Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

[BL8001]

Ok so we can all agree that the way offsides is called in this game is ridiculous in that it is so exact as to be ludicrous.

Haven't we all been called for offside when the red line is on top of the yellow line?

Or how passive offsides is generally ignored?

So EA's opinion, which I have seen reiterated by different ea dev team members, is that it would be frustrating for the user if offsides was called incorrectly or in a variable method or just mistakes were made in letting one offside call be called onside, etc.

So what they are saying is that the user sure would become frustrated if the game generated errors on its own that the user couldn't control the result of.

This would be fine except the game is riddled with errors that occur outside of the users input.

I submit this fine example.

I am up 5 nil as rapid v. Wien.

I put the controller down and just let the game play itself for the last 10 minutes of the first half. I look up when I hear the ref whistle and lo and behold the CPU has won a PK.

So I pause and rewind. Without me touching the controller the game decided that my defender would jump up with his arms raised to defend a corner kick and then get called for hand ball.

Yeah EA it sure is frustrating when errors happen and you aren't in control. Good job keeping that out of the game.

[KG]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

A variable offside slider (yes/no) would be great just like the one for handball. Personally, I like having non-exact offside calls. They're a judgement call just like regular fouls.

[BL8001]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

There you go! perfect.

That way, no is EA's choice.

And yes will be 99% of the people who play FIFA's choice.

[Hutton]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

The rate at which the refs call offsides is astonishing. They never miss a single call, ever. It is an aspect of the game that does not model reality whatsoever and EA should be sad that they produced a game that behaves this way.

And the excuse of "people don't want the game to 'cheat' them" is hogwash. Incorrect referee decisions are a part of the game (sometimes a large part of the game). At the very least it needs to be an option (i.e. how The Show handles variable umps & blown calls).

[Dogslax41]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

As you mentioned the one where the lines are directly on top of each other is the most infuriating. But EAs stance on this is the same as fumbled snaps in madden. They don't want to hurt the tournament players' feelings with unpredictable game elements. This is what they mean by "people don't want the game to 'cheat' them"

It doesn't seem as easy as an on/off switch like handball where it's just ignored, but they could easily swallow their pride, pick up the phone and contact the MLB The Show programmers and ask how they modeled variable strike zones.

[half-fast]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

It's funny, you know, because in the NHL series for the past few years I've seen offsides not get called from time to time. They definitely miss a few offside calls, not sure why FIFA cant ...

[KG]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

As you mentioned the one where the lines are directly on top of each other is the most infuriating. But EAs stance on this is the same as fumbled snaps in madden. They don't want to hurt the tournament players' feelings with unpredictable game elements. This is what they mean by "people don't want the game to 'cheat' them"

It doesn't seem as easy as an on/off switch like handball where it's just ignored, but they could easily swallow their pride, pick up the phone and contact the MLB The Show programmers and ask how they modeled variable strike zones.

It should be as easy as a switch. They had lenient/strict refs. Why can't that apply to line judges?


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[Yeats]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

At the very least it needs to be an option (i.e. how The Show handles variable umps & blown calls).

The Show is an example of how not to implement a variable ump/ref system. Doesn't work correctly when on (many pitches 3-5 inches in the zone are called balls and no MLB ump is that bad), and doesn't work correctly when off (wrong ball/strikes are still called).

There is a long list of programming issues in FIFA; aspects of the game that need attention, that do not work correctly, or are flat-out broken. The offside call system is, when all is said and done, working correctly. I would prefer they fix the broken things first, before moving on to breaking things that are currently working.

[Yeats]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

So what they are saying is that the user sure would become frustrated if the game generated errors on its own that the user couldn't control the result of.

This would be fine except the game is riddled with errors that occur outside of the users input.

I submit this fine example:

Except your example, isn't an example. Errors the User isn't in control of refers to errors that occur during User vs CPU matches, not CPU vs CPU games. And posting a pic of a player touching the ball with his arm means nothing as that happens all the time in real soccer. If anything, the fact the player was called shows the ref logic in FIFA is working correctly. Or are we saying people should be concerned that refs in FIFA don't miss handball calls like they do in real life? (Sorry, I'm having a hard time keeping track of which currently-working aspects of the game we're hoping will be broken in future iterations.)

[half-fast]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

Except your example, isn't an example. Errors the User isn't in control of refers to errors that occur during User vs CPU matches, not CPU vs CPU games. And posting a pic of a player touching the ball with his arm means nothing as that happens all the time in real soccer. If anything, the fact the player was called shows the ref logic in FIFA is working correctly. Or are we saying people should be concerned that refs in FIFA don't miss handball calls like they do in real life? (Sorry, I'm having a hard time keeping track of which currently-working aspects of the game we're hoping will be broken in future iterations.)

