Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

[Flawless]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I disagree with a lot in this thread, especially after having got to play Shift, but it's okay for somebody to like it over Forza 3. If they want to compare the two, so be it. I see no harm in doing so. At the end of the day, I think if you like racing games, between Shift, Dirt 2, and the soon to be released Forza 3, you got a great selection of racers, and surely you will be happy with at least one of them.

[DarkFudge]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I think I understand exactly what the original poster was trying to say but just didnt convey the message in the way I think it should have been discussed.

I have been playing racing games since the days of the Atari 2600 and have also experienced just about every driving simulator/arcade game since then and will say this:


I dont think anyone is trying to dispute the fact that Forza indeed is the most accurate car physics driving simulator on the market, but what I agree 100% with the poster on is after playing Forza 3 then playing Need for Speed Shift, there are things that Shift does to immerse the player into a more realistic and viceral driving experience than Forza does.

I think the sensation of driving behind the wheel and being inside a car feels more alive and more alive in Shift than it does in Forza. That is not to say that in any way shape or form that Shift's physics and driving 'simulator' is even close to being as accurate as Forza's...cause its not.

In a nutshell, Forza does an incredible job of accurately and statisically capturing all of the number crunching and physics to accurately reflect the cars they are simmulating BUT what Forza never did well was translate those REAL SIM STATISTICS into a equally realistic and immersive driving experience behind the wheel.

This has been an argument of mine back when I used to compare Live for Speed which is an online racing simulator as realistic as Forza but has a richer more lively feel of actually being in the car driving as well.

Forza 3's cockpit's feel very one dimmensional and flat...as if your not really in the car but rather, your looking throw this cockpit picture frame of a movie thats playing a 3D driving SIM and your telling it which way to go. Im exaggerating to prove my point. But you dont feel as connected to the car. You dont feel the bumps of the road, Your head doesnt track, the screen doesnt jitter and shake to simulate bumps and dings or an extreme shift in weight on a turn.
These are all sensations that the designers neglect to try and capture along with their Physics statistics.

Its as if the Forza team spent so much time grueling to get every number to statistically matchup with real car physics that they forgot about simulating the actual human sensations of what it feels like to be inside one of these accurately modeled machines


Need for Speed Shift and games like Dirt and Live for Speed do a better job of compensating their lack of accurately modeled physics data by creating a richer and more viceral in car experience for the driver. And Im not referring to cheap speed blur tactics or explosive sound effects. Im simply talking about more creative ways to simply make the cockpit rattle and roll and shake to make the player feel as though they are inside that car...its things like that


FOrza is a great driving simulator but at times it feels a little to squeaky clean


Or let me put it this way....Forza does a fantastic job of accurately modeling car physics but does just a mediocre job of accurately recreating the driving experience for the driver. And I will say this, Need for Speed Shift, does a mediocre to below average job of modeling car physics but does an incredible job of accurately simulating the experience of a driver being behind the wheel of a car.

So I would argue, Which is the more realistic Driving Simulator is really in the eye of the beholder!

[Pappy Knuckles]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

Nice post, Fudge.

[krispykeith]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I actually think I agree, strangely enough. I would describe Shift as a driver simulator, and Forza as a car simulator. I have no doubt that Forza nails the physics of each auto, but it does not "feel" like you are behind the wheel as much as it feels like you are controlling a remote control car with accurate physics.

Shift makes you feel like you are driving the car, instead of just controlling the car. At the end of the day I am not sure either one is more of a "simulation" than the other...it is just a different simulation focus (the experience versus the vehicles). The better sound, the driver physics in the cockpit, the crash effects...it ramps up the immersion factor and at the end of the day I found myself preferring that to the more technically accurate, deeper game that Forza represents.

[bkfount]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I still can't get past the flag lady standing through my car in every race, like EA never saw that once while making this.

[Pappy Knuckles]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I still can't get past the flag lady standing through my car in every race, like EA never saw that once while making this.

Maybe I'm just not observant but I can't recall ever seeing that. Do you use cockpit view or something else?

[sb24]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

Maybe I'm just not observant but I can't recall ever seeing that. Do you use cockpit view or something else?

If i dont see her its a surprise. It only happens at the beginning when they show your car before they put you in the cockpit and start the countdown. Just looks bad and doesnt affect anything so i dont worry about it. What does bother me is the series races. Those are bugged.

