas for the game itself.
If you think the game will be a tech demo - what does that mean? How would a "tech demo" football game differ from madden or APF in principle? In other words to call a game a tech demo, YOU are the one that needs criteria by which to call it that.
here is an example - " a football videogame ceases to be a 'game' and is a 'tech demo' in the event that it does not have a season mode." or some other criteria, follow?
or maybe it's a tech demo if you can only play 2 teams and play a single game at a time ? ----if this were the case as I've said in a different post it could be an XBLA title, which would have a heck of a lot more depth than other xbla titles.
If they release a retail game that you buy in a store, I think it's logical to assume that the game would have a season mode and we already know there is one minigame, and a uniform editor. I think I can assume a season mode and a variety of teams to make up a league for a number of reasons: 1) i'll give naturalmotion the benefit of the doubt that they are not complete morons 2) If they released a disc w/ 2 teams, tackle alley, and quckmatch only it would be slammed like few other games of this millenea, and sales would be next to nill 3) releasing a barebones game is cheaper and more effective for the company to do it over xbla and psn 4) even if you want to market your engine, you want people to at least take notice and create a CONSUMER DEMAND - which you cannot do if you sell 5k copies of a POS game; nobody's buying bomberman act zero's engine. Given my imo reasonable assumptions if that is all the game ships with, is that a tech demo and why?Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
Which games? People are saying it because this is a company that has never made games before and isn't showing anything.
Your reasoning is faulty. There is absolutely no comparison between the two situations. The only thing that's similar is that they are using engines that they built. Epic, however showed the game to people(the media) before it came out, all the news about Backbreaker is coming from the team. No one has seen the game in action. Epic has also made games before so people don't really have a reason to be skeptical of them coming out with a game.Bold#2
I used the gears example to prove a point which is: the logical line of reasoning used to call backbreaker a tech demo can be used in crazy scenarios like epics gears of war - by exposing this i was hoping to show that it's the line of reasoning itself which is crazy. Also natural motion already has a bunch of actual tech demo vids, the backbreakergame.com website is not an extention of those, but it's own entity.
There has been nothing shown to suggest that a game is actually coming out. It has no release date, it hasn't been shown to the press, they haven't released any videos showing gameplay(outside of that one minigame video.) We haven't even seen more than two teams.You actually sound as if you're skeptical that they are making a football game; is that the case?
It's pretty clear that if this whole thing is a tech demo then it isn't going to be a full game.Do you think the dev diaries about the control scheme were lies?
I didn't even think it was debatable that they're making a football game for consoles, - I'm pretty sure though that the main point you guys are making is that they are making this product to shop the engine, but you are not clear as to what that meas for the game itself.
I posted the definition of a tech demo and that's what this game is looking like right now. Madden and All Pro Football are full games, we don't know what this thing is going to be.If you think the game will be a tech demo - what does that mean? How would a "tech demo" football game differ from madden or APF in principle? In other words to call a game a tech demo, YOU are the one that needs criteria by which to call it that.
A football game is a tech demo when you never see things working in concert. All we have seen are shots of tackling, a soundless pan of a stadium, and a few clips of the crowd. My criteria is pretty simple: show gameplay or I'll assume then I'll continue to speculate on whether it's a tech demo or not. If this was an established company that didn't have anything to gain by showing parts of their engine then my thinking would change but that's not the case with this game.here is an example - " a football videogame ceases to be a 'game' and is a 'tech demo' in the event that it does not have a season mode." or some other criteria, follow?
or maybe it's a tech demo if you can only play 2 teams and play a single game at a time ? ----if this were the case as I've said in a different post it could be an XBLA title, which would have a heck of a lot more depth than other xbla titles.
Do you still not understand what a tech demo is? What I don't get is why you and a couple other people in here get so offended because people are talking about it being a tech demo.If they release a retail game that you buy in a store, I think it's logical to assume that the game would have a season mode and we already know there is one minigame, and a uniform editor. I think I can assume a season mode and a variety of teams to make up a league for a number of reasons: 1) i'll give naturalmotion the benefit of the doubt that they are not complete morons 2) If they released a disc w/ 2 teams, tackle alley, and quckmatch only it would be slammed like few other games of this millenea, and sales would be next to nill 3) releasing a barebones game is cheaper and more effective for the company to do it over xbla and psn 4) even if you want to market your engine, you want people to at least take notice and create a CONSUMER DEMAND - which you cannot do if you sell 5k copies of a POS game; nobody's buying bomberman act zero's engine. Given my imo reasonable assumptions if that is all the game ships with, is that a tech demo and why?Originally posted by BlzerComment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
I've bolded sections that are either - contradictions, incoherent, or false logical progressions.
If you heard on the radio that someone is dead in a parkinglot, and I said with absolutle certainty "It was a suicide." would you then see how your logical progression is false? Because this is really what you're doing.
you said yourself at one point " ..we don't know what this thing is going to be." Yet continuously call it a tech demo. How can you do this when you admit that you obviously don't know what it is?
I have a reasonable position here to believe the game will be released on the 360 for example (press releases, in game footage shown running on next gen console, dev diaries, ask the developer segements).
