Werewolf XXVI: The Thing - GAME OVER! THINGS WIN!!!

[Barkeep49]

Or is it just a lack of success catching Things?I think we've done quite nicely at catching shitfaces. My helplessnes is the same it was at the start of the game: I cannot construct a plausible way we win the game based on numbers. I think this is an interesting, albeit slanted, setup.

[hoopsguy]

I think this is an interesting, albeit slanted, setup.

I'm waiting until I see the roles at the end of the game to go too far down this path, but I have thought a little bit about how I would like to see another "high conversion rate" game play out.

[Barkeep49]

I'm waiting until I see the roles at the end of the game to go too far down this path, but I have thought a little bit about how I would like to see another "high conversion rate" game play out.
Realize that what I said isn't really a criticism of Schmidty. He came up with a concept that I haven't seen anywhere and I have been pleased to play in this game.

Something which is frustrating me is the lack of thread posting. I have a feeling that a whole game is going on behind the scenes that I am simply not privy to.

[st.cronin]

Something which is frustrating me is the lack of thread posting.

Agree with this. If I ever host a ww game I will strike people dead who don't do some minimum posting.

[hoopsguy]

The thread has had a weird ebb and flow, where it is stagnant for hours before a blitz of activity. And not just at the deadline - there were a couple of days where we had 3-5 pages of posts during the mid-afternoon. But the long stretches of inactivity haven't been much fun at all.

[Blade6119]

I think that is due to long days though...we have been on this same day for 4 days now and it was a foregone conclusion on friday i was getting tested. Not a lot of discussion can go on that hasnt already been said. These long days are what is killing it for me. So we are just short 1 vote i think, cant we just end it since there is 100% no chance im not getting tested? I want to hear RA after the test

[tanglewood]

Just got back in, my vote is fairly predictable.

Vote Blade

My reasoning was spelled out the previous day.

[Raiders Army]

Wow. It's dead in here. No results yet, so I'll see you tomorrow morning.

[path12]

go too far down this path

This phrase always cracks me up.

[path12]

What do people think is contributing to the sense of helplessness in this game? Is it the fact that the circles of trust model, which we have come to rely upon, has minimal value? Is it because the game has gone on longer (into our 3rd week now) than usual? Or is it just a lack of success catching Things? We aren't that far removed from catching Coffee Warlord, but it does feel like a long, long time ago.

I think the lack of the circles of trust is a good thing to have occasionally in our games -- it keeps things fresh. This has been a very fun premise. There is probably some more balance adjustments that need to be made to this ruleset, but I would play this game again.

The long days are a bitch. Maybe weekend days ending on Sunday night would help if not enough folks will be around for the weekend. Friday to Monday night is too long.

I also believe that the tactic of hardly posting at all is really affecting the games lately -- you know when it's all said and done we're gonna find things in the lowest posters. I know not everyone is going to (or should) be Blade (and I'm not a super prolific poster either), but if you're going to play in the game you should at least give some opinions here and there and at least be around for the discussions. In future, I'm going to be very very willing to vote off the non-participants.

[kingfc22]

Wow. It's dead in here.

Let's hope it's a Thing.

[Barkeep49]

To path: I happen to agree, though often times some players seem to post more when the crowd gets smaller, which obviously in this game it has not.

[Schmidty]

Another day, another test. Your minds are starting to fray. Suspicion is quickly being edged out by mental fatique and apathy. To some of you, your destruction seems inevitable, and your tests mean nothing. Today, you "target" someone who hasn't been tested yet: Blade6119.

Blade slowly walks to the table, talking all the while. What he is saying is anyone's guess, as it comes out in a constant stream of accusatory gibberish under his breath. He sits at the table and with much consternation, slits his thumb over the petry dish. He nervously heats the wire, and pauses with it over the dish. At the last second, his visage hardens and he slowly lowers the molten wire into the blood, all the while coldly staring at each of your faces in turn.

Nothing happens.

Blade tosses his chair away, walks to a corner, crosses his arms and slumps silently against the wall. "I give up. We are all dead.", Blade quietly mutters.

Blade6119 is not a Thing.

[Abe Sargent]

Ah well.

[mckerney]

Can't say I'm surprised. Great job barkeep and st.cronin leading the charge against a scientist for a 2nd vote in a row. So have you guys won yet? 'Cause if not I'm gonna do everything I can to make sure you two burn tomorrow.

[hoopsguy]

The only part that surprises me is that the Things didn't take Blade last night. Up until that point, I thought there was a pretty good chance that he was playing scientist.

How much do you think that Schmidty enjoyed writing that "test"?

[Blade6119]

.......

Do i really need to say anything? Bravo guys, bravo...

[Blade6119]

The only part that surprises me is that the Things didn't take Blade last night. Up until that point, I thought there was a pretty good chance that he was playing scientist.

How much do you think that Schmidty enjoyed writing that "test"?
The part about me talking and no one knowing what i was saying and throwing wild accusations...i think he loved every second of that

[Barkeep49]

Can't say I'm surprised. Great job barkeep and st.cronin leading the charge against a scientist for a 2nd vote in a row. So have you guys won yet? 'Cause if not I'm gonna do everything I can to make sure you two burn tomorrow.
Oh yeah. I was leading the charge with cronin. That's why we had different votes ALL DAY LONG.