It doesnt matter who wins, only who they want on the standings. I come in first, bill comes in 2nd, and steve comes in 3rd. I think to my self ok just make sure you beat bill next round. Well then the standings come up and bill has no points and steve has like 2, while mark and jack have 2nd and 3rd points. The next race same thing happens. Bill and steve win and mark and jack get the points. Since then i have payed attention and non of the series races work right.

[Lieutenant Dan]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I think I understand exactly what the original poster was trying to say but just didnt convey the message in the way I think it should have been discussed.

I have been playing racing games since the days of the Atari 2600 and have also experienced just about every driving simulator/arcade game since then and will say this:


I dont think anyone is trying to dispute the fact that Forza indeed is the most accurate car physics driving simulator on the market, but what I agree 100% with the poster on is after playing Forza 3 then playing Need for Speed Shift, there are things that Shift does to immerse the player into a more realistic and viceral driving experience than Forza does.

I think the sensation of driving behind the wheel and being inside a car feels more alive and more alive in Shift than it does in Forza. That is not to say that in any way shape or form that Shift's physics and driving 'simulator' is even close to being as accurate as Forza's...cause its not.

In a nutshell, Forza does an incredible job of accurately and statisically capturing all of the number crunching and physics to accurately reflect the cars they are simmulating BUT what Forza never did well was translate those REAL SIM STATISTICS into a equally realistic and immersive driving experience behind the wheel.

This has been an argument of mine back when I used to compare Live for Speed which is an online racing simulator as realistic as Forza but has a richer more lively feel of actually being in the car driving as well.

Forza 3's cockpit's feel very one dimmensional and flat...as if your not really in the car but rather, your looking throw this cockpit picture frame of a movie thats playing a 3D driving SIM and your telling it which way to go. Im exaggerating to prove my point. But you dont feel as connected to the car. You dont feel the bumps of the road, Your head doesnt track, the screen doesnt jitter and shake to simulate bumps and dings or an extreme shift in weight on a turn.
These are all sensations that the designers neglect to try and capture along with their Physics statistics.

Its as if the Forza team spent so much time grueling to get every number to statistically matchup with real car physics that they forgot about simulating the actual human sensations of what it feels like to be inside one of these accurately modeled machines


Need for Speed Shift and games like Dirt and Live for Speed do a better job of compensating their lack of accurately modeled physics data by creating a richer and more viceral in car experience for the driver. And Im not referring to cheap speed blur tactics or explosive sound effects. Im simply talking about more creative ways to simply make the cockpit rattle and roll and shake to make the player feel as though they are inside that car...its things like that


FOrza is a great driving simulator but at times it feels a little to squeaky clean


Or let me put it this way....Forza does a fantastic job of accurately modeling car physics but does just a mediocre job of accurately recreating the driving experience for the driver. And I will say this, Need for Speed Shift, does a mediocre to below average job of modeling car physics but does an incredible job of accurately simulating the experience of a driver being behind the wheel of a car.

So I would argue, Which is the more realistic Driving Simulator is really in the eye of the beholder!

EXCELLENT post, very very well said.

This has been a great thread, actually..extolling the differences between the different games.

[ThaGenecyst]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

Forza 3 is the best racing game so far this generation (that may change when GT5 comes out)

but it takes a complete crap on NFS: Shift.

[Hellisan]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

I would like to thank TCrouch for the review. I'm bummed to see the sparking effects made it through and I guess I was hoping against all home for better engine sounds too but I'm really happy to hear that the AI is pretty good.

Great news!

maybe they can patch the sparking. lol

[bkfount]

Re: Forza 3 way worse than NFS shift???

If i dont see her its a surprise. It only happens at the beginning when they show your car before they put you in the cockpit and start the countdown. Just looks bad and doesnt affect anything so i dont worry about it. What does bother me is the series races. Those are bugged.

It doesnt matter who wins, only who they want on the standings. I come in first, bill comes in 2nd, and steve comes in 3rd. I think to my self ok just make sure you beat bill next round. Well then the standings come up and bill has no points and steve has like 2, while mark and jack have 2nd and 3rd points. The next race same thing happens. Bill and steve win and mark and jack get the points. Since then i have payed attention and non of the series races work right.

it was a pain in the *** getting the epic badge for winning every series. The AI gets insane on the higher tiers when the tracks are narrow and they have top cars.