***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

[Watson]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

Yeah, we should have just gutted it out when we had the chance after Wenger left. There are just one too many competing pieces for us to develop one quality squad. When Chelsea got the first goal you could feel the air come out because there just wasn't anything we could really bank on to get back into the match.

I don't know how I feel about calling for Emery's head but I'm definitely not pleased. I think we just need to strip the rotting mansion down to the studs and build from the inside out. Take our lumps and our sixth/seventh place finish next year and continue to build. We're just not going to take two months off and come back the team we want to be. There is no way this team can make that leap, mentally.

Not to cross sports but I can't help but feel like the Arsenal we saw today was like the 2014 Braves, just one too many pieces that didn't quite fit.

[Krebstar]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I don't know how I feel about calling for Emery's head but I'm definitely not pleased.

I'm definitely not calling for his head in the "Emery Out" way—I just don't think he's the right manager to rebuild a squad, which is what I think needs to happen. He was a good option for us to almost cheat what needed to be done, but I don't think he's what we need going forward.

We need someone willing to put their fingerprints on this squad and instill a consistent mentality and play style. We need someone to put a system in place, not rotate systems.

[jb12780]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I’d sell Laca first. He’s in his prime, and value will never be higher.


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[Suntan Superman]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

It feels weird to say this, but I think we're okay. I think we saw progress with the type of player we brought over the summer. Lichtsteiner and Suarez were the only ones that didn't work out. I also disagree heavily with Kreb. I think Unai is the one that can bring us through the mess and put his stamp on the club. Unai has a tactical philosophy, he currently doesn't have the players to play it.


I'm fine actively shopping just about everyone in the squad from the Wenger days. I'm an Ozil stan, but he and Emery have entirely different philosophies as was purely on display tonight. Ozil not being able to pass and move in the offensive third is not utilising him at his best. Our squad is also built very weirdly which needs some fixing. Hopefully we can take care of that in the summer. This was always a transition year, anything positive we got out of this year would've been cake.


A few thoughts on some players headed in to next year:

Cech - I wish he had been able to come a year sooner, and maybe we pip Leicester for the title with some competent goalkeeping, but who knows. Happy Retirement though, and thanks for the years!


Leno - Really came on in the latter part of the year, and you can see his confidence growing. I think he's probably the worst goalkeeper in the top 6, but I'm hoping next year he can bridge that gap a bit.


Bellerin - If Barca want him, we should sell at a high price. I believe in AMN should Bellerin leave permanently. He was having his best year though under Emery so I'm not bothered if we don't re-sign him.


AMN - what a revelation though, the midfielder-turned-do-everything-the-manager-asks really came in to his own. Some mental lapses still and is pretty far from perfect, but the fact that he can slot just about anywhere on the pitch competently is a huge.


Mustafi - You weren't as bad as some(even me) made you out to be, but it's clear it's time to move on. Your errors were far too glaring to just be forgotten to history.



Guendouzi - I hope he gets gametime going in to next year, or goes out on loan to get regular gametime. If he and Torreira are to occupy the same spot in the lineup it'll be a little awkward.


Elneny - I appreciate his passion for the club, if he wants to leave or ends up leaving I won't miss him on the pitch, but I will miss just how much he seems to love the club.


Xhaka - What a weird turn of events this was. Brought in to be a defensive midfielder, has an torrid time in Wenger's system, plays in a more advanced attacking role, and turns into one damn fine midfielder. Still not perfect, still good for a real ****ing stupid card, but man his passing has become something else from those advanced positions.


Ramsey - Thanks, good luck at Juventus, stay off the Trainer's table!


Mhki - Not bothered, turned in some brilliant performances, turned stomachs in the rest of them. If we can sell him off and eat only a small % of his wages that would be ideal. Otherwise hopefully Emery stops playing him on the damn wing.


Iwobi - I think he's a great player, but I think he's plateaued at Arsenal, I think a move would do wonders for him, and wouldn't be surprised to see him become a very good player after leaving Arsenal.



Laca/Auba - one of them is probably going to leave, and I've resigned myself to that, I don't have a preference for either striker, but holy **** was I wrong about them potentially not getting along. What a friendship and what production from the both of them. I will miss whomever gets sold and support whomever is left behind.


