Who is the most hated team in US sports?

[JBH3]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

I wouldn't...Unless the cap was set at $200M or some god awful high amount that other teams couldn't afford.

What's the cap in football? $124mil in 2009?

Even if the MLB capped spending at $100mil the smallest of markets still wouldn't be affected by the switch to a cap since they're only spending on avg $43mil/yr (avg of the bottom5).

Capping at $100 mil would be the most fair option since you have 10 teams willing to spend $100mil or more/yr compared to: 1 @ $90m, 4 @ $80m, 5 @ $70m, 5 @ $60m, and 4 @ $50m and below.

Going lower than $100mil is unfair to the top teams who generate most of the leagues revenue and is borderline socialism; spreading the wealth to the less fortunate for what?...the sake of mediocrity and parity?

So you cap MLB and you've still got over half the teams (18) unwilling to commit $100 mil to winning, and capped you're still going to hate the Yankees, albeit MISGUIDEDLY!

...and what stake do I have in this need to back the Yankees?

I'm not a Yankee fan, I'm a Phillies fan, but I can't stand this notion that they hold an unfair advantage as if capping the league would all of sudden make Florida spend even $60mil on player salaries. And in return capping the league would serve unjustly unfair to the top10 revenue generating teams.

2009 Payroll MLB Teams 11-30:

11. LAD: $100,008,592
12. ATL: $ 94,313,666
13. STL: $ 87,703,409
14. SF: $82,616,450
15. KC: $81,384,553
16. MIL: $80,182,502
17. CIN: $73,558,500
18. ARI: $73,516,666
19. TEX: $73,439,238
20. TOR: $72,563,200
21. COL: $72,428,000
22. TB: $68,238,934
23. MINN: $67,634,766
24. CLE: $66,757,366
25. WAS: $62,001,000
26. BAL: $61,885,866
27. OAK: $56,089,250
28. SD: $37,800,800
29. FLA: $35,774,000
30. PITT: $25,197,000

[no juice]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

yankees. by there not being a cap in baseball the whole "buying championships" thing is nuts. it's not their fault they got deep pockets. i still don't like them though

[The GIGGAS]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

What's the cap in football? $124mil in 2009?

Even if the MLB capped spending at $100mil the smallest of markets still wouldn't be affected by the switch to a cap since they're only spending on avg $43mil/yr (avg of the bottom5).

Capping at $100 mil would be the most fair option since you have 10 teams willing to spend $100mil or more/yr compared to: 1 @ $90m, 4 @ $80m, 5 @ $70m, 5 @ $60m, and 4 @ $50m and below.

Going lower than $100mil is unfair to the top teams who generate most of the leagues revenue and is borderline socialism; spreading the wealth to the less fortunate for what?...the sake of mediocrity and parity?

So you cap MLB and you've still got over half the teams (18) unwilling to commit $100 mil to winning, and capped you're still going to hate the Yankees, albeit MISGUIDEDLY!

...and what stake do I have in this need to back the Yankees?

I'm not a Yankee fan, I'm a Phillies fan, but I can't stand this notion that they hold an unfair advantage as if capping the league would all of sudden make Florida spend even $60mil on player salaries. And in return capping the league would serve unjustly unfair to the top10 revenue generating teams.

2009 Payroll MLB Teams 11-30:

Why not have a salary cap and a salary floor, if you want to legislate some kind of fairness. MLB probably doesn't care. The Yankees have a huge fan base, and even haters will tune in to watch them.

[JBH3]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Why not have a salary cap and a salary floor, if you want to legislate some kind of fairness. MLB probably doesn't care. The Yankees have a huge fan base, and even haters will tune in to watch them.

A salary cap AND floor is a good idea, but do the NBA and NFL have floors? I'd be surprised if the money-grubbing owners, in markets where baseball interest is down (Pitt), would accomodate a floor that mandated them to spend $40-$50mil.

They'd probably lose money, and a lot of it.

[nyisles16]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Sad fact -- there are owners out there with deeper pockets than the Steinbrenners in baseball, yet all they care about is putting the money back in their own pockets..

I "dislike" the Yanks just because they are a rival in the city I live in.. You cannot take it away from them that they spend money - and wisely - to keep their product on top..

Because of a strong union, the economics of baseball are ruined, and don't think that it will ever change

[BlueNGold]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

My most hated teams:

1) New England Patriots - This is the team I voted for in the poll. Spygate, Belichick, Brady, Harrison before he retired, all their championships over the last 10 years, the wins over the Chargers in the playoffs. I could go on....