[Blade6119]

Oh yeah. I was leading the charge with cronin. That's why we had different votes ALL DAY LONG.
Votes as of Post #2243:

Blade - Raiders (2179), Barkeep (2197), Cronin (2200), Hoopsguy (2201), Anxiety (2221), path (2225), Kingfc (2237), Swaggs (2239)

Hoopsguy - Blade (2185)

Cronin - Jeeber (2186)


Not voted: Tanglewood, mckerney, WVUFAN
Looks to me like you 2 voted 3 posts apart and both for me...am i missing something?

[mckerney]

.......

Do i really need to say anything? Bravo guys, bravo...

It was clear to me that you were clean once the bandwagon started. After st.cronin targeted you he got a scientist or two to agree and the things jumped on to ensure you'd be tested. Only way the bandwagon formed like that...

[hoopsguy]

Pretty sure that he is talking about the Jeeber/Tanglewood vote there, Blade.

mckerney, how long do you think that Cronin and/or Barkeep have been Things? Do you really believe that both of them were Things when the CW vote went down? Or are you not sure which one is a Thing and that is why you are lumping the two of them together? I know you have been voting for Barkeep, but I don't really have those two guys linked in my mind as co-conspirators over the course of this game.

[Barkeep49]

Looks to me like you 2 voted 3 posts apart and both for me...am i missing something?
I'm talking about yesterdays second vote.

Listen in retrospect I regret not pushing tangle who was and is my #1 target. I voted for Blade as I felt he was an easy guy to gain consenus around and was high up on my list. Obviously that was wrong.

[Abe Sargent]

I'm talking about yesterdays second vote.

Listen in retrospect I regret not pushing tangle who was and is my #1 target. I voted for Blade as I felt he was an easy guy to gain consenus around and was high up on my list. Obviously that was wrong.



Nice. Deflect suspicion from yourself and put it on another scientist time?


-Anxiety

[Blade6119]

Wheres RA when i need him :)

No big deal, we just lost the game...dont worry about ;)

[Blade6119]

Pretty sure that he is talking about the Jeeber/Tanglewood vote there, Blade.
He said both days...not 1

[hoopsguy]

OK, lets see if I can get the timeline info out there:

CW Scans: Hoopsguy (1), Raiders (2), Cronin (3), Blade (4), Barkeep (5) - no Night 6 scan

Blood Tests: Jeeber (1), Saldana(2/1), Dubb (2/2), Coffee (3), Dubb (4), Anxiety (5), Coffee Warlord (6/1), Jeeber (6/2), Blade (7)

Bodyguard: Hoopsguy (1), Barkeep (2), Hoopsguy (3), Coffee Warlord (4), Blade (5), Hoopsguy (6)

[Blade6119]

OK, lets see if I can get the timeline info out there:

CW Scans: Cronin (3), Blade (4), Barkeep (5) - no Night 6 scan

Bodyguard: Hoopsguy (1), Barkeep (2), Hoopsguy (3), Coffee Warlord (4), Blade (5), Hoopsguy (6)
I wanted to point out that with these two we dont know if any of these are legit. The first two CW scans are, but you could have gone night 1 and CW night 3...just making sure thats clear

[mckerney]

mckerney, how long do you think that Cronin and/or Barkeep have been Things? Do you really believe that both of them were Things when the CW vote went down? Or are you not sure which one is a Thing and that is why you are lumping the two of them together? I know you have been voting for Barkeep, but I don't really have those two guys linked in my mind as co-conspirators over the course of this game.

I believe they've both been things since before the Coffee Warlord vote, st.cronin probably a more recent addition to the things, and I'm sure that both of them are things. There's no doubt in my mind they gave up CW to us, and then used it to project an image of being completely clean, with st.cronin even saying that he and barkeep should be considered clean for that vote because of their early votes on CW. Add that with the barkeep being cleared by CW while he's a thing, and he also has the 'no thing would ever do that' defense to use. They distance themselves somewhat by each targeting a scientist on the second vote for the day and hope it works out, which it does very well for them. Now with the end of the game likely in closing in on us, they work together to start a bandwagon on blade and encourage everyone to join, because it's the only way we'll get a thing (after all, it's how they gave us CW). Though they fail to mention that a bandwagon on a scientist is exactly what the things want.

[hoopsguy]

Blade, all bodyguard and seer activities are self-published.

We know that Coffee Warlord was converted at some point. So obviously you have to take those with a grain of salt.

As far as my activities, I've published them here and it is up to you and the others to decide what value to place on that information. I think it is helpful in trying to evaluate scenarios, although not as helpful as I would have liked over the last couple of days.

[Blade6119]

Blade, all bodyguard and seer activities are self-published.

We know that Coffee Warlord was converted at some point. So obviously you have to take those with a grain of salt.

As far as my activities, I've published them here and it is up to you and the others to decide what value to place on that information. I think it is helpful in trying to evaluate scenarios, although not as helpful as I would have liked over the last couple of days.
Point taken, but the way you said it you stated them like they were fact...im just making sure people know which arent(grouping them with the tests was a nice touch) :p

[hoopsguy]

Blade, please feel free to write your timeline and I'll follow it instead. :p

Seriously, you are the only guy I know is clean at the moment so from now until dawn I'll treat your words as gospel.

