2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

[TheMatrix31]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Man!

I don't see him being the player others see him being, unless he goes to a team with an already dominant player on the line. Like the Texans.

It would be very difficult for me to pass up the opportunity of having Watt (hopefully) mentor him and he reach his potential. But if I was the Texas, I'd try out. You'll have enough falling for the Clowney hype and needing QBs that they should get a good deal.


Clowney owes all of this **** to Vincent Smith.

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The potential is worth salivating over, that's for damn sure. I dunno. I can see it happening I suppose.

As for Schaub, his time is just up. He's not as bad as this last season suggested, just as the Texans aren't as bad as this last season suggested. But it's time.

[Crimsontide27]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

The thing that pissed me off about Clowney is how everyone told him he would be the #1 pick this year, and maybe one of the best defensive ends to ever play the game, and he comes out and half-asses the entire season.

If you have people saying all that, back it up. Have the best season of your college career. Break records. Don't sit out plays because you don't feel like playing.

I know many people may not agree, but I see Clowney being like Vernon Gholston from Ohio State. An absolute beast of a player in college, and was pathetic in the pros.

A few years ago I believed he would be a force in the NFL, but after watching him this past season all that has diminished. His conditioning was awful. Throughout the whole season he was running around gassed and not contributing much, and not to mention he would take entire series off because he was tired.

[bigbob]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

What's crazy is that 3 years ago, "experts" were saying if players could go from high school to the pros, he'd be the first since Adrian Peterson that they thought could do it.

Now, people are wondering if he'll have the work ethic to succeed.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

I think the concerns about Clowney's motor are excessive. Consider the circumstances. He was basically walking around all last year with a lottery ticket in his back pocket, knowing that one false move could cost him millions. He would have been the #1 pick last year so he, literally, had nothing to gain by coming back. He only came back because some stupid rule made him. To expect that to not affect him at all is unreasonable. He's human. I know it would have affected me. It was pretty clear all last year that he was just over it when it came to the college game and I don't see anything wrong with that.

[kingkilla56]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

I think the concerns about Clowney's motor are excessive. Consider the circumstances. He was basically walking around all last year with a lottery ticket in his back pocket, knowing that one false move could cost him millions. He would have been the #1 pick last year so he, literally, had nothing to gain by coming back. He only came back because some stupid rule made him. To expect that to not affect him at all is unreasonable. He's human. I know it would have affected me. It was pretty clear all last year that he was just over it when it came to the college game and I don't see anything wrong with that.

This is exactly what has people questioning his motor and drive. The guys you want at the top of the draft dont just take years off because they have "lottery tickets" in their back pockets.

That projects beyond just this past year. What happens every year that isnt a contract year? He just chills out then goes hard when his contract is up? If hes just not feeling playing one game hes just gonna take the day off?

I think concerns are valid on him.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

This is exactly what has people questioning his motor and drive. The guys you want at the top of the draft dont just take years off because they have "lottery tickets" in their back pockets.

That projects beyond just this past year. What happens every year that isnt a contract year? He just chills out then goes hard when his contract is up? If hes just not feeling playing one game hes just gonna take the day off?

I think concerns are valid on him.

The only difference is now he'll be a paid professional. Only in sports do we think paying someone demotivates them. I think we seriously underrate how much was at risk for him this past year. He assumed 100% of the risk in a situation with millions of dollars at stake. I'd have been over working for free at that point too. I think it's abnormal NOT to be over it.

You know what I think is overrated? The narrative that every good football player eats, sleeps, breathes football. I have a nagging suspicion that, for most guys, it's just a job that they're good at.

Were there questions about Clowney's motor before last year?

Will he be great? I don't know, hell no one knows. I'm just trying to frame the conversation in the proper context because his situation is EXTREMELY unique (sophomore, consensus #1 pick, forced to come back and play for free because of some stupid rule).

[ubernoob]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Yes. Or at least some parts of his work ethic.

Academic suspension from the spring practice his frosh year, some conditioning issues and its been said a couple times in the past that, while he does put in work (youd be kidding yourself to say that any of these kids don't) he's coasted off of his elite athleticism/talent at times.

It's whatever, though. Nobody really knows but him. I just want the draft to be over with already so everyone and their ma's stop talking like they know everything about every player all over the place.

[ProfessaPackMan]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

The only difference is now he'll be a paid professional. Only in sports do we think paying someone demotivates them. I think we seriously underrate how much was at risk for him this past year. He assumed 100% of the risk in a situation with millions of dollars at stake. I'd have been over working for free at that point too. I think it's abnormal NOT to be over it.

You know what I think is overrated? The narrative that every good football player eats, sleeps, breathes football. I have a nagging suspicion that, for most guys, it's just a job that they're good at.

Were there questions about Clowney's motor before last year?

Couldn't you say this about any college player though? Yet for most of them, they didn't let that get in the way of their performance.

As for your question, I believe there were questions/concerns about it, just not as much as it is now but that's mainly because everyone spent last offseason talking about "The Greatest Hit/Tackle in College Football History" everytime Clowney's name up.

[kingkilla56]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

The only difference is now he'll be a paid professional. Only in sports do we think paying someone demotivates them. I think we seriously underrate how much was at risk for him this past year. He assumed 100% of the risk in a situation with millions of dollars at stake. I'd have been over working for free at that point too. I think it's abnormal NOT to be over it.

