Backbreaker News Post

Backbreaker Hands-On Preview w/ Gameplay Videos (IGN)

08:17 PM - March 2, 2010 by backbreaker

IGN has posted their hands-on preview of Backbreaker.

Quote:


	"Passing seemed to work a little better in the frantic football world that Backbreaker presents. The approach is certainly different than any I've seen for hurling the pigskin. Actually passing the ball is done entirely by the right stick, while targeting a player is done by holding the left trigger and moving between receivers with the left analog. The AI is largely in charge of the strength of the pass you're throwing (something that I'm worried about) unless it's a bomb pass, in which case you can move the analog down and then up to emulate a throwing motion of sorts. Every other pass is done with a simple flick upwards. Passing didn't feel all that great when I played with rigid camera movements that strain to follow the ball down the field and some wonky physics when the ball hit either the ground or a player's hands. Aside from standard quick play games, there's also an 8, 16, and 32 team season option and something called Road to Backbreaker which I'm guessing is designed to deliver some sort of loose tournament structure in the same vein as Mortal Kombat (escalating difficulty with meaner and meaner opponents)."

Game: BackbreakerReader Score: 6/10 - Vote Now
Platform: PS3 / Xbox 360Votes for game: 51 - View All

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# 121 alliance4g63 @ 03/04/10 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjcheezhead


	Injuries is a big flaw. I hated hearing that. 3 speed passing is same as Madden's. The pocket is about equal to Madden's. The camera view in my opinion is innovation. It's like pro-tak. Either you like it or not, but it is core to what the game wants to deliver. I just hate hearing knocks on BB involving parts of the game that aren't done well in the other game or knocks involving player models and such that were done because of potential lawsuits that's all.

Exactly my point. Good post.

# 122 ODogg @ 03/04/10 03:35 PM

Here's my main flaws:

1. Injuries not being in this game is the biggest simply because the technology shows the hits better than anything else - what were they thinking??
2. Three speed passing is not the same as Madden if you can't choose your speed and type of pass.
3. The camera view is poor but the real issue is that there is no other option. It's one thing when there is only one camera and it's not bad (like NCAA/Madden for years) but it's another when the camera in the game is just outright not going to make a lot of folks happy.

These are each pretty big flaws in themselves. But when you take them all together, well you just know somewhere an EA executive is smiling pretty broadly.

And like I said, it's one thing to argue on here that a flaw won't bother you, and I'm sure some of them won't. It's especially liberating for some of you I know to really defend this game since it's the rebel against the dark Lord EA but it's an entirely different thing when you actually play the game and have to live with the flaws.

That's why i'm saying, excusing these flaws is not going to help the devs of Backbreaker any. Constructive criticism and demanding more than the baseline, and some of these issue are baseline type issues, will serve the title better to continue to be more than a one-shot-and-done title.

Something else to think about - how will the casual gamers, ie the non-hardcore, you know the vast majority of those who actually purchase sports games, feel when they put the game in and see these flaws? You think they're going to say "well that's the designers vision" or are they going to say "WTF????" and take their rental back and be done with the game? I'm betting most will choose the latter...

# 123 ODogg @ 03/04/10 03:38 PM

CREED - we get it, you don't like EA. There's no need to keep calling their games garbage, really, we get it, LOL. Now, I do agree with you about the engine. My point is that if this game doesn't do some of the most basic things people expect in football games, things they've grown to expect because EA has provided them, then the gee-whiz-that's-cool aspect of the engine will be lost on them and the series will die a quick death. Holding this game to a low standard simply because it's the anti-EA is not going to do the series any favor at all.

But then trashing EA feels so good here that I guess you guys are not able to see the point I'm trying to make.

# 124 Hova57 @ 03/04/10 03:48 PM

I'm a big fan of the tech, but not having injuries is messed up. it can more than handle it. after see what limited gameplay has been shown. nothing really stands out other than the unlimited range of tackling. nothing in this game madden can't do. we have given madden grief so many times about limited development time. it has had 2years+ and so far what has been shown isn't really as impressive as I once thought.

# 125 ODogg @ 03/04/10 03:55 PM

I tell you my thoughts on this: they are putting this game out not in hopes to sell a lot of copies of the game or to create a new series to compete with or sit along side Madden. From the looks of the decisions made in this game it seems to me that they are creating this game to put pressure back on EA to buy their technology. I think their line of thinking is that once people see this game, be it via rental, at a friends house, on tv, youtube, wherever, that they will demand that Madden get this in their game.

And you know what? It may not be a bad strategy in the end. It could make them very rich, far richer than annual game publishing of a secondary football game might be. That's just my opinion..