[Barkeep49]

Nice. Deflect suspicion from yourself and put it on another scientist time?


-Anxiety
And you know tangle to be a scientist because you ___________________

[Barkeep49]

I believe they've both been things since before the Coffee Warlord vote, st.cronin probably a more recent addition to the things, and I'm sure that both of them are things. There's no doubt in my mind they gave up CW to us, and then used it to project an image of being completely clean, with st.cronin even saying that he and barkeep should be considered clean for that vote because of their early votes on CW. Add that with the barkeep being cleared by CW while he's a thing, and he also has the 'no thing would ever do that' defense to use. They distance themselves somewhat by each targeting a scientist on the second vote for the day and hope it works out, which it does very well for them. Now with the end of the game likely in closing in on us, they work together to start a bandwagon on blade and encourage everyone to join, because it's the only way we'll get a thing (after all, it's how they gave us CW). Though they fail to mention that a bandwagon on a scientist is exactly what the things want.
If you are successful with this, admittedly nice piece of logic, then the scientists lose the game.

[Blade6119]

And you know tangle to be a scientist because you ___________________
He doesnt, but it was a case of you positioning...just like hoops has done for days...:(

[mckerney]

If you are successful with this, admittedly nice piece of logic, then the scientists lose the game.

I highly doubt that. But good try with the scare tactics.

[Blade6119]

Blade, please feel free to write your timeline and I'll follow it instead. :p

Seriously, you are the only guy I know is clean at the moment so from now until dawn I'll treat your words as gospel.
Hoops, Tangle, Barkeep...thats my top 3 right now(#1-2 is a big drop too)...gospel enough for ya hoops? lol

CW converted night 3/5, doesnt matter...i know im clean, and think cronin is too...barkeep is prob. a thing, hence why 3/5 doesnt matter

as for your bodygaurding i think you went night 2, so i dont put stock into your list at all.

[path12]

Well, it's down to it now. What do we have, one more chance?

I'm open to any and all ideas. And I agree with what hoops said, Blade's thoughts are the most valid to me at this moment. So let's hear it, Blade!

[path12]

Crap. Crosspost.

[path12]

Blade, I've seen your reasonings about hoops, but why do you think Cronin is clean? And Barkeep a thing?

[hoopsguy]

Unfortunately, I suspected that your gospel involves me being stoned as a martyr. But I'll listen to it until dawn, when we each find out what team we are playing for tomorrow.

Interestingly enough, your other top two candidates line up pretty well with guys I'm looking at.

[Blade6119]

Blade, I've seen your reasonings about hoops, but why do you think Cronin is clean? And Barkeep a thing?
Working from hoops being a thing i know how much he respects barkeep and would want him on his team, or the other way around as barkeep would have a nice night 1 conversion after his role reveal. Neither have been scanned yet...

As for cronin, as CW i would have cleared two villagers first(we know he did at least 1 in me) so that if he got tested after either we would then go test cronin or myself...after 3 days i think he took a chance on barkeep....but i dont think CW would clear cronin right away if cronin was a thing. Cronin has been playing aggresive all game(wrong, but aggresive), and just seems like misguided villager...he hasnt tried to position, apologize, or anything. Just seems like a villager, gut feeling.

[Blade6119]

dola, barkeep had a special role he announced on day 1...why would they not try to convert him? as a thing special roles are your targets...just makes sense to me...

[Barkeep49]

dola, barkeep had a special role he announced on day 1...why would they not try to convert him? as a thing special roles are your targets...just makes sense to me...
Because I have been under serious suspicion most days. It's the same reason you evidently haven't been converted. I'm guessing when I had started to be more trusted is when CW was converted. After that I've had my voters each day.

[Barkeep49]

I highly doubt that. But good try with the scare tactics.
Not a scare tactic. A piece of 100% truth fuckface.

[Swaggs]

dola, barkeep had a special role he announced on day 1...why would they not try to convert him? as a thing special roles are your targets...just makes sense to me...

I still feel like I stabbing in the dark, but I have a better feeling about hoops than I do for barkeep. Hoops, as the bodyguard, would at least give the Things a reason to not consider him as a conversion choice, unless he got tagged early, I guess. Barkeep and Jeeber (who has obviously now been cleared twice) seem like more logical choices to me.

[Barkeep49]

I still feel like I stabbing in the dark, but I have a better feeling about hoops than I do for barkeep. Hoops, as the bodyguard, would at least give the Things a reason to not consider him as a conversion choice, unless he got tagged early, I guess. Barkeep and Jeeber (who has obviously now been cleared twice) seem like more logical choices to me.
How about we stop worrying about who got converted more recently and focus on an early conversion? Like tangle.

[hoopsguy]

List of people who have not been scanned yet:
2. Cronin
3. Tanglewood
4. Raiders Army
7. Swaggs
8. Path12
11. Barkeep
12. Mckerney
15. Hoopsguy
16. WVUFAN

List of people who are alive that have been scanned (day of scan listed):
1. JeeberD (6)
5. Blade6119 (7)
6. Kingfc (4)
14. Anxiety (5)

[Blade6119]

How about we stop worrying about who got converted more recently and focus on an early conversion? Like tangle.
See, i think you and hoops were both converted early...thats the thing barkeep...

