Official Denver Broncos Thread

[Broncos86]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

He also had time to make reads

Von Miller is having a breakout rookie year but the Tebow stuff is shuffling it off to the side

Agreed. What Von Miller is doing is incredible. He's going to the Pro Bowl, no doubt. He has truly been dominate, it's clear that opposing QBs are literally afraid of him.

And time to make reads? Try FOREVER to make reads. On many throws, he had over SEVEN seconds in the pocket. That's incredible, the offensive line should be toasted by Tebow. I said it earlier this year, the offensive line is a good young group. They solidified as a running-blocking unit. Now, they're starting to solidify as a pass-blocking unit. They're only going to get better. People want to say the line is terrible. That's hardly the case. They're just inexperienced. The talent pool is immense. When a guy like Orlando Franklin puts it all together with his physical size, look out.

[av7]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Notes from Foxsports

OLB Von Miller had a career-best 10 tackles for the second straight week and moved a half-sack past Mike Croel (10, 1991) for second place on the club's all-time rookie sack last. Miller trails only Rulon Jones (11.5, 1980) for the top spot.

8 -- Touchdown receptions this season by 2010 third-round pick Eric Decker. A native of Cold Spring, Minn., and a former first-team All-Big Ten selection at the University of Minnesota, Decker returns to his home state already with the second-highest total of scoring catches by a first- or second-year player in Broncos history. Decker trails only Lionel Taylor's 12 TDs in the franchise's inaugural season in 1960.

[Jonsco28]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Tebow is making strides. The biggest thing is he's not turning the ball over. In six starts, he's thrown one pick and lost one fumble, both in the Detroit debacle. He's making plays when they need it, but I believe he could do much more if McCoy would let him put it up a little more. Tebow could have very easily been 13-18 if not for some drops. Two drops would have kept drives alive. The TD to Decker and the ball to Rosario were beautiful throws. The throw to Fells was pretty nice, too.

I don't think the option is dead; they just turn to it a little bit too much and it becomes predictable. It may not work all of the time, but it is still effective. If I am not mistaken, that run by McGahee to put them in FG range came off of a read-option.

It's frustrating to watch sometimes (LET HIM THROW!!! - enough with the option on third and 5), but it's hard to argue against something that has been working. Their offense is evolving and their defense has been absolutely outstanding.

This team has developed a totally different complexion over the past month and a half. They've gone from being one of the laughing stocks in the league to a team that people are beginning to take seriously.

Best of all.... it feels good to have a winning record.

[wwharton]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

I've watched OC's try to speed up the process for when a QB should be let go to throw more (my own Flacco, Sanchez, Alex Smith... the kid in Chicago now) and all I can say is be careful what you wish for. The Tebow I saw still isn't making good reads in the passing game. The oline is giving him plenty of time to find WRs breaking off plays to come open (no play takes 7 seconds to develop). There were a couple of cases where I could see from the TV that guys were wide open and he just couldn't see them... one they replayed and the WR was literally jumping up and down and waving his arms about 10 yards in front of Tebow before Tebow just threw the ball away. If a defense can force Tebow to pass within the time it takes to make a normal 3 step or 5 step drop, he's far from ready to go through any progressions and make a throw. And his accuracy is still far from being trustworthy to make those plays on a consistent basis.

Now with that said, as just mentioned he's not turning the ball over which is HUGE. He's also doing a good job making decisions with the ball in the read option set (yes, that last play to Willis was a read option). Like everyone else, I don't believe this base for an offense can work long term, but it's playing to his strengths and masking his weaknesses so it's what they should stick with. I would LOVE to see him start figuring out the passing aspect of the position too but he's still just not there yet.

[Broncos86]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

One nice benefit is that, if Tebow drops back more, he can always just run with it. That being said, I personally would not want my QB carrying the ball 22 times in a game. Tebow took some hits, and it was clear the defense was trying to rough him up.