Finally, Ozil - As previously stated, I'm an Ozil stan. I hope his back is fully healed, I hope he gets sold, and I hope he proves how petty Emery was at the beginning of the year. Massive credit to Ozil in that Emery said he needed to train more, and Ozil showed up for more training. I'd love to believe that Emery and Ozil can mend their relationship and we can regain our talisman, but I think this game showed just how likely that was. In a system where Ozil will be allowed creative freedom and afforded more opportunities to play his pass and move game he'll shine, and if he does leave, hopefully he goes there. Credit to Ozil, but it's probably time to leave.


I'm all aboard the Unai Emery train, not a sliver of me is off it. As we grow more towards the team that Emery wants to build as well as move away from Wenger's spineless players I think we'll start to see greater improvements. I have faith Emery can do this, even if he won't do it the way I want him to do it.

[jb12780]

***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I think increasing transfer funds with player sales is necessary. Who knows what the actual budget is, but I’m sure it isn’t enough.

There are needs all across the park. Wingers, a few midfielders, center backs, full backs, and a keeper.

I would also say that an emphasis on youth isn’t a must. Arsenal aren’t going to outspend the Manchester teams, Liverpool, and Chelsea, so I would say we need to take a Dortmund like approach. But since they forced out the one man who could do such a thing, I’m not sure what the vision going forward is.

I’d be all for a young, angry team of bastards willing to give it their all.

Stat of the Day from yesterday’s chance. 450k a week Mesut Ozil created one chance in 77 minutes in a European final, and also finished the season with three assists. One less than Alexis Sanchez.


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[Krebstar]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I think Unai is the one that can bring us through the mess and put his stamp on the club. Unai has a tactical philosophy, he currently doesn't have the players to play it.

He started to lose me after he gave up trying to get the players he had to play the way he wanted. He tried putting his stamp on the squad, and then he seemed to cave, give up, or bend far too much.

There was a point when I'd say we were beginning to have an identity, and then we completely and entirely lost it.

I don't want another year of trying to fluke our way into the highest European competition.

I'd rather watch something be built than something crudely constructed just to get the job done while not thinking about the future. Everything about Emery to me has felt like it's only short-term. He was brought in to get into the CL—he failed to do so in the league, in embarrassing fashion—and we also failed via the EL. I don't want another year of that.

[KG]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I wonder what the fetching price for Laca would be. I’d sell him before Auba because of Auba’s ability to play out wide but those two seem to play well together and get along. Granted I don’t follow you guys as close as Chelsea but goals cover a lot of issues.

Understand the part about raising money from player sales.


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[jb12780]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I wonder what the fetching price for Laca would be. I’d sell him before Auba because of Auba’s ability to play out wide but those two seem to play well together and get along. Granted I don’t follow you guys as close as Chelsea but goals cover a lot of issues.

Understand the part about raising money from player sales.


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I’d say 70-90 million pounds.


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[Krebstar]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I'd actually rather see Auba go than Laca, and that's mostly due to mentality.

I love Auba, but I think he's closer to the soft mentality/not as bothered by losing that we need to rid ourselves of. Too happy to just be there, scoring goals, making money. Laca just seems hungrier and like he'd be a better mentor to young players.

That's my perspective from very, very far away, though. But right now if you said I could only have one of them going into next season, I'd take Laca. That would mean less transfer revenue, but I'm okay with that.

[jb12780]

***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I'd actually rather see Auba go than Laca, and that's mostly due to mentality.

I love Auba, but I think he's closer to the soft mentality/not as bothered by losing that we need to rid ourselves of. Too happy to just be there, scoring goals, making money. Laca just seems hungrier and like he'd be a better mentor to young players.

That's my perspective from very, very far away, though. But right now if you said I could only have one of them going into next season, I'd take Laca. That would mean less transfer revenue, but I'm okay with that.

I think Auba coming off of a golden boot would fetch some decent money. The problem would be finding a buyer.

I also think Laca has that killer instinct and desire that Auba doesn’t.


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[Suntan Superman]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I think increasing transfer funds with player sales is necessary. Who knows what the actual budget is, but I’m sure it isn’t enough.

This is the reality we live in though. Kroenke isn't here to invest in the team or the squad, so the team must make the money it wants to spend. Truth be told, I wasn't even sold that getting Champions League football would've increased our transfer budget by that much. The money might be in the war chest, but I don't think the war chest is ever being opened.

Stat of the Day from yesterday’s chance. 450k a week Mesut Ozil created one chance in 77 minutes in a European final, and also finished the season with three assists. One less than Alexis Sanchez.