[Blade6119]

I still feel like I stabbing in the dark, but I have a better feeling about hoops than I do for barkeep. Hoops, as the bodyguard, would at least give the Things a reason to not consider him as a conversion choice, unless he got tagged early, I guess. Barkeep and Jeeber (who has obviously now been cleared twice) seem like more logical choices to me.
Hoops is the only player who can hurt them outside of the vote...if he is not target#1 then the things are already set in winning or way too cocky...oh ya, or he is and has been 1 of them for awhile

[Barkeep49]

See, i think you and hoops were both converted early...thats the thing barkeep...
I don't disagree with hoops, but I have been on the side of angels throughout this game.

[Blade6119]

I don't disagree with hoops, but I have been on the side of angels throughout this game.
And id imagine after testing hoopsguy you will get to verify that through testing. I got to verify that about myself today, and id imagine you will soon as well

[hoopsguy]

Blade, on first reading I don't disagree with Post #2300 at all.

But if they aren't coming after me, perhaps it is because they see how the dominos fall when you were tested today and I'm tested tomorrow? You've made it very clear that you are pushing for me as a Thing for days now. Well, now that you've been tested the door is open for the game to end exactly like that.

If I was a Thing then I would have done everything in my power to avoid having you tested today. I don't think there is a more compelling argument that I can make for having been Human today.

[Blade6119]

But if they aren't coming after me, perhaps it is because they see how the dominos fall when you were tested today and I'm tested tomorrow? You've made it very clear that you are pushing for me as a Thing for days now. Well, now that you've been tested the door is open for the game to end exactly like that.
If you went night 2 you wouldnt see my testing and my accusations of you coming..they werent there at all when i think you went dark. And today the push was from RA and cronin, two people i feel are villagers(ra is in-between, but mostly clean). By the time you came around it was fore-gone, despite the fact you have said this whole weekend you actually thought i was prob. clean...positioning hoops, just like this. And i think you guys are trying to push tangle and sacrifice him(like he pushed you earlier in the game)...dont argue with me, my vote is set...go try and win over the others, you have done a great job of it so far...people tested me because i havent been tested yet, and here are you and barkeep, TWO SPECIAL ROLES, and neither has been tested...just saying...

[hoopsguy]

I think you are playing a little fast and loose with the facts in this post.

1.) Going into today there were ten people who had not been tested at some point in this game. Of those ten people, five have not been vouched for in any way (seer, bodyguard, blood test) at any time: Tanglewood, Swaggs, Path, McKerney, and WVUFAN.

2.) If the Things have been successfully converting each and every night then there is no move to "sacrifice" one for the other tomorrow. They are playing TO WIN THE GAME (7-6 with a Night 8 conversion after we screw up during the day).

3.) Barkeep using his special role on Night 1 removed his long-term threat to the Things. Suspect him for other aspects of the game if you will, but I don't think that this made him a bigger target for the Things or someone who should be more likely to be tested than an anonymous player.

4.) I'm positive that I didn't post all weekend that you were clean. I was barely around this weekend; during the time I was I had convinced myself that you had been converted Thursday night. I did indicate that I thought you were likely clean earlier in the game. If that is positioning then guilty as charged.

[saldana]

isnt this game over yet?

[Blade6119]

I think you are playing a little fast and loose with the facts in this post.

1.) Going into today there were ten people who had not been tested at some point in this game. Of those ten people, five have not been vouched for in any way (seer, bodyguard, blood test) at any time: Tanglewood, Swaggs, Path, McKerney, and WVUFAN.
I agree somewhat...counting cronin and barkeep when scanned by a thing is a very interesting move though...

2.) If the Things have been successfully converting each and every night then there is no move to "sacrifice" one for the other tomorrow. They are playing TO WIN THE GAME (7-6 with a Night 8 conversion after we screw up during the day).
Wrong...assuming you and barkeep are things, then it makes sense. Sacrifice one, save 2...regardless of how close you/they are, if im right then it makes perfect sense to try and clear 2 by tossing 1 out.

3.) Barkeep using his special role on Night 1 removed his long-term threat to the Things. Suspect him for other aspects of the game if you will, but I don't think that this made him a bigger target for the Things or someone who should be more likely to be tested than an anonymous player.
How do the things know it was a one time power...he said so? If it wasnt would he say? I wouldnt take the chance of him killing more, or even hoping he could be converted before killing that night.

4.) I'm positive that I didn't post all weekend that you were clean. I was barely around this weekend; during the time I was I had convinced myself that you had been converted Thursday night. I did indicate that I thought you were likely clean earlier in the game. If that is positioning then guilty as charged.
Correct, you didnt say i was clean...you said you felt i was clean up until last night..thank you for the correction

[Blade6119]

isnt this game over yet?
It will be if hoops is actually good, or whoever he manages to swing the vote to

[Desnudo]

I'm glad I didn't play in this one, too much to think about. I have some feelings, it'll be interesting to see how things turn out.