I think the point he's trying to make in general, is that the game does many frustrating things already. As an example, player switching, which is brutally obvious does not work properly(but may be as intended to give the other team the advantage). In time-sensitive situations you can hit the switch player button 6/7 times and it will switch to everybody around the player you want; the player that is most obviously the best for the situation.

[Yeats]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

I think the point he's trying to make in general, is that the game does many frustrating things already. As an example, player switching, which is brutally obvious does not work properly(but may be as intended to give the other team the advantage). In time-sensitive situations you can hit the switch player button 6/7 times and it will switch to everybody around the player you want; the player that is most obviously the best for the situation.

Hey, I understand the game has issues that need correcting. I'm saying they need to fix the various bugs and problems before messing with the things in the game that actually are working correctly, like offsides and handballs. Example: The bigger issue with offsides isn't that it's called perfectly and correctly, the problem is your players are constantly running forward into an offside position. It's not only annoying, it actually ruins the gameplay. It's borderline broken.

[BL8001]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

True, and even worse, pop 13 back in and watch how much better your forwards stay onside.

And ea actually touted smarter player runs and curved runs keeping players onside for fifa 14. Puzzling...

What I am saying with my example is, if the user would be offended by wrongly called offsides (according to EA's defense of strict onside) why wouldn't that same user be offended by a defender on their team out of their control raising his arms in the box to easily give a PK to the CPU?

It's the same amount of a CPU screw job.

I do disagree with you about handballs. They are not called correctly at all. I can post several photos of CPU defenders both blocking shots and controlling rebounds/ricochets with their arms in the box and the ref ignoring it.

And to add another wtf, I have noticed lately that if I take a corner kick and then press LT + RT to manually move the target man away fom the landing point one of my CPU players and the CPU will fight for the ball and more often than not I am getting awarded PKs due to the CPU vs CPU 50/50 battle resulting in a CPU handball in the box.

[Yeats]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

True, and even worse, pop 13 back in and watch how much better your forwards stay onside.

And ea actually touted smarter player runs and curved runs keeping players onside for fifa 14. Puzzling...

That's what I'm talking about, FIFA 14 has at least 3 very noticeable bugs that weren't in previous versions: way too many offside runs, CPU balloon clearances, and CPU suction defending. Plus I've heard and seen those same bugs are in the NG version. It's a matter of priorities for me; fix the obviously-broken stuff first, and then move on to the secondary issues such as the overly-strict offside calls.

FYI, I shut handballs off two years ago. I'd say they work as advertized, but IMO they're too disruptive. And I believe they are cheat-coded so as to suddenly and mysteriously be called at the most opportune/inopportune moments -- one team down with time running out and in desperate need of goal.

[BL8001]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

FYI, I shut handballs off two years ago. I'd say they work as advertized, but IMO they're too disruptive. And I believe they are cheat-coded so as to suddenly and mysteriously be called at the most opportune/inopportune moments -- one team down with time running out and in desperate need of goal.

Yes indeed.

Most of those CPU not being called for obvious handball infractions in the box are happening when I am up a goal or 2.

Another huh? Moment with player runs is when the player signals you. So for example you play the pass across from mf to mf and as the ball is arriving if you look ahead you will see the st signal with his hands he wants the ball and then he takes off on his run.

But because the ball is still on its way to your mf the timing is off. If you collect it quickly or even one time it, it's too late as the st has gone offside so quickly.

If the st waited 1 sec more it would work.

The second thing that happens and boy do I hate this, if your st is running even with the back 4 and you are the mf if you watch the replay you will see that just before you passed the CPU d stops and lets your st run a fraction offside.

100% the game is cheating off your button press in those situations. Because there is a heartbeat of lag between button press and pass/shot whatever the CPU uses that against you.

Exact same reason why the CPU will drag the ball back the instant you press x to slide tackle.

[KG]

Re: Strict offsides calls - and EA's stance on this

That's what I'm talking about, FIFA 14 has at least 3 very noticeable bugs that weren't in previous versions: way too many offside runs, CPU balloon clearances, and CPU suction defending. Plus I've heard and seen those same bugs are in the NG version. It's a matter of priorities for me; fix the obviously-broken stuff first, and then move on to the secondary issues such as the overly-strict offside calls.

FYI, I shut handballs off two years ago. I'd say they work as advertized, but IMO they're too disruptive. And I believe they are cheat-coded so as to suddenly and mysteriously be called at the most opportune/inopportune moments -- one team down with time running out and in desperate need of goal.

I personally like the offsides runs. My ST gets maybe 1 or 2 a game but often it's because I see the run late sometimes due to the camera angle I play on and others just due to me missing it. The balloon clearances have been toned down. Believe me Yeats, it was one of my pet peeves but since I've started up my CM in La Liga I have seen a lot of clearances go the appropriate distance when on their strong foot.