Given the his isolation as the only attacking midfielder, this makes sense. Our shape was so bad yesterday re-watching the game only leaves me more puzzled as to what Emery's actual idea was going in to the game. Especially with someone as timid as Ainsley on the right side. If we had the more confident Bellerin, the formation may have made more sense as Bellerin has all the confidence going forward.

He started to lose me after he gave up trying to get the players he had to play the way he wanted. He tried putting his stamp on the squad, and then he seemed to cave, give up, or bend far too much.

I think Suarez getting hurt and not gelling was the nail in the coffin for the year in terms of Emery putting his fingerprints deep in to this team. I think he switched at that point from a system-oriented manager to a result-oriented manager. I think Emery has it in him though to continue to find the players he wants so that we can re-shape the squad to be more like he wants, and less free roam like we had with Wenger. I'm fairly confident in this being another 6 months of a process, so if we haven't gotten where I think we should be in January 2020 I'll start to be very concerned.

There was a point when I'd say we were beginning to have an identity, and then we completely and entirely lost it.

I don't want another year of trying to fluke our way into the highest European competition.

I feel this. We fluked our way into where we were this year, but with another transfer window I expect to see some major improvements as we also know who won't be fitting in to the squad.

I'd rather watch something be built than something crudely constructed just to get the job done while not thinking about the future. Everything about Emery to me has felt like it's only short-term. He was brought in to get into the CL—he failed to do so in the league, in embarrassing fashion—and we also failed via the EL. I don't want another year of that.

January 2020 is my check-in date. I'll either be eating a ton of crow or I'll be happy with the progress.

[jb12780]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

Yesterday would have been a great day for Ramsey.


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[JHedges2]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

You guys are making some very interesting and compelling arguments.

I have such a mixed bag of emotions on the state of the club. I have zero desire to lose Auba or Laca. I love them both. However, if they’re not properly serviced, it would better suit the club to cash in the chips. Of course we know historically that is not Arsenal’s MO.

I think it would be foolish to disagree with the fact that the squad needs an overhaul. A lot of wages are coming off the books this summer. I am interested to see how (if?) that money is reinvested.

-We will need a RB and LB for sure.
-We will need AT LEAST 1 CB—2 if he wants to continue with 3 at the back.
-We will need a creative attacking MF to replace Ramsey.
-If he does NOT plan to play 2 up top, we need proper wingers. (We MAY have those in Nelson and Smith-Rowe?)
-We will need to sort out backup GK; presumably Martinez, as I assume Ospina will leave?

Lots of holes to fill with apparently very limited resources. I hope we have a very intelligent team assembled to pull the trigger on who to bring in, and who to let go.


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[Suntan Superman]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

Smith-Rowe is the attacking midfielder of the future. Of note, Emery's system at Sevilla employed a withdrawn attacking midfielder as opposed to an out-and-out attacking midfielder. Smith-Rowe will be spending another year at RB Leipzig as far as I know, I imagine he'll slot somewhere in their midfield hopefully. Nelson is a true winger, and can operate as an inside forward if needed. Nelson SHOULD be starting games for Arsenal next year out right, there's no reason for him not to unless we want to continue with Mkhi on the right side(please no). Also coming up in the midfield we do have Charlie Gilmour who should be good for the first team within 2-3 years.

I'm not sure that we need a rightback unless we sell Bellerin, AMN filled in admirably and is still in the process of getting better. If he has a future at the club as a do-everything player, I think we'll be fine. We also need to figure out what exact style of player we're going after, as both of our current fullbacks are attacking fullbacks. Defensive like-for-like replacements shouldn't he hard to come by, and even Cohen Bramall and Jordi Osei-Tutu can fill in if need be.

I would finally love to have a centreback better than Kos, Kos has basically always been our best centreback and having him finally able to pair up with someone would be excellent. I wouldn't be opposed to getting a development project that replaces Kos, but I'd prefer someone to pair with him and have Holding/Sokratis as the backups.

[Krebstar]

Re: ***The Official Arsenal Gunners" Thread***

I would finally love to have a centreback better than Kos, Kos has basically always been our best centreback and having him finally able to pair up with someone would be excellent. I wouldn't be opposed to getting a development project that replaces Kos, but I'd prefer someone to pair with him and have Holding/Sokratis as the backups.

What happens with Kos is going to be very interesting, as he wants a longer contract and I don't think the club wants to give it to him.

I hope we give him more than one year contract—he should not be playing every week giving his body, but I love the idea of him continuing to mentor younger defenders.