[path12]

OK Blade, I can go with your logic.

VOTE HOOPS

[path12]

isnt this game over yet?

Who are you again? ;)

[Abe Sargent]

OK Blade, I can go with your logic.

VOTE HOOPS


I think it is too early to vote, Night actions haven't been done yet.


-Anxiety

[Blade6119]

I think it is too early to vote, Night actions haven't been done yet.


-Anxiety
correct

[path12]

I think it is too early to vote, Night actions haven't been done yet.


-Anxiety

See kids, that's what happens when you smoke too much dope in your twenties. And thirties. And, well, you get the idea....

UNVOTE HOOPS

[Raiders Army]

Blade6119 is not a Thing.
Holy shiznit. Well, I apologize my brother. I can't believe you weren't a Thing. I'm totally lost now, but it appears as if there was a bit of pile on yesterday. I figured it was the same sort of CW pile on, but in fact wasn't. I think this may have lost the game for us. We definitely need to hit a Thing tonight.

[Barkeep49]

Hope that results are up soon, otherwise I will be out for the day an unable to defend myself.

[JeeberD]

mckerney makes so much sense. cronin and/or Barkeep need to be tested.

[Schmidty]

The night has passed, and Day 8 has begun. Votes will be due at 9 PM EST.

[Raiders Army]

I'm at a loss as to where to go from here. Hopefully today won't be as quiet as yesterday. I'm leaning towards hoops or Barkeep at this point. Barkeep maybe more than hoops since hoops was cleared at least once.

[Raiders Army]

Dola,

Another thought is that at this strike-out rate, do we need to test those who haven't even been tested yet? Arguably, Blade wasn't "tested" until yesterday. Who else is there that we have not gotten a good read on at least once?

[Blade6119]

Dola,

Another thought is that at this strike-out rate, do we need to test those who haven't even been tested yet? Arguably, Blade wasn't "tested" until yesterday. Who else is there that we have not gotten a good read on at least once?
Hoops and Barkeep...lol...i guess WVU, tangle, swaggs, and anxiety as well...

[hoopsguy]

From Post #2298:
List of people who have not been scanned yet:
2. Cronin
3. Tanglewood
4. Raiders Army
7. Swaggs
8. Path12
11. Barkeep
12. Mckerney
15. Hoopsguy
16. WVUFAN

List of people who are alive that have been scanned (day of scan listed):
1. JeeberD (6)
5. Blade6119 (7)
6. Kingfc (4)
14. Anxiety (5)

I'm expecting to be free of this meeting in about two hours to join in the discussion. Hopefully we have people showing up today to participate, as opposed to yesterday.

[Blade6119]

Technically though, RA was cleared when we tested CW...i did miss path, cronin, and mckerney though

[Blade6119]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

i think this is the 5th vote in a row i have advocated this move...we all knew it was coming

[Raiders Army]

hoops, I thought you were cleared by CW when he came out of the closet. And is WVUFan even playing anymore?

[Blade6119]

hoops, I thought you were cleared by CW when he came out of the closet. And is WVUFan even playing anymore?
he was, and kind of

[st.cronin]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

By my math, if hoops is not a Thing, it's game over. Sorry Blade!

[Blade6119]

VOTE HOOPSGUY

By my math, if hoops is not a Thing, it's game over. Sorry Blade!
well im 99.9999999% sure either hoops or barkeep is a thing, and about 65% both are...any feelings on your partner in crime from earlier cronin?

[st.cronin]

well im 99.9999999% sure either hoops or barkeep is a thing, and about 65% both are...any feelings on your partner in crime from earlier cronin?

No feelings either way today. I thought he was human when we roasted CW. It wouldn't surprise me either way at this point.

[Blade6119]

No feelings either way today. I thought he was human when we roasted CW. It wouldn't surprise me either way at this point.
and on hoops, how do you feel?

[st.cronin]

and on hoops, how do you feel?

I think he may have been a Thing when we roasted CW. I suspect that he was the bodyguard, and was converted. I think a human bodyguard would NOT have revealed the way he did.

[mckerney]

Vote Barkeep

We're at the point of the game where we absolutely have to get a thing, so barkeep has to be tested today.

[Blade6119]

I think he may have been a Thing when we roasted CW. I suspect that he was the bodyguard, and was converted. I think a human bodyguard would NOT have revealed the way he did.
Interesting...lastly, what of your thoughts on dubb/king

[st.cronin]

Interesting...lastly, what of your thoughts on dubb/king

I am interested in a test on king at some point. After this vote, assuming hoops burns, I would like to go in that direction, or maybe WVUfan. One or more of those quiet types has got to be a Thing.

[Raiders Army]

Without anything else to go on, I'll

VOTE HOOPSGUY

Barkeep is definitely someone else I'll look at. I hate to say it, but Blade is as well (there was a night cycle after all) :)

[Blade6119]

Does anyone else have a special role that might help us in any way today? Any witness or anything? Im rather certain we had special roles on top of seer and bodyguard, so if anyone knows anything that would help us get a thing, today is the day to step-up...now dont reveal if it wont help us and just expose yourself, only if you can help

[Blade6119]

Dola, hoops...who do you claim to have guarded the past two nights?