2) Montreal Canadiens - Hate this team with a passion especially being a Leafs fan. Their fans, their players, all the media coverage they get even when they have ****ty seasons. Everything about them I hate.

3) Toronto Argonauts - I'm sure not too many people here will know this team but they play in the CFL and I absolutely hate this team. They ruined our shot at a Grey Cup by breaking our QB's arm in the end of the East Division Final. We won the game and went on to play in the Grey Cup but lost 23-17 in a game that came down to the last drive of the game. If there is any Boise State fans in here, our backup QB was Ryan Dinwiddie and he was playing in his first ever CFL game in the ****ing championship game.

Another thing I hate about the Argos is their love of constantly trying to build a team of NFL rejects.

4) Dallas Cowboys - The whole "America's Team" label, Jerry Jones, Cowboys fans, the media coverage they get even when they **** the bed. All these things make me hate the Cowboys a lot.

5) LA Lakers - I'm more so a Kobe ***** than a Laker ***** but since he plays for them I hate them. I also hate Vujacic and Morrison so that helps. I had to change the channel when they were about to get their championship rings for last year because I couldn't stand to watch it.

6) San Antonio Spurs - Hate Parker, hate Ginobili, hate that they beat the Cavs in the Finals. Duncan is hard to hate though because he doesn't do anything to make you hate him.

7) NY Yankees - Don't care about baseball but if I had to choose one team I hate in baseball, its them and the way they buy their way to championships. A-Rod seems like an arrogant little prick too.

8) Boston Celtics/Orlando Magic - When they play the Cavs I get really heated towards these two teams but when they are playing other teams I could care less about them.

9) Ohio State Football - I don't watch much College Football but something about Ohio State just pisses me off. It also helps that I like Michigan lol.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

So you cap MLB and you've still got over half the teams (18) unwilling to commit $100 mil to winning, and capped you're still going to hate the Yankees, albeit MISGUIDEDLY!

...and what stake do I have in this need to back the Yankees?

I'm not a Yankee fan, I'm a Phillies fan, but I can't stand this notion that they hold an unfair advantage as if capping the league would all of sudden make Florida spend even $60mil on player salaries. And in return capping the league would serve unjustly unfair to the top10 revenue generating teams.

2009 Payroll MLB Teams 11-30:

Really all you need to show is this:

<TABLE style="BORDER-RIGHT: #999 1px solid; BORDER-TOP: #999 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #999 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #999 1px solid" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #eee" vAlign=top><TD>Yankees</TD><TD>$201,449,289</TD><TD>$7,748,050</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff" vAlign=top><TD>Mets</TD><TD>$135,773,988</TD><TD>$4,849,071</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

That's number 1 and 2. The #2 team is at 2/3 of the #1 team's payroll or $65M less. If you take 2/3 of the #2 payroll ($90M), there are 11 teams you have to pass to get there. If you take the $65M there are 20 teams. That shows you how much of an advantage the Yankee's have. It's why they've made it to the postseason every year but one over the last 15 or more years.

You realize you cut the Yankee's salary to $100M and you cut in half. Their goes their Texiera signing and/or the Sabathia and/or the A-Rod signing and whoever else they are going to pick up this year to replace Matsui if he decides to hang them up

IMO, if you cap it at $100M and you probably see those smaller teams start to spend because now they have a chance. Sabathia's not going to get $20M a year, now he's getting $11 or $12 and now a mid market team can make a play for him and all of sudden Free agency becomes less of a "who has the fattest wallet" competion and much more fair to all teams.

And the bottom line is you have a much more competitive league across the board where the smartest and most diciplined teams will win and not the richest.

I mean why would the Orioles or the Blue Jays ever spend more than they need are? They may get lucky and get hot one year like the Rays did last year if everything comes together perfectly and compete with the Yankee's and Red Sox, but they have to be perfect to do so. They definitely won't be able to do it year in and year out because their playing on a whole different level of playing field.

[Speedy]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

A salary cap AND floor is a good idea, but do the NBA and NFL have floors? I'd be surprised if the money-grubbing owners, in markets where baseball interest is down (Pitt), would accomodate a floor that mandated them to spend $40-$50mil.

They'd probably lose money, and a lot of it.

Baseball interest is down b/c of horrible teams the Pirates fielded.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Sad fact -- there are owners out there with deeper pockets than the Steinbrenners in baseball, yet all they care about is putting the money back in their own pockets..

Yes there are owners that are richer than the Steinbrenners, but it can't be expected they put their money from other ventures or investments into the baseball team. These guys are running a business and their goal it so make money. To expect them to fork over cash made from something else for their baseball team which would in turn lose money isn't reasonable.

