NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

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  • muzion
    Pro
    • Oct 2002
    • 718

    #16
    Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

    "I have the goalie sliders at 0 and the Offensive sliders almost maxed out....Are there any other settings you guys can recommend that can help??"

    Increase the defensive slider, so that your team will be weaker defensively and the AI will be stronger defensively(if you are good enough on defense).

    Put the speed t o3 notches from the left, since the game was tested at that speed. You will get more goals. You're pass speed slider should be maxed out so that you can get in some one-timers.

    You could also put your second-string goalie in and the cpu will get more goals

    Comment

    • Erv
      MVP
      • Jul 2002
      • 2105

      #17
      Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

      I'm sorry for getting the thread in the wrong direction, but I had NHL 2003, traded in NHL 2003. I think it's complete garbage overall, but one plus thing I remember is the cpu. offensive AI being pretty damn smart with the puck, and they knew how to score, especially with the game on difficult and offensive sliders up, i guarantee you won't be laughing. rent it and see for yourself how bad they kill you. What I found with 2k3 all you have to do is mash the X button(or square on ps2) and you most likely can get the puck. On all-star with high offense sliders i dominate the TOP stat. This is only a couple of days of owning the game. Like it or not, this is the same thing that bit WSB for Xbox's ***. I may try HOF level to see if i notice change. Like I said, I remember needing to sit up playing nhl 2003 against the cpu...in nhl 2k3 i can lay down and drift off and still stop the AI.

      Comment

      • pk500
        All Star
        • Jul 2002
        • 8062

        #18
        Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

        Erv:

        I rented NHL 2003 and played the hell out of it even though it's a piece of shovelware.

        The reason the CPU offense plays so well in NHL 2003 has nothing to do with superior offensive AI. It has everything to do with pathetic defensive AI for the computer-controlled members of the human team.

        I can't tell you how often non-controlled defenders on the human team are WAY out of position, scrambling and wandering aimlessly in their zone, in NHL 2003. That doesn't happen in NHL 2K3 because Treyarch programmed the defense perfectly. I'll agree that the poke check is too effective in NHL 2K3, but that effectiveness is aided by the great AI positioning.

        You're giving the offensive AI of NHL 2003 way too much credit. It sucks -- but not as bad as the defensive AI, which is pathetic and causes the CPU offense to look way better than it should.

        Happy New Year,
        PK
        Xbox Live: pk4425

        Comment

        • Dick_Smalls
          Pro
          • Jul 2002
          • 902

          #19
          Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

          Actually Erv, you touched on a great point about NHL 2K3 that I couldnt put my finger on until I read your post.....You make alot of sense in your observations with 2k3.

          One of the things I find a bit frustrating, and perhaps a bit out of proportional to the actual NHL, is how easily you can mash the poke check button to steal the puck away from the CPU, and vice versa, it can easily do it to you.....This results in alot of back and forth action where players just attack the puck carrier and force the maul the puck away from players. The end result is a lack of puck movement around the offensive zones. If you watch an NHL game closely, you will see defenders most often shadow the puck carrier and try to screen them rather than go head on and maul them as they come into the zone.
          I may not be explaining it very clearly but I think there is just a little too much attacking of the player with the puck. I think if they toned down the the AI's poke checking just a bit and allowed for more working around of the puck within the offensive zones, you'd see even more realistic and exciting play, Also in front of the net, the goalies seem to also vaccum up the puck too easily or the defense can too quickly gain control and clear it....the puck should flutter around more in that area and allow for some more fierce 'scrumming' for the loose puck.

          All these points just might need subtle tweaks...nothing major, but I think it would make a big difference.

          Also your observation about actually not having to pay 100% attention on defense to still be effective is true to a certain extent.....I sometimes purposely put down the controller just to see how effective the cpu is at scoring on me....and for the most part, The opposing team still has a problem scoring......Maybe this is a good thing, illustrating how smart the AI is on both sides of the puck?...I dunno

          Comment

          • JustinB
            Rookie
            • Jul 2002
            • 47

            #20
            Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

            I agree pk,

            I never seem to be able to control the puck and move it around in my zone because defenders consantly steal it from me if i hold it for more than 2 seconds. Its kinda frustrating because i either have to shoot right away or pass it off.