[JeeberD]

Vote Barkeep

[hoopsguy]

Blade, last night I guarded you again. You were the only guy that I knew was human. So I know that you are human today, rather than converted and gunning for me today.

Cronin was my (fairly distant) 2nd choice, as he is the person I'm 2nd most confident in being human today even though he hasn't been cleared since CW did it a few days back.

[hoopsguy]

For my vote, I'm going to pick a side in this ongoing mckerney/Barkeep dispute. And I'm choosing Barkeep as the human today. I'm more inclined to believe an either/or scenario at this point in the game than I was earlier in the game just because the number of Things we are fighting continues to increase.

VOTE MCKERNEY

[kingfc22]

Does anyone else have a special role that might help us in any way today? Any witness or anything? Im rather certain we had special roles on top of seer and bodyguard, so if anyone knows anything that would help us get a thing, today is the day to step-up...now dont reveal if it wont help us and just expose yourself, only if you can help

I have a special role since I took over for Dubb. My role allows my vote to be double weighted twice during the game. So if we think we might have a Thing and a scientist runoff my vote would essentially be a tiebreaker.

[path12]

Jeez. First I vote too early, then I forget to vote when I can. Still going with Blade for now as I mentioned yesterday:

VOTE HOOPS

[Blade6119]

I have a special role since I took over for Dubb. My role allows my vote to be double weighted twice during the game. So if we think we might have a Thing and a scientist runoff my vote would essentially be a tiebreaker.
Whats that role called? :confused:

[Abe Sargent]

Vote Barkeep


-Anxiety

[Blade6119]

Until i hear back from him, king just shot up my suspect list...i cant give away my clue yet, but something about what he just said was rather odd. Barkeep or hoops are still my top 2, but king just garnered at least a look from me

[hoopsguy]

Ditto, Blade. And I think I know exactly what you are getting at with this ...

[Blade6119]

Ditto, Blade. And I think I know exactly what you are getting at with this ...
Wait for him to get back, but when he announces his role name id love for you to reveal what you think im talking about. If your right, i will suddenly have to view you in a new light.

[Blade6119]

dola, and have you used either of the two double-votes yet(i would think dubb would have)

[Blade6119]

And im off to class...doubt ill be back until close to the deadline...i wish you all luck while im away, but i should be back in time to move my vote if this king thing plays out a certain way. For now though, hoops or barkeep need to be tested...either are things to me

[Swaggs]

I think Barkeep and hoopsguy are both good candidates now. I think with hoopsguy being the bodyguard, he would be a little more of a risk to go after for the Things while they are trying to gain numbers, so I think I am going to go with Barkeep today.

Vote Barkeep

[Swaggs]

Also, I think it is suspicious that hoopsguy is voting for mckerney when momentum appears to be going pretty solidly in two directions, either for him or Barkeep.

[mckerney]

For my vote, I'm going to pick a side in this ongoing mckerney/Barkeep dispute. And I'm choosing Barkeep as the human today. I'm more inclined to believe an either/or scenario at this point in the game than I was earlier in the game just because the number of Things we are fighting continues to increase.

VOTE MCKERNEY

I'm not surprised by this. You're #3 on my suspect list right now, and although I'm not nearly as sure as I am about you as I am barkeep and st.cronin, this gives me more reason to confirm my suspicion.


Just be ready to take a test after barkeep burns today.

[hoopsguy]

Depending on what King's answer is, I think there is going to be a mad rush off of both Barkeep and I later this afternoon.

And if there is no answer forthcoming I'm defintely switching my vote. Not that mckerney was exactly sweating the bandwagon forming behind my vote for him ...

[hoopsguy]

Swaggs, why would you want me to vote for someone (Barkeep) who I think is more likely to be a villager than most of the other people in this game?

Again, barring a really good answer from King, my vote isn't staying on mckerney (or going to Barkeep).

[Blade6119]

Depending on what King's answer is, I think there is going to be a mad rush off of both Barkeep and I later this afternoon.

And if there is no answer forthcoming I'm defintely switching my vote. Not that mckerney was exactly sweating the bandwagon forming behind my vote for him ...
If you want you can go ahead and say what it is...its your call, but regardless of kings actions i want to hear you state your claim on what it is before the deadline...not yet, as there is time...but this is not something i want you to sweep under the rug.

[Swaggs]

Depending on what King's answer is, I think there is going to be a mad rush off of both Barkeep and I later this afternoon.

And if there is no answer forthcoming I'm defintely switching my vote. Not that mckerney was exactly sweating the bandwagon forming behind my vote for him ...

I have no doubt that the Things have enough numbers by now to swing the vote away from them, as long as the vote is spread out enough. That is why I think we should be voting for two candidates, rather than splitting things up three or more ways. It also why I think a vote for mckerney is suspicious. If you start momentum towards him, you could be hoping that even one or two of us fall in line behind you, giving you a viable third person to swing things to if people do not check back in time to switch their votes.

What makes mckerney a better candidate to be a Thing than Barkeep to you? If you are not a Thing, I cannot see why you would want to bring a third person into the conversation (even if he is a reasonable) choice.