You know what I think is overrated? The narrative that every good football player eats, sleeps, breathes football. I have a nagging suspicion that, for most guys, it's just a job that they're good at.

Were there questions about Clowney's motor before last year?

Yeah because guys have been paid and gone on to phone it in. It happens all the time in sports, lets not pretend that it doesnt.

And the narrative is you pay guys millions to give their all into their job. Not take a year off because they are at risk. What happens when Clowney wants to test free agency at the end of his rookie deal and he just phones it in because he doesnt want to be injured going into free agency? Why would that not be a negative thing for his team?

And before last year Clowney didnt have his "lottery ticket" as you put it. So why wouldnt he go hard then? He wasnt gonna be picked if he never showed anything. He got a big head and decided he was already the top draft pick. And we got that season out of him.

And to be clear, I dont want to assume he dialed his last season in. But thats certainly what it looked like. I tend to side more on the "he just wasn't that good last year and teams schemed him out of the games (easily mind you)" boat.

[Hooe]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Big fan of Matt Schaub, but IMO his days as a starter anywhere in the league are over. His arm just looked dead to me. I hope he proves me wrong, but he definitely isn't going to be getting that chance in Houston.

I wonder if the Texans, should they go defense over any of the QBs, would consider taking Anthony Barr over Jadaveon Clowney on account of work ethic. Barr started out as a RB in college and worked his way to being a top pass-rushing prospect, and has the size to play 3-4 OLB. CBS Sports compares his game to DeMarcus Ware, which is pretty lofty, though admits he has work to do against the run and in coverage. Barr might be a better fit for the Texans' 3-4 front anyway, given that Clowney rarely played with his hand down at South Carolina, but I don't know how much of a difference that really makes.

Ideally, I think Houston trades down and picks up draft picks, but in order to do that someone has to want to trade up.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

And the narrative is you pay guys millions to give their all into their job. Not take a year off because they are at risk. What happens when Clowney wants to test free agency at the end of his rookie deal and he just phones it in because he doesnt want to be injured going into free agency? Why would that not be a negative thing for his team?

I thought the narrative was players in contract years went harder than usual.

And before last year Clowney didnt have his "lottery ticket" as you put it. So why wouldnt he go hard then? He wasnt gonna be picked if he never showed anything. He got a big head and decided he was already the top draft pick. And we got that season out of him.

That's my point. It appears he's motivated by money (just following the clues, I don't know the guy). Why is there a negative connotation attached to this? That makes him like the vast majority of us. You pay him, he plays hard. My motivation would fall off a cliff at work if I wasn't being paid. He had ZERO to gain last year. Nothing.

If you draft him, you have him locked into a controlled salary for 4 years and even more if you take into account the various franchise/transition/etc tags. We've seen entire rosters turned over in 4 years. Cross the FA bridge when you get to it.

[kingkilla56]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

I thought the narrative was players in contract years went harder than usual.



That's my point. It appears he's motivated by money (just following the clues, I don't know the guy). Why is there a negative connotation attached to this? That makes him like the vast majority of us. You pay him, he plays hard. My motivation would fall off a cliff at work if I wasn't being paid. He has ZERO to gain last year. Nothing.

If you draft him, you have him locked into a controlled salary for 4 years and even more if you take into account the various franchise/transition/etc tags. We've seen entire rosters turned over in 4 years, cross the FA bridge when you get to it.

And thats why you want a guy to ALWAYS go all out for his team. I've seen both sides in the league. Ive seen one version from Hakeem Nicks this year and Ive seen the other side from Justin Tuck this year. You damn right the Giants wish they both would give their all in every season. The point is if youre a team you want a guy who will go hard in every circumstance. Maybe thats too much to ask for, but thats what teams want. You can't watch Clowney's efforts and not question what you're gonna get.

My point is you dont know what youre gonna get out of the man. Why didnt Andrew Luck have these exact same concerns coming out two years ago? Because he always went hard. Not a single question of his effort or drive. Never worried about him getting paid or not. Thats what you want out of the top guy in the draft.

Clowney is the polar opposite. Do we even know that him getting paid will motivate him to actually try hard? Do we know that for sure? We've seen top draft picks get paid and literally lay down the rest of their short careers.

All I'm saying ultimately is that concern over Clowney is called for. And we not even talking about his off the field issues.

[dsallupinyaarea]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Fair enough. The concerns are valid, I just think they're way over the top. When framed with context, there are very valid reasons why his motivation would have been lacking last year. There are definitely questions he'll have to answer, but I'd be shocked if he fell out of the top 5.

[Jr.]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Not to mention Clowney saw Marcus Lattimore go from a 1st round pick to a 4th round pick, and lose tens of millions of dollars, after two horrible knee/leg injuries.

Clowney will still go in the top 10, and likely the top 5. I don't think he made a bad decision at all by playing the way that he did last season.

[ubernoob]

Re: 2014 NFL Draft Discussion Thread

Not to mention Clowney saw Marcus Lattimore go from a 1st round pick to a 2nd day pick, and lose tens of millions of dollars, after two horrible knee/leg injuries.

Clowney will still go in the top 10, and likely the top 5. I don't think he made a bad decision at all by playing the way that he did last season.

How exactly did Marcus Lattimore lose tens of millions of dollars? He signed a contract worth 2.5 million.

Gio Bernard, the first RB taken (and Lattimore wasn't getting picked before Bernard/Lacy), signed a 5.25 million dollar deal. Both are 4 years.