            Comment

            • pk500
              All Star
              • Jul 2002
              • 8062

              #21
              Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

              Dick, Justin:

              One possible solution to the overeffective poke-checking is to turn the puck control and puck retention slider settings all the way up, or close to the max.

              That might help.

              Take care,
              PK
              Xbox Live: pk4425

              Comment

              • Erv
                MVP
                • Jul 2002
                • 2105

                #22
                Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

                very nice heads up...i'm on it

                Comment

                • NBKiller
                  Pro
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 643

                  #23
                  Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

                  If you're having problems w/ the CPU poke checking you just use the "Y" button (Xbox) to keep it from happening. I know I can't do it to the good players in the game. You nearly have to rape good players to get the puck poke checking them. It could just be the team I'm using. Maybe I don't have many of the issues most of you are having because how low my team is ranked in NHL2K3.


                  ============================================
                  <font color="yellow">NOW PLAYING:</font color>
                  <font color="green">XBOX:</font color> Splinter Cell, Shenmue2, NHL2K3 and NFL2K3
                  <font color="orange">DREAMCAST:</font color> Phantsay Star Online ver2 and Tennis2K2
                  ============================================
                  XBOX SKINS - IGN XBOX - GAMESPOT XBOX

                  Comment

                  • Dick_Smalls
                    Pro
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 902

                    #24
                    Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

                    What PK said might make perfect sense ( turning up the retention and puck control sliders ) i have mine set real low because i wanted to see more loose puck action instead of having the puck glued to the player's sticks...I figured that there would be more realistic 'scrumming' for the puck but it also seems to make it very easy to just poke check the puck away from players as well....perhaps you cant have it both ways. I'm going to try turning those sliders up and see if there is less stealing and player puck mauling. I'd like to see more time to set up in the offensive zone ....perhaps this will help.

                    Comment

                    • sdrotar
                      OS Managing Ed., 2002-07
                      • Jul 2002
                      • 1055

                      #25
                      Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating...

                      Dick, Vinsanity -
                      I am sorry you didn't like the review, and disagree with the score.

                      If it helps, we only put scores on reviews here because a lot of folks don't take the time to actually read the whole thing and just want some sort of summary. In my perfect world, I wouldn't have a score at all - just the words, and let my readers make their own decisions based on a much more detailed observation.

                      I haven't experienced the issues that you have, and in my review, I mentioned that there were some problems that need to be fixed. I'm not a "fanboy" of any type, and as a matter of fact, I've played EA's NHL series religiously every year until this year, when I played NHL2K3, and traded in NHL2003.

                      Everyone's mileage will vary with any given title, and as such, I believe that dickering over something as uniquely contrived as "score" is pointless.
                      In my opinion, Sega Sports made the best, more accurate translation from the NHL to the console in history in NHL2K3, and I think they deserve a lot of credit for doing it - as difficult and challenging as it is, and despite it's few flaws. That's why I gave it a 95 - a score that I stand by.

                      Everyone, of course, is entitled to their own opinion, and I'm glad that we have this forum in which to share them.
                      Shawn Drotar
                      Former Managing Editor, OperationSports.com (2002-07)

                      Comment

                      • cookusu
                        MVP
                        • Jul 2002
                        • 1685

                        #26
                        Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating..

                        I think when you look at the game as being the best ever for it's sport than scoring it less than 90 doesn't make sense. Granted it could be better and it will be better, but in 2002 it is the best hockey game.

                        I think some of you guys want to score games on a scale where 100 is your idea of perfection and not on scoring the game against it's competition. This would be like comparing the first Model - T Ford against a car from 2002.

                        Comment

                        • sdrotar
                          OS Managing Ed., 2002-07
                          • Jul 2002
                          • 1055

                          #27
                          Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating..

                          That's an excellent point, Cookusu.

                          I do try to grade games against their contemporaries, and not against an absolute scale - as that would be patently (and increasingly) unfair to any and almost all games made in the past.

                          Again, though - before anybody gets too worked up about scores - just read the piece in its entirety, and I believe you'll find that the scores themselves will hold much less value for you, as you'll receive much more detailed and cogent analysis than any simple number can provide.
                          Shawn Drotar
                          Former Managing Editor, OperationSports.com (2002-07)

                          Comment

                          • Dick_Smalls
                            Pro
                            • Jul 2002
                            • 902

                            #28
                            Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating..