[kingfc22]

Whats that role called? :confused:

I was told that I run a cutting-edge manufacturing plant in the US and was sent here to Antartica to examine the conditions because I am what you would call a genius in my field. I am hopint to use the research I have found here to make better equipment upon my return.

Since I am so well respected amongst the other scientists and I often talk to other corporate executives I am able to use my communication skills to allow my vote to count double.

[Blade6119]

I was told that I run a cutting-edge manufacturing plant in the US and was sent here to Antartica to examine the conditions because I am what you would call a genius in my field. I am hopint to use the research I have found here to make better equipment upon my return.

Since I am so well respected amongst the other scientists and I often talk to other corporate executives I am able to use my communication skills to allow my vote to count double.
Ok, i hope you didnt post a replica of your pm...thats against the rules...just wanted a role name...so if you did, delete that...either way thank you for that information...now its hoops' turn to reveal information

[kingfc22]

Ok, i hope you didnt post a replica of your pm...thats against the rules...just wanted a role name...so if you did, delete that...either way thank you for that information...now its hoops' turn to reveal information

No it was more of a paraphrase.

[hoopsguy]

Just to make sure I understand properly - you replaced Dubb, correct?

So how do the words simple and brilliant make their way into this role? I know that you are getting worked on here for something that was said by your predecessor (Dubb) but back on Day 1 he was adamant that the "brilliant" explanation that I offered up was not sufficient to show that I was a generic scientist. That I had ignored the word "simple" in bringing out the explanation to the masses.

I'll pull up post numbers if I need to do this, but this was a big enough topic of discussion early in the game that this should certainly jog people's memory.

UNVOTE MCKERNEY
VOTE KINGFC22

[Blade6119]

hoops, lets hear what you have to say on this matter

[Blade6119]

dola, he beat me to my smart ass remark

[Swaggs]

Swaggs, why would you want me to vote for someone (Barkeep) who I think is more likely to be a villager than most of the other people in this game?

Again, barring a really good answer from King, my vote isn't staying on mckerney (or going to Barkeep).

Why would you vote for someone that you do not intend on keeping your vote on, other than to run interference?

All I know is that I am not certain of anyone's innocence except my own and almost certainly Blade. If I were you and could see that the vote is trending towards either me or someone that I was not sure about, I would not see a good reason for voting for a third person, since it might be the one vote that makes me get tested, rather than someone like Barkeep (who unlike me, I am not certain of whether or not they are a Thing). With numbers the way they are and our chances of pulling this out pretty close to on the line right now, I don't see a real good reason to get cute and vote for a third person right now unless you have a real good reason to. And so far, I haven't heard you trying to sell us on mckerney very hard at all.

[hoopsguy]

Schmidty, when you read this can you please verify that King did in fact replace Dubb (as opposed to someone else)?

[kingfc22]

Just to make sure I understand properly - you replaced Dubb, correct?

So how do the words simple and brilliant make their way into this role? I know that you are getting worked on here for something that was said by your predecessor (Dubb) but back on Day 1 he was adamant that the "brilliant" explanation that I offered up was not sufficient to show that I was a generic scientist. That I had ignored the word "simple" in bringing out the explanation to the masses.

I'll pull up post numbers if I need to do this, but this was a big enough topic of discussion early in the game that this should certainly jog people's memory.

UNVOTE MCKERNEY
VOTE KINGFC22


Since I wasn't in the game until day 5 or 6 (I forget which) could you give me those posts. Without knowing what had happened all I can say is that dubb and I have different play styles. I feel like we need to get information out in the open to clear people at this point in the game because it feels like the Things are close to winning this unless people start trying to clear themselves.

[Blade6119]

Since I wasn't in the game until day 5 or 6 (I forget which) could you give me those posts. Without knowing what had happened all I can say is that dubb and I have different play styles. I feel like we need to get information out in the open to clear people at this point in the game because it feels like the Things are close to winning this unless people start trying to clear themselves.
Im sure he will, but the generic scientist role included the words "simple, but brilliant scientist" as well as some other stuff. Dubb was the one who really came out in the open with the simple part of the PM and attacked hoops for not using it(hoops claims bodyguard, so dubb was right)...if you indeed are what you claim, then why would dubb have known simple but brilliant.

Its an intriguing argument put forth by hoops, that he would like you to answer.

[hoopsguy]

Swaggs, because I think the window of days for Barkeep to have been converted, as compared to most of the other players in the game, is pretty small.

The fact that Blade checked out means that Coffee Warlord was clearing at least some villagers. The idea that makes the most sense for a turned seer is to clear villagers every day rather than get cute and slip in a Thing. I don't know if that is what they did, but I think CW is a smart enough player to realize this.

Once I make that inductive leap, I then think that there are only three nights for Barkeep to have been converted. And he has been under fire the entire time ... a position that I can definitely sympathize with. Finally, I've played enough games with Barkeep that I'm going to make some decisions based on gut instinct. Which tells me that at least as of yesterday he was playing as a scientist and not a Thing.

Now, if I'm not going to vote for myself or Barkeep, then where do I go with my vote? Well, how about to someone who has been applying pressure to two guys that are pretty high on my trust list for today (Cronin and Barkeep)? Who has been attacking him for several days now and vehemently trying to make the case that he is a Thing?