You have absolutely NO reason to assume the game will not release, or that it is a tech demo. It doesn't matter how many times you post "I haven't seen anything, so it's a tech demo/not being released" that statement will be wrong a multiple levels every time.
Heck, even if the game isn't released; that still doesn't make it a tech demo. There are many games that have been canned by first-time developers or otherwise (frame city killer, thrill kill).
Now, what are you going to say if the game releases this summer? ... "oops" ??? you had no reason to believe it wasn't going to be in the first place. This game is like any of the other hundreds of other games that at some point had a TBA release date.
I'd also like to add that All-Pro Football 2k8 didn't have any gameplay footage at this point last year, so in all fairness it's not reasonable to expect more from 6 men (backbreaker team). Last I checked backbreaker hasn't been released, so they still have time to release footage (not that this magically makes the game more real)Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
When you bold parts without the responses of course it doesn't look right but I was responding to things that you said so whatever contradictions you think there are they stem from your statements.
That's not even close to what I've done.If you heard on the radio that someone is dead in a parkinglot, and I said with absolutle certainty "It was a suicide." would you then see how your logical progression is false? Because this is really what you're doing.
I did not call it a tech demo, I said that that is what it looks like right now and I gave reasons for why people are calling it a tech demo.you said yourself at one point " ..we don't know what this thing is going to be." Yet continuously call it a tech demo. How can you do this when you admit that you obviously don't know what it is?
[quote]I have a reasonable position here to believe the game will be released on the 360 for example (press releases, in game footage shown running on next gen console, dev diaries, ask the developer segements).
First of all, how in the world can you tell me that I'm "wrong" when you have no more information than I do? Second of all, I do have reason to think that this game might not come out and I've repeated it multiple times.You have absolutely NO reason to assume the game will not release, or that it is a tech demo. It doesn't matter how many times you post "I haven't seen anything, so it's a tech demo/not being released" that statement will be wrong a multiple levels every time.
If it's not released then it's either a tech demo or a waste of time/money.Heck, even if the game isn't released; that still doesn't make it a tech demo. There are many games that have been canned by first-time developers or otherwise (frame city killer, thrill kill).
I'll say "hey, Backbreaker just came out".Now, what are you going to say if the game releases this summer? ... "oops" ??? you had no reason to believe it wasn't going to be in the first place. This game is like any of the other hundreds of other games that at some point had a TBA release date.
All Pro Football was made by a company that has made games before and was shown to the press. Also, All Pro Football was announced around January 07 and shown to magazines in March/April 07. Backbreaker was announced last November and we still haven't seen anything substantial.I'd also like to add that All-Pro Football 2k8 didn't have any gameplay footage at this point last year, so in all fairness it's not reasonable to expect more from 6 men (backbreaker team). Last I checked backbreaker hasn't been released, so they still have time to release footage (not that this magically makes the game more real)Originally posted by BlzerComment
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Re: Backbreaker Preview
[quote=jmood88;2038361995]When you bold parts without the responses of course it doesn't look right but I was responding to things that you said so whatever contradictions you think there are they stem from your statements.
That's not even close to what I've done.
I did not call it a tech demo, I said that that is what it looks like right now and I gave reasons for why people are calling it a tech demo.
bold #1 here's you pg. 17 official backbreaker: "you need to show more than short clips of a tech demo."I have a reasonable position here to believe the game will be released on the 360 for example (press releases, in game footage shown running on next gen console, dev diaries, ask the developer segements).
First of all, how in the world can you tell me that I'm "wrong" when you have no more information than I do? Second of all, I do have reason to think that this game might not come out and I've repeated it multiple times.
If it's not released then it's either a tech demo or a waste of time/money.
I'll say "hey, Backbreaker just came out".
All Pro Football was made by a company that has made games before and was shown to the press. Also, All Pro Football was announced around January 07 and shown to magazines in March/April 07. Backbreaker was announced last November and we still haven't seen anything substantial.
again: "If they had actually shown something other than tech demos I would have no problem getting excited about the game" ***that's called a contradiction
there are a bunch of others flat out calling it a tech demo too. Also the videos we've seen are "in-game footage running on next gen consoles".
Bold#2 - All of the information available points to the game being developed and eventually released on consoles. None of the information available indicates that it will not - that's why it's odd that you and others relentlessly call it a tech demo or deny it will be released. As I said, repeat yourself till you're blue in the face, and you'll still have no foundation for your argument every time. You haven't even provided a similar scenario which has lead you to believe what you do.
Bold#3, and I'll say - "why did you waste everyone's time trying to convince them the game isn't comming out or that it's a tech demo when you had no evidence or reasons to assume so?"
bold#4 - we actually didn't see anything substantial for all-pro until june 28 with the on the spot gameplay footage.
By reading over your posts I've realized that they actually have nothing to do with discussing backbreaker. They contribute nothing to those that have interest in the game. Why do you keep repeating yourself over and over? What is your reason for posting in the backbreaker threads? What do you feel you've contributed to the discussion?
your biggest points; they have never made a game before, and they haven't released as much information as other games, and their release date is TBA/// so what? we read that, and undertand that, what's the point in constantly posting that?Liquor in the front, poker in the rear.Comment
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