                            You guys make excellent points and respect your ability to stand behind your reviews, as I know I would

                            .....I have much more respect for someone and a site that takes this approach rather than making excuses or bending in the direction of the wind to appease everyone. We are only reviewers ( well you guys are ) and can and should only be expected to offer OUR OWN observations. This is a subjective business that cannot please everyone, nor should it. We can only offer our opinions and support them with clear descriptive examples to provide the consumer with as much info as possible to make THIER own decisions.

                            While I may not totally agree with the final score give or take a few points, I did indeed find the content very informative and thorough and that's what I think is most important. Besides, if the reviewer didnt encounter any of the scoring issues that I find troublesome in the game, then I think the scoring is dead on.....Which brings me to my next point, Something is very wierd in this game that some people are able to have plenty of CPU ( and human scoring ) while others are having almost no CPU offensive output and encounter the super responsive vacuum goalies.

                            For a game to yield such drastic results between players, leads me to beleive there must be some confusion in the settings and the answers may very well lie there in some illogical way. I've been to Sega's forum and its pretty much the same arguments for both sides, some people are having totally realistic scoring and others are experiencing the same consistent scoring draughts and super goalies I see. I've tried all the logical settings to try and enhance cpu scoring but they seem to produce stagnant results........So now I am going to try some of the oddball ideas that some have mentioned.......

                            Some players have stated the following to see higher scoring:

                            Set game to Hall of Famer mode and both YOU and the CPU will score more

                            Actually turn speed up OVER 5 to see more enhanced scoring

                            Actually leave Goalie and defensive sliders at 5 or higher to produce more scoring.

                            Maybe these additional settings dont seem so oddball afterall....I just may have been going about it the wrong way. Whatever the case, after another 1-1 OT tie against a lowly Atlanta Thrasher team, I am willing to try anything to see more variety and output from both the CPU and myself.


                            If anyone else has experienced consistently low scoring games as well and have some suggestions to improve it, let me know because this game is a fantastic game despite some of this.


                            Comment

                            • sdrotar
                              OS Managing Ed., 2002-07
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 1055

                              #29
                              Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating..

                              Dick,
                              I've tweaked the sliders myself, and I think it's less about the sliders and more about the player.

                              I mean that, as a convert from EA hockey, I had an awfully hard time at first, and I had to stop thinking "EA hockey" - which I've been doing for a decade - and start thinking "NHL hockey". It's a subtle difference, and it's hard to tell if you're doing it or not from time to time. I often found myself going back to passes and moved that I made to succeed in EA's games, and was stymied by the Sega AI. It was frustrating!

                              I made a conscious effort to think like a real hockey player, and not as a video-game hockey player. Now, I'm protecting the puck in the open ice, cycling the puck more, being more selective with my shots, and trying for deflections (as well as setting up screens in front of the goalie). In the defensive zone, I'm holding my lanes and resisting the temptation to level the winger along the boards, and I clear the puck when I need to, as opposed to always trying to start an odd-man rush.

                              All of a sudden, my game got better, and I realized why NHL2K3 was special. It's hockey, not video-game hockey!

                              I think that's why you see people amazed by it, and frustrated by it. It's tougher on folks like me (and you, I'd bet) who've played EA's "NHL" for years. Stick with it, though - you will get it - and then you'll wonder why you ever played anything else...
                              Shawn Drotar
                              Former Managing Editor, OperationSports.com (2002-07)

                              Comment

                              • Dick_Smalls
                                Pro
                                • Jul 2002
                                • 902

                                #30
                                Re: NHL 2K3...All is simply not HEAVEN...this game is getting frustrating..

                                thanks for the tips...just out of curiousity, what settings do you play on to get realistic scoring from the CPU?

                                My team defense is ranked 23rd because I sim almost all my games and just play every 10th game or so, but when i do, my goalie, Blackburn, is stopping almost everything the cpu throws at him and my defense is pretty rock solid...when I play the games. That's what has worried me because, when I sim, I see alot of the 5-4, 6-3, 4-3 games which reflects my team's weak defensive roster well.

                                I play on All Star, speed set at 3 clicks from furthest left to right ( for realism )
                                And I've also experimented with all kinds of Offensive , Defensive and Goalie sliders to try and weaken the goalies, defenses and increase the scoring but am still having a hard time getting anything more than 1-0, 2-1 games

                                Keep me posted with anything you might think will help

                                thx

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