And yeah, Matthew Willis was WIDE open in the middle of the field, and Tebow didn't see him. And as I said, his reads need to get better, but he'll only get better at making reads is if he passes the ball. IMo, let him drop back and try to make a read. If it isn't there, let him run. He'll turn the play positive, you avoid picks, and he gets the repetitions he needs in looking at reads.

After that, he can go into the film room and diagnose those plays where he tried to make a read and he can see where he missed Willis and other receivers. THAT is where he'll improve his decision-making. Hesitation kills, and it can cause inaccuracy in throws. The more confident he becomes in his decision-making, the better he'll throw the ball.

[SkeeterJD]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Tebow made strides today. He made throws in tight windows. If it weren't for a couple drops, his stats would look better. But by and large, Tebow looked much better today.

It was because his receivers weren't in a rhythm...

[wwharton]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

One nice benefit is that, if Tebow drops back more, he can always just run with it. That being said, I personally would not want my QB carrying the ball 22 times in a game. Tebow took some hits, and it was clear the defense was trying to rough him up.

And yeah, Matthew Willis was WIDE open in the middle of the field, and Tebow didn't see him. And as I said, his reads need to get better, but he'll only get better at making reads is if he passes the ball. IMo, let him drop back and try to make a read. If it isn't there, let him run. He'll turn the play positive, you avoid picks, and he gets the repetitions he needs in looking at reads.

After that, he can go into the film room and diagnose those plays where he tried to make a read and he can see where he missed Willis and other receivers. THAT is where he'll improve his decision-making. Hesitation kills, and it can cause inaccuracy in throws. The more confident he becomes in his decision-making, the better he'll throw the ball.

You're assuming a lot. He's doing a GREAT job at decision making in the read option offense... that's where's he comfortable and shows his strength. You're not just asking him to drop back more or make more passes, you're assuming he will do equally well at making reads or deciding when to break off a play and run. Right now I'm waiting for him to look past his first option along with everything else he has to learn... not to mention be ready to deliver the ball as soon as he plants (happens more often with a good ability to read the D before the snap). There are so many things that could go wrong with putting him in a more traditional offense before ready, I think his success in this current offense is making you forget about them.

[Broncos86]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

You're assuming a lot. He's doing a GREAT job at decision making in the read option offense... that's where's he comfortable and shows his strength. You're not just asking him to drop back more or make more passes, you're assuming he will do equally well at making reads or deciding when to break off a play and run. Right now I'm waiting for him to look past his first option along with everything else he has to learn... not to mention be ready to deliver the ball as soon as he plants (happens more often with a good ability to read the D before the snap). There are so many things that could go wrong with putting him in a more traditional offense before ready, I think his success in this current offense is making you forget about them.

Oh, don't take me the wrong way. Just flip back a couple pages in this thread. Did everyone forget I was the one guy giving Tebow a scathing review based on his recent performances?

What I said before remains true: I feel this offensive scheme cannot last and I want to see Tebow make strides as a passer. You have to learn the hard way. If he throws picks, then he throws picks. I want to see him try to make reads. That way he can take those experiences into the film room and learn from them. As a hockey coach and player, there is NOTHING more valuable than experience in a game situation. My kids have learned the most from seeing themselves in game situations and understanding how they reacted and what they could've done differently. NOTHING compares to it when trying to improve on the mental aspects.

SkeeterJD, you're on notice. The more those receivers get into the game, the more they're going to respond. That's just human nature, and no amount of "they're professionals" is going to change the primal foundation of humanity.

The bottom line is, if Tebow improves, give him more passes.

[wwharton]

Oh, don't take me the wrong way. Just flip back a couple pages in this thread. Did everyone forget I was the one guy giving Tebow a scathing review based on his recent performances?

What I said before remains true: I feel this offensive scheme cannot last and I want to see Tebow make strides as a passer. You have to learn the hard way. If he throws picks, then he throws picks. I want to see him try to make reads. That way he can take those experiences into the film room and learn from them. As a hockey coach and player, there is NOTHING more valuable than experience in a game situation. My kids have learned the most from seeing themselves in game situations and understanding how they reacted and what they could've done differently. NOTHING compares to it when trying to improve on the mental aspects.