# 126 allBthere @ 03/04/10 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODogg


	Here's my main flaws: 1. Injuries not being in this game is the biggest simply because the technology shows the hits better than anything else - what were they thinking?? 2. Three speed passing is not the same as Madden if you can't choose your speed and type of pass. 3. The camera view is poor but the real issue is that there is no other option. It's one thing when there is only one camera and it's not bad (like NCAA/Madden for years) but it's another when the camera in the game is just outright not going to make a lot of folks happy. These are each pretty big flaws in themselves. But when you take them all together, well you just know somewhere an EA executive is smiling pretty broadly. And like I said, it's one thing to argue on here that a flaw won't bother you, and I'm sure some of them won't. It's especially liberating for some of you I know to really defend this game since it's the rebel against the dark Lord EA but it's an entirely different thing when you actually play the game and have to live with the flaws. That's why i'm saying, excusing these flaws is not going to help the devs of Backbreaker any. Constructive criticism and demanding more than the baseline, and some of these issue are baseline type issues, will serve the title better to continue to be more than a one-shot-and-done title. Something else to think about - how will the casual gamers, ie the non-hardcore, you know the vast majority of those who actually purchase sports games, feel when they put the game in and see these flaws? You think they're going to say "well that's the designers vision" or are they going to say "WTF????" and take their rental back and be done with the game? I'm betting most will choose the latter...

The camera isn't poor, it's just your opinion of it as many have made it clear we're looking forward to it.

I could agree with your options argument if they were options still related to the default view and more minor tweaking.

The company for the get-go designed a game around the 3rd person on the field premise. That's the game they are making and that is the fundamental thing you can't either understand or don't like.

Madden and All-pro were built around their broadcast-style representation of the game. And as far as I know you can't play 3rd person football in those games. (I'm aware you can to a limited extent in Madden's superstar mode, but you have to pick only one position and one side of the ball, let alone that the gameplay feels tacked-on and in some cases broken).

Every design decision in backbreaker is based around the core experience they are trying to create - you can't just scoff at it because it's a 'vision' ... it really is fundamentally the experience they are trying to deliver of being on the field.

People that say "well I like to see the whole field, the game has to have that view for me to play it" ...well this game isn't for you in that case and just move along. You have Madden and All-pro that provide that experience of broadcast-style football. This is Gears of War style football in your face.

I applaud their drive to innovate and stick with what they wanted to deliver from the beginning...if they really listened to people like you they would be putting out some kind of twisted madden imitation because that's all the complainers know and are scared of trying something new. It would really be a sucky POS if they spent too much time listening to internet "geniuses" lol ... I'm looking forward to NM sharing what they feel is missing in sports gaming.

In short, ATM you can't get anything like backbreaker on the market right now. They are providing something unique and something different. you can't make madden play like backbreaker, so why do you expect to be able to have options that allow you to play backbreaker like madden? Just because this is a sports game doesn't change anything - if this was an rpg that didn't suit your needs/wants, you'd just move on, you wouldn't whine and try to make it into something that it isn't. Madden NCAA and All-pro all share a similar experience of football - this is something different. If you're just wishing it was madden with euphoria, you won't like it, NM gets that and doesn't give a ****...they're putting out THEIR game.

# 127 Hova57 @ 03/04/10 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODogg


	I tell you my thoughts on this: they are putting this game out not in hopes to sell a lot of copies of the game or to create a new series to compete with or sit along side Madden. From the looks of the decisions made in this game it seems to me that they are creating this game to put pressure back on EA to buy their technology. I think their line of thinking is that once people see this game, be it via rental, at a friends house, on tv, youtube, wherever, that they will demand that Madden get this in their game. And you know what? It may not be a bad strategy in the end. It could make them very rich, far richer than annual game publishing of a secondary football game might be. That's just my opinion..

two things wrong with this. Euphoria price is very high and can't be licensed out.
2. if you want Euphoria in your game. then they send a rep to your facility and install euphoria for you. its not middleware like morpheme or endorphin. that can just be bought and transferred into your gaming engine