The bottom line is the Yankee's generate more revenue every year than every other team and because of that have more money to put into their team and still keep a high level of profit.

If other teams made the same signings as the Yankee's they wouldn't stay afloat.

Baseball is the business, it is what generates the money that these teams use to sign players. It's not their owner opening up his savings account to pay these players.

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Baseball interest is down b/c of horrible teams the Pirates fielded.

They're stuck in a crappy cycle.

The team sucks so the fan's don't come to the games, which lowers revenue, which keeps them from signing or keeping talent, which makes the team suck.

But having a solid team doesn't always matter. If you are in a small market, you're going to struggle because of the laws of supply and demand.

NY has 8.4M people
Pitt has 310,000

You need one out of ever 168 people in NY to show up to a game. You need 1 of 6 or 7 in Pitt.

So again, you have the laws of Supply and Demand working. Pitt has to lower prices to get people to show up and NY can't charge enough, so even if they both sold the same number of tickets, NY is going to get much more per ticket.

Even if you're a great team, it's going to be hard to fill the stadiums in some of these smaller markets. We saw it last year with TB leading the AL east and not selling out games.

[JBH3]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Really all you need to show is this:

<TABLE style="BORDER-RIGHT: #999 1px solid; BORDER-TOP: #999 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: #999 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #999 1px solid" cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #eee" vAlign=top><TD>Yankees</TD><TD>$201,449,289</TD><TD>$7,748,050</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD></TD></TR><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff" vAlign=top><TD>Mets</TD><TD>$135,773,988</TD><TD>$4,849,071</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

That's number 1 and 2. The #2 team is at 2/3 of the #1 team's payroll or $65M less. If you take 2/3 of the #2 payroll ($90M), there are 11 teams you have to pass to get there. If you take the $65M there are 20 teams. That shows you how much of an advantage the Yankee's have. It's why they've made it to the postseason every year but one over the last 15 or more years.

You realize you cut the Yankee's salary to $100M and you cut in half. Their goes their Texiera signing and/or the Sabathia and/or the A-Rod signing and whoever else they are going to pick up this year to replace Matsui if he decides to hang them up

IMO, if you cap it at $100M and you probably see those smaller teams start to spend because now they have a chance. Sabathia's not going to get $20M a year, now he's getting $11 or $12 and now a mid market team can make a play for him and all of sudden Free agency becomes less of a "who has the fattest wallet" competion and much more fair to all teams.

And the bottom line is you have a much more competitive league across the board where the smartest and most diciplined teams will win and not the richest.

The cap still doesn't account for the team w/ all the money in the world to throw at a player, but yet that player being the missing piece for a championship team and taking a paycut to play w/ a contender.

Hell...A max-deal player is going to want to go to a large market team because the visibility of Kevin Durant on the Lakers is much better endorsement-wise than playing in Oak City.

Only in theory do you have a much more competitive league. The cap doesn't help the owner compete. It only tells him should you want to fully invest in competing the playing field is leveled...some. Should you make all the right front office decisions on who's to run your organization the playing field is leveled...some.

The cap only mandates who can spend what on player contracts right? It doesn't reflect how much Bob Kraft wants to spend on his coaching staff, front office and scouting staff versus Al Davis does it?

Baseball interest is down b/c of horrible teams the Pirates fielded.

Because of horrible business decisions made which have no effect on how much money they spent. So the Yankees have to make up for those who are incompetent w/ their money and player evaluations?

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

[quote=JBH3;2040419895]Only in theory do you have a much more competitive league. The cap doesn't help the owner compete. It only tells him should you want to fully invest in competing the playing field is leveled...some. Should you make all the right front office decisions on who's to run your organization the playing field is leveled...some.[quote=JBH3;2040419895]

All you can do is give them a fair playing field. What they do with it is up to them. If some teams don't want to spend, then that is on them. Not wanting to is different than being unable to.

Think about college sports and their limits on how often they can practice. They do this to give everyone a fair shot and to keep things some what under control. Some teams, who are not serious aren't going to maximize their time or be as efficient as others, but at least they were given the opportunity.

The cap only mandates who can spend what on player contracts right? It doesn't reflect how much Bob Kraft wants to spend on his coaching staff, front office and scouting staff versus Al Davis does it?

I believe this is right, but I'm not sure what coaches make around the league, etc, but cap that too if you want. Or make everything fall under one umbrella cap.

