PRP coach indicted in football player's death

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If that kids get a drink, then someone else will, then someone else, then someone else.

[Cebby]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If that kids get a drink, then someone else will, then someone else, then someone else.

And what's the problem with that? Is kids running to get water really that bad? Is it not preferable to one dying?

On our hot days, we had a "you need water you get water" policy and one of our stations during conditioning was a water break. Strangely, we all managed to practice successfully.

[fistofrage]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

Given the fact that the kid was 15, clearly a minor and entrusted into the care of the coach, the coach is screwed. He appears to be negligent and will be lucky to get only 5 years. A lifetime of restitution will await him after that and the school district will be shelling out some heavy sums too.

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

And what's the problem with that? Is kids running to get water really that bad? Is it not preferable to one dying?

On our hot days, we had a "you need water you get water" policy and one of our stations during conditioning was a water break. Strangely, we all managed to practice successfully.

Scheduled water breaks are fine, but you can't have players see they are about to start running then go and decide they want a break by the water cooler.

The kid was also taking Creatine leading up to the days of practice. "Creatine is an over-the-counter supplement and among the side effects listed by the National Institute of Health are cramps or muscle breakdown, heat intolerance and electrolyte imbalances."

I also practiced in 100+ pure heat(not index) of Texas heat. It's sad this happened, but if you play football and know you will be practicing in this weather the player also has a responsibility to prepare himself.

No reason to ruin more people's lives because of a mistake.

[Cebby]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

Scheduled water breaks are fine, but you can't have players see they are about to start running then go and decide they want a break by the water cooler.

You can let a player go get a drink of water and then come back. I don't know what kind of weirdos you played with, but on my team it was a simple process; you finish whatever drill you were doing, then you run over to the hose, then you drink from hose, then you finish by running back to the drill and likely get there before you were even up again. If for some reason you have a team of ADD players, you get squirt bottles.

It's sad this happened, but if you play football and know you will be practicing in this weather the player also has a responsibility to prepare himself.

And the coaches have more of a responsibility to make sure kids are hydrated. It takes two minutes at most. During the summer, it's much better to err on the side that doesn't end up with a dead player, even if it means that a player will miss a drill repetition.

As for the creatine, I'd imagine every football player in the 2000s has taken it. Unless a coach is regularly testing players (or his team sucks), he should assume that they are taking steroids and a variety of supplements.

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

"As for the creatine, I'd imagine every football player in the 2000s has taken it. Unless a coach is regularly testing players (or his team sucks), he should assume that they are taking steroids and a variety of supplements."

If you really think that please never talk about football again.

"No other State screens for steroids as much as Texas, and out of the first ten thousand tested, only four were steroid postive. "

http://www.newswest9.com/Global/story.asp?S=9654989&nav=menu505_2

Other states have had similar results. I don't know a lot about Maryland HS football so maybe it's rampant there(doesn't seem to be working though), but it's not a problem at all in most states. Creatine is 100% legal so our coaches didn't care, but it didn't matter only a hand full of players on my team ever used it and they really only cared about the look of a ripped body.

[Cebby]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If you really think that please never talk about football again.

"No other State screens for steroids as much as Texas, and out of the first ten thousand tested, only four were steroid postive. "

http://www.newswest9.com/Global/story.asp?S=9654989&nav=menu505_2

Other states have had similar results.

That suffers a variety of issues:

1. I can't imagine it was full bloodwork, and as I understand it, modern performance enhancers aren't supposed to show up on piss tests.

2. Cheating on piss tests is rampant.

3. Most importantly, the picture shows a basketball team comprised of females. I am not accusing non-football programs of steroids.

Using my completely butt-pulled numbers, that would estimate the entire number of high school football steroid users at 350 (17 million teenagers with 5% playing football which is likely very high). If you use 3%, you get 204 steroid users in all of high school football.

(doesn't seem to be working though)

Per capita, Maryland and Texas produce nearly identical numbers of 4 and 5 star football players.

The fact is, you have to account for anything that can go wrong. Letting a player miss a single drill is better in the long run than having a dead kid.

[RAZRr1275]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

That suffers a variety of issues:

1. I can't imagine it was full bloodwork, and as I understand it, modern performance enhancers aren't supposed to show up on piss tests.