# 128 capn_razzamataz @ 03/04/10 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by allBthere


	The camera isn't poor, it's just your opinion of it as many have made it clear we're looking forward to it. I could agree with your options argument if they were options still related to the default view and more minor tweaking. The company for the get-go designed a game around the 3rd person on the field premise. That's the game they are making and that is the fundamental thing you can't either understand or don't like. Madden and All-pro were built around their broadcast-style representation of the game. And as far as I know you can't play 3rd person football in those games. (I'm aware you can to a limited extent in Madden's superstar mode, but you have to pick only one position and one side of the ball, let alone that the gameplay feels tacked-on and in some cases broken). Every design decision in backbreaker is based around the core experience they are trying to create - you can't just scoff at it because it's a 'vision' ... it really is fundamentally the experience they are trying to deliver of being on the field. People that say "well I like to see the whole field, the game has to have that view for me to play it" ...well this game isn't for you in that case and just move along. You have Madden and All-pro that provide that experience of broadcast-style football. This is Gears of War style football in your face. I applaud their drive to innovate and stick with what they wanted to deliver from the beginning...if they really listened to people like you they would be putting out some kind of twisted madden imitation because that's all the complainers know and are scared of trying something new. It would really be a sucky POS if they spent too much time listening to internet "geniuses" lol ... I'm looking forward to NM sharing what they feel is missing in sports gaming. In short, ATM you can't get anything like backbreaker on the market right now. They are providing something unique and something different. you can't make madden play like backbreaker, so why do you expect to be able to have options that allow you to play backbreaker like madden? Just because this is a sports game doesn't change anything - if this was an rpg that didn't suit your needs/wants, you'd just move on, you wouldn't whine and try to make it into something that it isn't. Madden NCAA and All-pro all share a similar experience of football - this is something different. If you're just wishing it was madden with euphoria, you won't like it, NM gets that and doesn't give a ****...they're putting out THEIR game.

If I were a mod I would post this in a sticky at the top of the BB forums entitled "***Read this before posting in the BackBreaker section!***"

Seriously, well said.

# 129 CreatineKasey @ 03/04/10 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kjcheezhead


	Look at this vid at the 35 sec mark. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5h-9lkqRIKU That's a perfect pocket. That said, I was still underwhelmed with the line interaction overall. I did see a dlineman dropped to one knee and nice attempts at arm tackles in the developer diaries tho so the potential is there, it's just not there yet.

Absolutely not. The outside defenders did NOT drive upfield. In a lot of situations the DE's/OLB's run 3 yards past the line of scrimmage before engaging an offensive tackle/runningback.

Don't get me wrong, there's things I like so far from what I've seen, but the pocket is not one of them so far.

Don't kid yourself man, DE's don't just always square up with OT's and stalemate 5 yards from the QB. That was just as much of a pocket as Madden has. Like I said, in most pass rushing situations the outside rushers are getting upfield. Because of that, the QB needs to step up and remain in the pocket.

# 130 ODogg @ 03/04/10 04:24 PM

Sorry, agree to disagree. In sports games having more options is a good thing, not less. Having a restrictive camera angle and calling it a design decision is simply ignoring the fact that you are cutting out an audience that might be playing your game if you gave them more options. I understand the concept of the vision of a game but that doesn't preclude them offering options for those who might be interested in the game otherwise.

Choosing to do so if you're the king of the hill is one thing, you can afford to indulge yourself in forcing the user to partake in your vision...but when you are the new kid on the block trying to sell the game and build the series restricting the game to adhere to only your vision of it instead of trying to build to a larger audience and being inclusive is simply a very poor strategy.

I get your guys point, completely. All I'm saying is that by following this "vision" they may make the game they want everyone to experience and, as you say, make everyone play it how they want you to play it or not play it all...but what happens when people decide to not play it at all? The series dies and future chances to innovate are gone.

They would be much better served to include other camera angles and then simply suggest in the manual that the game is meant to be played in the default camera angle. Many games do this as we all know. Having a vision is fine but offering users no other choice but to partake in that particular vision or else simply dont' play the game is very short sighted.

# 131 ODogg @ 03/04/10 04:26 PM

creed - comments like these are what lead me to believe this is a technology demo meant to sell to EA more than an actual game.

"I agree with Rob from the BB team that once ppl experience this engine they will have a hard time going back to what they usually play."

# 132 CreatineKasey @ 03/04/10 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by creed200569


	They have only 6 people working on this game. For them to even give us this crazy customisation with 500-1000 layers,franchise mode witih drafts,scouting,etc... Road to BB mode,tackle alley,co-op play,amazing tackles,great graphics and awesome crowds is amazing in itself. They didnt think they were gonna have a franchise mode cuz they didnt think they could make the time to put it in. They gave us that and another mode. I think for their first time around with only 6 ppl with technology thats NEVER been used in a sports game before,they did an amazing job. Rob,one of the developers already said they are looking into injuries for the future,BB2 maybe, and everything else ppl bring up that they want to see in BB. Ppl should stop being so greedy with this game and expect it to have everything Madden or 2k had,thats just crazy. Go look at Madden 06 and All Pro 2k8 and compare those to BB's first years and clearly it shows the BB team did an amazing job with their first game. Most of the thing Ian Cummings said Euphoria couldnt do has been proven it can do. The gang tackles in BN look wayyyyyyy better than that Pro Tak garbage that just sucks everyone together. I agree with Rob from the BB team that once ppl experience this engine they will have a hard time going back to what they usually play.