Though. I would argue in baseball it makes much less of a difference than in most other sports, though. Game plans are everything in football, but not much changes day to day in baseball. All teams pretty much have the same stuff in terms of video & facilities when it comes to the day to day preparing of baseball.

[JBH3]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

All you can do is give them a fair playing field. What they do with it is up to them. If some teams don't want to spend, then that is on them. Not wanting to is different than being unable to.

Think about college sports and their limits on how often they can practice. They do this to give everyone a fair shot and to keep things some what under control. Some teams, who are not serious aren't going to maximize their time or be as efficient as others, but at least they were given the opportunity.

Not wanting to spend still produces the same result here...

--Hating the Yankees--

Except then I guess one's only reason would be because they win? Because although the playing field is "hypothetically" leveled, owner X isn't taking advantage of it.

I hated that college sports did that, and I hate that highschool coaches are prevented from working w/ their players in the offseason. Even at the players discretion.

I believe this is right, but I'm not sure what coaches make around the league, etc, but cap that too if you want. Or make everything fall under one umbrella cap.

Though. I would argue in baseball it makes much less of a difference than in most other sports, though. Game plans are everything in football, but not much changes day to day in baseball. All teams pretty much have the same stuff in terms of video & facilities when it comes to the day to day preparing of baseball.

Coaching in football compared to baseball has a far less effect, or does it? 2009 Colorado Rockies? Regardless of that enigma. Scouting is ever so important, and probably moreso in baseball than any other of the major3. So if the Yankees can have 3 scouts for every 1 of the Pirates than they'll just find a new way to win that doesn't involve "outspending" the other guy.

Lets just put a cap on everything.

Lets cap player salaries.

Cap staff budgets.

Cap the improvements a team can make to their stadium that another team can't because of budgetary restraints.

Lets cap how many jerseys/hotdogs/caps/yearbooks/and programs the Yankees can sell because every little bit counts.

Lets cap the price on tickets so a Yankees luxury box costs as much as a Royals luxury box.



EDIT: Because hey...why should you or I be at a disadvantage to Bob the investment broker since he had the G2 (intelligence) to become an investment banker on wallstreet making millions while you and I work out $100K or less jobs. We should be able to have just as fair an advantage on buying tickets as he does right?

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Not wanting to spend still produces the same result here...

--Hating the Yankees--

Except then I guess one's only reason would be because they win? Because although the playing field is "hypothetically" leveled, owner X isn't taking advantage of it.

I hated that college sports did that, and I hate that highschool coaches are prevented from working w/ their players in the offseason. Even at the players discretion.



Coaching in football compared to baseball has a far less effect, or does it? 2009 Colorado Rockies? Regardless of that enigma. Scouting is ever so important, and probably moreso in baseball than any other of the major3. So if the Yankees can have 3 scouts for every 1 of the Pirates than they'll just find a new way to win that doesn't involve "outspending" the other guy.

Lets just put a cap on everything.

Lets cap player salaries.

Cap staff budgets.

Cap the improvements a team can make to their stadium that another team can't because of budgetary restraints.

Lets cap how many jerseys/hotdogs/caps/yearbooks/and programs the Yankees can sell because every little bit counts.

Lets cap the price on tickets so a Yankees luxury box costs as much as a Royals luxury box.



EDIT: Because hey...why should you or I be at a disadvantage to Bob the investment broker since he had the G2 (intelligence) to become an investment banker on wallstreet making millions while you and I work out $100K or less jobs. We should be able to have just as fair an advantage on buying tickets as he does right?

OK, so lets sit down and play numerous games of hold 'em...Assume we're evenly skilled card players, BUT for every game I get 5 cards in my hand and you get 2. Or I get $200,000 in chips and you get $90,000.

Would that be a fair tournament?

Would it be at all impressive to you or anyone if I won a majority of the titles? Would that make a me a better card player than you? Or am I just winning because I have an advantage you don't? Would it really make my titles as meaningful as if you beat me?

[Trevytrev11]

Re: Who is the most hated team in US sports?

Lets just put a cap on everything.

Lets cap player salaries.

Cap staff budgets.

Cap the improvements a team can make to their stadium that another team can't because of budgetary restraints.

Lets cap how many jerseys/hotdogs/caps/yearbooks/and programs the Yankees can sell because every little bit counts.

Lets cap the price on tickets so a Yankees luxury box costs as much as a Royals luxury box.

You are right, boxing, UFC, etc. would be much better if there was one belt and light weights had to beat heavy weights to win it. Weight caps for parity and fair compeition are just stupid. Who wants to see even and fair fights.