SkeeterJD, you're on notice. The more those receivers get into the game, the more they're going to respond. That's just human nature, and no amount of "they're professionals" is going to change the primal foundation of humanity.

The bottom line is, if Tebow improves, give him more passes.

I hear you, but they're in the playoff hunt. Otherwise I'd agree, but right now they should be planning to win games more than for the future.

[Broncos86]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

I can't help but shake my head at these "fans" who expect John Elway to say nothing but gorgeous praise for Tebow. I really wish these Tebow fans would quit masquerading as Broncos fans.

[SkeeterJD]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

SkeeterJD, you're on notice. The more those receivers get into the game, the more they're going to respond. That's just human nature, and no amount of "they're professionals" is going to change the primal foundation of humanity.

Dude...you need to relax. That was meant as a joke.

You have this overwhelming desire to be right on everything. And when someone disagrees with you; you put them on "notice". Notice for what? Notice for being right?

You want to go down this road again? Fine. You are 100% wrong with claiming that receivers need to be in a rhythm in order to succeed in the NFL. Same situation in last game. Tebow had not thrown to Dante Rosario all game. The first time he threw it to him he caught it. Same with Fells. If your receivers can't catch but the simplest of balls thrown to them they're not going to make it in the league very long.

Come down off your Bronco pedestal and join me and the rest of the fans down here and lets talk about this awesome football team.

[SkeeterJD]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

You have to learn the hard way. If he throws picks, then he throws picks. I want to see him try to make reads. That way he can take those experiences into the film room and learn from them.

I agree with this. I would much rather see them throw on 3rd and 6 and Tebow makes an ill advised throw for a pick rather than running it. He'll learn a lot more from that mistake than he will from reviewing that play later on.

However, you have to give Tebow some credit for not turning the ball over too. Jonsco mentioned something about how different the team complexion is now. For once, they trust their defense to make a stop. I also see that Denver is winning and you don't want to mess with what is working (even when it appears that it isn't).

[Broncos86]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Tebow is doing a fine job with the decisions he does make, no doubt. You cannot win games if you lose the turnover battle. One aspect I'd point out is that Tebow benefits from the ability to make positive yards with either arm or legs. Where a different QB would feel 3rd and 6 is a must pass scenario, Tebow can pull the ball down and run. That would, IMO, take pressure off when looking for windows.

And SkeeterJD, I was being playful with the "on notice" remark. First time I've ever used that term, that I can recall, in years. ( http://wikiality.wikia.com/On_Notice ) That said, don't be so black and white in your point of view. Moreover, careful about putting words in the mouths of individuals.

[SkeeterJD]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Gil Whitely of Mile High Sports radio posed an interesting scenario today on his radio show. He theorized that depsite John Elway's recent comments regarding the future of Tebow with Denver, that he (Elway) might try to shop Tebow in the Jacksonville market. In which he would try to gain a high draft pick in hopes of putting together a deal to draft one of the top 2 qb's.

I think Jacksonville would love to have their hometown hero back in Florida and I think that Tebow would breathe new life into that organization.

As Bronco fans...would you want to see that move made?

[letsgopens66]

Re: Official Denver Broncos Thread

Gil Whitely of Mile High Sports radio posed an interesting scenario today on his radio show. He theorized that depsite John Elway's recent comments regarding the future of Tebow with Denver, that he (Elway) might try to shop Tebow in the Jacksonville market. In which he would try to gain a high draft pick in hopes of putting together a deal to draft one of the top 2 qb's.

I think Jacksonville would love to have their hometown hero back in Florida and I think that Tebow would breathe new life into that organization.

As Bronco fans...would you want to see that move made?

I think a lot of fans would severely disapprove of this move. Tebow's had too much of an impact on Denver (both on and off the field) for the city to willingly let go of him.