Where's the greed? We want a superior football game. There's nothing greedy about purchasing a product. Am I greedy because I won't accept inferior gameplay if it ends up having that?

And the bashing... yuck. Really, let's talk BB football and figure out what this game needs to be great. I understand the hate for EA... but it gets really old and hard to read over and over. You drive possible customers away when you harass other products like that. Nothing good comes from repeatedly saying how much you hate EA.

I plan to be a day 1 buyer of this game, so before I get harassed by people - I made that clear. I want this game to be my new football fix. In order to achieve that, it needs to be actually good, not just "non-EA football".

Edit: Also, has anyone seen any good pass rushing moves or block shedding animations? I was hoping to see some but I haven't really noticed too many yet. On the CB blitzes I think I saw some block shedding. I never saw any spin moves or clear rip/swims when engaged with the OL. I was also hoping to see more "off balanced" OL lunging and trying to bring guys down before they reached the QB. Maybe I just missed it so far.

# 133 Hova57 @ 03/04/10 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODogg


	Sorry, agree to disagree. In sports games having more options is a good thing, not less. Having a restrictive camera angle and calling it a design decision is simply ignoring the fact that you are cutting out an audience that might be playing your game if you gave them more options. I understand the concept of the vision of a game but that doesn't preclude them offering options for those who might be interested in the game otherwise. Choosing to do so if you're the king of the hill is one thing, you can afford to indulge yourself in forcing the user to partake in your vision...but when you are the new kid on the block trying to sell the game and build the series restricting the game to adhere to only your vision of it instead of trying to build to a larger audience and being inclusive is simply a very poor strategy. I get your guys point, completely. All I'm saying is that by following this "vision" they may make the game they want everyone to experience and, as you say, make everyone play it how they want you to play it or not play it all...but what happens when people decide to not play it at all? The series dies and future chances to innovate are gone. They would be much better served to include other camera angles and then simply suggest in the manual that the game is meant to be played in the default camera angle. Many games do this as we all know. Having a vision is fine but offering users no other choice but to partake in that particular vision or else simply dont' play the game is very short sighted.

options would be great, but to get there finger on the game i see why. its not that bad a camera kinda cool, but prob wouldn't be everyone's cup of tea

# 134 mvb34 @ 03/04/10 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by creed200569


	They have only 6 people working on this game. For them to even give us this crazy customisation with 500-1000 layers,franchise mode witih drafts,scouting,etc... Road to BB mode,tackle alley,co-op play,amazing tackles,great graphics and awesome crowds is amazing in itself. They didnt think they were gonna have a franchise mode cuz they didnt think they could make the time to put it in. They gave us that and another mode. I think for their first time around with only 6 ppl with technology thats NEVER been used in a sports game before,they did an amazing job. Rob,one of the developers already said they are looking into injuries for the future,BB2 maybe, and everything else ppl bring up that they want to see in BB. Ppl should stop being so greedy with this game and expect it to have everything Madden or 2k had,thats just crazy. Go look at Madden 06 and All Pro 2k8 and compare those to BB's first years and clearly it shows the BB team did an amazing job with their first game. Most of the thing Ian Cummings said Euphoria couldnt do has been proven it can do. The gang tackles in BN look wayyyyyyy better than that Pro Tak garbage that just sucks everyone together. I agree with Rob from the BB team that once ppl experience this engine they will have a hard time going back to what they usually play.

Thats no excuse, The text sim games developers have less and seem to put the basic football stuff ie injuries..

# 135 ODogg @ 03/04/10 04:39 PM

Wow, this really nails what i've been trying to say: "it needs to be actually good, not just "non-EA football"

I would add that if it's just non-EA football it will be of minor interest to a lot of folks but as for the greed, what is it they say, you only get one chance to make a first impression. If the game honestly is underwhelming the series will not get another chance from a lot of folks.

So it's not a question of being greedy, and myself and most others are not demanding all of these various game modes and the like, we are simply asking that basic things that most sports games have such as injuries, multiple camera angles, etc are included.

To excluse those basic options will simply make it harder for the series to ever get a chance to impress anyone again and we'll be back to where we were in regards to EA competition. I mean this game is going to be a hard enough sell already without having the NFL and NFLPA license so missing other basics that gamers expect will make it even more of a hard sell.