2. Cheating on piss tests is rampant.

3. Most importantly, the picture shows a basketball team comprised of females. I am not accusing non-football programs of steroids.

Using my completely butt-pulled numbers, that would estimate the entire number of high school football steroid users at 350 (17 million teenagers with 5% playing football which is likely very high). If you use 3%, you get 204 steroid users in all of high school football.



Per capita, Maryland and Texas produce nearly identical numbers of 4 and 5 star football players.

The fact is, you have to account for anything that can go wrong. Letting a player miss a single drill is better in the long run than having a dead kid.

This is true.

[TheGamingChef]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

When I played football we also had a "get water whenever you need to" policy. No one ever did. The coaches did make it mandatory to drink during water breaks, and on the really hot days, they'd have us drink, then we'd bunch up on the sideline waiting for practice to restart, and then they'd make us get another drink.

We practiced every day in 100% full pads. Two-a-days were at 6:00 and at 3:00 (only for one week though). And our coaches pushed us - hard. Naturally there were a lot of issues but anyone that couldn't take it could always sit out. Generally, there were the ones in lesser shape and them sitting out didn't really ruin anything since they weren't playing anyway.

[auburntigersfan]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If that kids get a drink, then someone else will, then someone else, then someone else.

No, actually, that's not really how it works.

If a player is to the point to where he might pass out at any moment than it is more than likely inherently obvious and every other player will understand. A couple players might joke with him about getting out of the drill early or something, but these guys are dumb and they care for each other. It's a team, if one kid is about to pass out and gets water all of the others won't complain to the coach about it or anything unless it is an extremely undisciplined team.

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If it comes out that this player had been complaining about being dizzy or whatever to the coaches and they absolutely refused to give him water, then I will stop defending the coach, but it's not the coaches fault if he had no idea something was about to happen.

Another case of guilty until proven innocent I guess though.

[auburntigersfan]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

If it comes out that this player had been complaining about being dizzy or whatever to the coaches and they absolutely refused to give him water, then I will stop defending the coach, but it's not the coaches fault if he had no idea something was about to happen.

He isn't qualified to coach young men if he can't tell when a player is on the verge of death, IMO.

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

100+ players wearing helmets. Ya it's real easy to inspect every single player and be able to point out when most of them were probably tired and bent over anyways. Where are the trainers in all of this?

If the coach didn't directly refuse the kid water when he knew there was something wrong I can't crucify him.

But if the head coach is going to be liable every other adult authority figure there should be held liable as well. They are responsible for the safety of their players too

[auburntigersfan]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

100+ players wearing helmets. Ya it's real easy to inspect every single player and be able to point out when most of them were probably tired and bent over anyways. Where are the trainers in all of this?

If the coach didn't directly refuse the kid water when he knew there was something wrong I can't crucify him.

But if the head coach is going to be liable every other adult authority figure there should be held liable as well. They are responsible for the safety of their players too

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about right now.

First of all, there is no way they have 100 players. Second, when players are with their position coaches it is very personal, there were probably only 7 or 8 other guys there and taking turns to drills or something. A qualified coach would have noticed something wrong. They practice every day, coaches can realize when there is something up, trust me.

Managers in HS don't do ****, and normally there may be one guy that works for the school as a trainer, but he can't always be there, and the students that are team managers just give water during when the coaches allow.

It really wouldn't be fair to blame all of the other coaches who were most likely doing there thing on another side of the field with their group of players.

[SuperBowlNachos]

Re: PRP coach indicted in football player's death

What are you talking about? How is there no way they have 100 players? They are a 6A school meaning in Kentucky they are one of the biggest 36 schools in the state.

"Both Jefferson County Public Schools and Louisville Metro Police investigated Max's death after The Courier-Journal reported that bystanders near the practice field heard coaches deny the players water. Other witnesses heard the coaches say they would run the players until someone quit the team."

"All the coaches, however, have been named in a lawsuit filed in September by Max's parents, Michele Crockett and Jeff Gilpin, accusing them of negligence and "reckless disregard.""

So even the parents are going after the other coaches.

and they were running, not doing pass blocking or catching drills