defensive line pass rush moves (help needed)

[C_Bailey24]

Quote: Originally Posted by rudyjuly2

I do agree with the one poster who said only use the l-stick and then speed burst. I've had success after reading about this tip. The r-stick does nothing but cause problems. You usually fall down and may even trigger your DBs to run commit and leave WRs running free downfield. I'd recommend not using it at all which is a shame.

Glad you're getting decent results. As i said earlier it is not fullproof nor should it be. I see some guys posting in the thread about mixed results, etc. Why would u want the game to be setup so that any method of rushing the QB is overly consistent? This would not be realistic. The offensive linemen get paid too and they're in the NFL for a reason... they can block. Are the right stick moves pretty much pointless? Yes. Should they be more effective? Yes. But to want to sack the QB 6-7 times a game is just as unrealistic also.


Also when practice mode is different from a game which is why it may work better in-game because in practice the CPU QB isn't worried about getting 10+ yards for a first down. Like i said they key is getting the QB to hold the ball just a tad longer through coverage and game situation.

[7up3345]

Quote: Originally Posted by C_Bailey24

With the DE's you don't have to use the D-line moves to get to the QB in this years game. Just using the Left stick is better. Example, you're controlling the left d-end on your screen. When the ball is snapped you basically let your guy engage the LT, then pull the left stick Down and Left (7 o clock position) to quickly disengage then speed burst to the QB. Now Madden has given LT's ungodly recovery speed once they're beat but you can get pressure this way. Also most times a linemen or RB will sometimes slide over and help on you but this opens up the other side. Actual SACKS come more from the other DE using this same technique (except you'll be pulling down and right to disengage). I was using the Browns in CC and Frostee Rucker was just dominating using this technique.

I second this, I drafted 72 ovr LE, and he has 11 sacks his first year, woud've had more, but didnt find out this trick till about game 5.

Having said that. What is the use of the Swim Move and Spin Move(?) Trait then in ccm? Makes them kind of useless becuase i still can seem to use the Right stick to do squat after upgrading.

So far in CCM ive found that you dont have to purchase a lot of the traits they offer becuase if you look at the Traits page, under Rosters, the players already have the trait that they are offering as an upgrade.
And the fact that Swim/Spin moves dont work. They are all 10 000 and 20 000XP , save your points and role another way

[Double-J]

Quote: Originally Posted by C_Bailey24

Glad you're getting decent results. As i said earlier it is not fullproof nor should it be. I see some guys posting in the thread about mixed results, etc. Why would u want the game to be setup so that any method of rushing the QB is overly consistent? This would not be realistic. The offensive linemen get paid too and they're in the NFL for a reason... they can block. Are the right stick moves pretty much pointless? Yes. Should they be more effective? Yes. But to want to sack the QB 6-7 times a game is just as unrealistic also.

I think the issue is that there seems to be no consistency in how the system works. Trial and error to learn the controls is kind of sad, in my opinion. I get honing your skills and such. But when there's this many of us in a thread who are all apparently unsure of the control scheme, or how it is "supposed" to work, then there is an issue.

Again, I'm interested in learning if the devs intended the right stick to be timing based, to be mashed, held, etc. Because it seems very unsettled right now.

[mstikes]

Thanks to all of those who provided tips and I'm looking forward to trying them with Vince
Wilfork.

It's a shame though that we must rely on other forum members while the people at EA don't bother to explain the basic controls of the game like pass rushing and just copy paste the old manual year after year.

[Chairman7w]

THIS!! Great post - I was just gonna post something similar. The VERY best sack artists in the game today can only muster 20 in a season. That's barely more than 1 per game. For you guys to complain that you can't get around the OL... well, that's how it works. Any more than 2 a game and you've broken it the other way.

Quote: Originally Posted by C_Bailey24

Glad you're getting decent results. As i said earlier it is not fullproof nor should it be. I see some guys posting in the thread about mixed results, etc. Why would u want the game to be setup so that any method of rushing the QB is overly consistent? This would not be realistic. The offensive linemen get paid too and they're in the NFL for a reason... they can block. Are the right stick moves pretty much pointless? Yes. Should they be more effective? Yes. But to want to sack the QB 6-7 times a game is just as unrealistic also.

[slick589]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chairman7w

THIS!! Great post - I was just gonna post something similar. The VERY best sack artists in the game today can only muster 20 in a season. That's barely more than 1 per game. For you guys to complain that you can't get around the OL... well, that's how it works. Any more than 2 a game and you've broken it the other way.

This isnt my beef with it really.

What i dont like is the fact that there are only 2 things that happen wen you rush the qb. A) OL tosses you B) OL whiffs. There is no resemblence of the struggling and hand fighting that goes on in the trenches irl. I dont need to get 5 sacks a game but i do want to be able to feel like i had full control over any sack i earned.

[hellothere]

I always control my DT, and for the most part(unless he is on the bench catching a breather for his stamina) it's always Peko of the bengals.

Peko has great power moves and great block shedding, but because of the physics engine in this game he is rarely rewarded for it.

What happens is I'll use Pekos power move(usually push the right stick down) and he'll push the center flat on his back. Job well done right? Your reward should be an open lane to annihilate the QB with. Except the guy flattened in front of Peko is blocking his path which usually means Peko has to
A) Run around him giving the QB another second to pass which is the difference between a sack and a touchdown
B) Run over him, the AI is too dumb to jump over him so most the time Peko will trip over the guys body or just stay stuck behind the guys body

I've been adjusting my play style because I'm not seeing enough of a benefit from using my DT and powering through the oline.

I'm having more luck controlling my ends and trying to create gaps in the line or swim around with finesse.

Every player has different strengths so unless you are using the same D-line every game your not going to be able to gauge what works and what doesn't work for you.

Find what works for the players you have, pay attention to how the O-line is handling your rush. Sometimes you will need to change the way you user control, sometimes you are calling defensive plays that dont suit your strengths, sometimes you are using finesse moves on a player that has power moves. Sometimes your facing a team that has a 95 LT and 93 LG but a 76 RT and 79 RG so you should be lighting up their weak side.The game might not work exactly as it should in your mind, but I guarantee you there is a way for you to bring that pressure once you figure out what does work for you.
For me, it's an ongoing process and I'm constantly evaluating and changing my strategy from a game to game basis. Thats how football should be, thats how madden should be. Force you to think and improve.

[RandyBass]

Quote: Originally Posted by SamoanSteelerFromAus

First, I won't delve into how I think line play is the biggest abomination of next gen madden but I think the idea of having the block shed button the same as the hit stick is a very idiotic layout imo. So many times i've disengaged with out registering it right away (I play on fast) and then I flick the stick for a move only to stumble toward the qb and screw up a would be sack. I don't see why they don't assign the moves to bumpers and triggers. L1 - Rip R1 - Swim L2 - Spin R2- Club/bull rush Would of made things much better. Instead many of us get thrown by the olineman and we have the daunting task of finding out why because there are no tutorials from EA for some bizarre reason.

The way they mapped the hit stick controls and the defensive line moves is yet another one of those head scratchers currently existing in the Madden series.

They don't even have to go to the lengths that you propose, because afterall if L2 was spin you'd probably see your DE go into a strafe when trying to spin past the blocker. LOL. All they really have to do as a short term fix is to map the bull rush to R2, so that the hit stick isn't triggered when trying to do a bull rush.

In an ideal world they are working on a long term fix, with new animations and new controls; controls that don't interfere with each other like they do now.