I know some of you guys hate EA with a passion but the general public doesn't and being non-EA is not going to sustain a series. So continuing to bash on EA in this thread is missing the point completely.

# 136 Hova57 @ 03/04/10 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CreatineKasey


	Where's the greed? We want a superior football game. There's nothing greedy about purchasing a product. Am I greedy because I won't accept inferior gameplay if it ends up having that? And the bashing... yuck. Really, let's talk BB football and figure out what this game needs to be great. I understand the hate for EA... but it gets really old and hard to read over and over. You drive possible customers away when you harass other products like that. Nothing good comes from repeatedly saying how much you hate EA. I plan to be a day 1 buyer of this game, so before I get harassed by people - I made that clear. I want this game to be my new football fix. In order to achieve that, it needs to be actually good, not just "non-EA football". Edit: Also, has anyone seen any good pass rushing moves or block shedding animations? I was hoping to see some but I haven't really noticed too many yet. On the CB blitzes I think I saw some block shedding. I never saw any spin moves or clear rip/swims when engaged with the OL. I was also hoping to see more "off balanced" OL lunging and trying to bring guys down before they reached the QB. Maybe I just missed it so far.

if you look in the gameplay video thread. i think its like 15 seconds into the defense part the linebacker swims the tackle.

# 137 TheWatcher @ 03/04/10 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mvb34


	Thats no excuse, The text sim games developers have less and seem to put the basic football stuff ie injuries..

Can't compare text to graphical. One smart programmer with a tiny budget who knows football can put a text game together. It takes a team of talented people of several disciplines and a considerable budget to produce productions like BackBreaker or any major HD sports game today.

# 138 SouthernBrick @ 03/04/10 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by creed200569


	What r u kidding me. Of course this game is gonna steal sales away from Madden. So many ppl are tired of that garbage EA puts out every year and this game offers gameplay that has never been seen in a football game ever. BB wont sell more than Madden in its first year probably but I guarantee it will put a dent in its sales and you;d be fooling yourself if you didnt think so. This kind of engine is what ppl have been talking about since the launch of next gen and you dont think that we play a factor in Madden sales?? This game lacked what All Pro needed. A extremely deep team creator,edit player names and teams,customise endzones,franchise mode with drafting and a few other things,Road to BB mode,and good graphics. There is nothing but hype for this game around me here by Tampa. Everytime I go to gamestop,someone is talking about this game and how they cant wait to play it. I dont care about who reviews this game. Its just one person and ppl will be biased towards Madden like this degenerate at IGN who gave Madden 10 a 8.9 when it clearly didnt deserver higher than a 7 with all its problems,especially on gameplay.

Child please!

Madden sales won't break a sweat.

# 139 CreatineKasey @ 03/04/10 05:17 PM

[quote=creed200569;2040813976]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CreatineKasey


	Where's the greed? We want a superior football game.quote] The problem is you guys are expecting everything from this game their first time around. What sports game do u know that has everything done on their first game. NONE. It took Madden 5 years to get where they are and they still cant get it right. I want a superior football game too, but I'm being realistic here cuz its impossible for ANYBODY to put out a superior football game on their first attempt. This game looks like alot of fun and leaves the door open for a great future ahead. I dont want them to sell this techonology to EA. EA already has enough of a monopoly. If they want to let EA use it,then thats cool,but to give them sole possession of it would really tick me off along with ALOT of other people.

Yeah.. I'm expecting a game worth $50.

Let's not get ahead of ourselves here with all this selling engine talk. Why don't we see what this game is up to? I'm also not giving this game a free pass because it's the first game in the series. Sorry... all these games cost a lot of money. If this game was $20 maybe I'd hold it to a different standard. But as it stands this game will be full priced and because of that, I want a full, solid game. Enough said.

Alright, I'll have to check out that swim move. The reason I'm talking about the whole pocket thing in particular because I thought this camera angle was PERFECT for passing if there's a true pocket around the QB. Imagine having to trust your OL to block guys in your blindside because you truly CANNOT SEE THEM! That's how it is in real life.

I want to see the Demarcus Ware or James Harrison clone fly off the edge coming outta nowhere (his blindside) and swat the ball out of the QB's hands. Jared Allen does it all the time too. It's a huge part of football. This camera angle would capture it well.

# 140 ODogg @ 03/04/10 05:22 PM

CreatineKasey - just wait a couple of months and you can pick this game up for $3 in the bargain bin. J/k...couldn't resist that one.

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Backbreaker Hands-On Preview w/ Gameplay Videos (IGN)