That said, I would rather go after someone who appears to have screwed up with a needless role reveal (Kingfc22) than follow my suspicion. Going for the 95% play instead of the 75% play. That is my explanation for the earlier vote as well as my current vote.

[hoopsguy]

Post #183 by Dubb:
Actually I think this hurts you a little in my book Hoopsguy. If you don't quite get the "brilliant" blurb, that leads me to believe you didn't get a simliar PM to what some of the rest of us got. It refers to us as simple, but brilliant http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/images/smilies/smile.gif. I didn't want to bring that up, but since it is already out in the open I see no problem with it.

What you quoted has nothing to do with that.

[hoopsguy]

Blade, was that the piece of info you were thinking about as well? Or did you have something else?

[Blade6119]

I then think that there are only three nights for Barkeep to have been converted.
And hoops slips up too....you claimed to have guarded CW on night 4, making 3 night he could have been converted impossible seeing as how he was tested on day 3 and killed on day 6...thats leaves nights 3 and 5 open for conversion...2 nights, not 3...

Hoops, you almost had me thinking king until this...:(

[Blade6119]

Blade, was that the piece of info you were thinking about as well? Or did you have something else?
Not at all, i never caught that the first time through. Im rather impressed by your shrewdness to catch that. Now, im currently inclined to trust king becuase of a small comment he made, but its interesting you saw that. What i was after he answered with the correct answer...

[st.cronin]

interesting

[Raiders Army]

I'm a little lost at this point. I think I need to re-read some stuff here.

[kingfc22]

Hoops - I'm not sure why Dubb said what he said other than he plays differently than I do. He might have jumped on the fact that others were posting "simple but brilliant" and wanted to fit in with the crowd. My role describes me as a genius so I guess Dubb just didn't want to stick out so early in the game.

[st.cronin]

This is the question I have - the Things are, and have been for a while, playing very smart. Which good players have not been tested lately? hoops is the only one that really comes to my mind.

[Blade6119]

Without going in-depth about reasons, hoops or barkeep is the way to go. The trick is which one...id bank my post count one is bad, just not 100% which...but king should not be the target today after his description fit what i was looking for

[hoopsguy]

Blade, technically Barkeep could have been converted any night, not just in a three night window. I think you are misreading what I put out there.

What I was saying with the "three nights to be converted" is that if Coffee had been converted and was clearing villagers with his scans (thus avoiding any indications of Things) then Barkeep was clear on Day 6 (when CW was killed). Which would leave only two nights for him to have been converted - Night 6 and Night 7.

In essence, you are right that I typed three nights instead of two nights. But it looks like you read this to think I was talking about nights where CW could have been converted and not nights where I assume Barkeep was up for consideration as a conversion.

Incidentally, I do agree with what Swaggs said about having at most two candidates for the vote today. I would prefer that we have one candidate to avoid any chance of the Things manipulating the vote. But I absolutely will not vote for either Blade or me because I know that loses the game for us. And I strongly suspect that voting for either Barkeep or Cronin also loses the game.

Until I see some kind of rebuttal from King I'm not sure why anyone is not voting for him.

[Blade6119]

This is the question I have - the Things are, and have been for a while, playing very smart. Which good players have not been tested lately? hoops is the only one that really comes to my mind.
Barkeep hasnt either...hoops and barkeep...around and around we go, yet all the pieces keep falling into place for these two. Both claim special roles, both have had heat on them but have always gotten someone else tested..and both have supported each other almost all game

[Raiders Army]

Genius > Brilliant

[Blade6119]

But it looks like you read this to think I was talking about nights where CW could have been converted and not nights where I assume Barkeep was up for consideration as a conversion.
Wow, i read CW and not barkeep on your earlier post...my fault entirely...

As for king, hes not the way im going today...he might be converted later, but hes my most trusted person now(outside of myself)

[kingfc22]

Barkeep hasnt either...hoops and barkeep...around and around we go, yet all the pieces keep falling into place for these two. Both claim special roles, both have had heat on them but have always gotten someone else tested..and both have supported each other almost all game

I'm with ya blade. I think it is one or the other. The key is obviously who to target today.

[Raiders Army]

I'd like to see Barkeep and hoops debate this at this point. I'll keep my vote on hoops since he seems to be vocal in his defense, but there's something that doesn't seem right. Barkeep is awfully silent...

[Raiders Army]

Hope that results are up soon, otherwise I will be out for the day an unable to defend myself.
Dola, just remembered this. Hmmmm...real or a possible passive defense?

[st.cronin]

Barkeep hasnt either...hoops and barkeep...around and around we go, yet all the pieces keep falling into place for these two. Both claim special roles, both have had heat on them but have always gotten someone else tested..and both have supported each other almost all game

Thinking about how the CW thing fell into place, it's possible BK was a Thing that day. That's the sort of play they would probably need to make at least once.

[hoopsguy]

I'm up for whatever kind of debate people want to have here, but it isn't going to be Barkeep I'm trying to lynch unles it becomes a him or me scenario.

We have more than half of the people playing the game in the room right now, but no one besides Blade or I are talking about this Kingfc22. Hmm ... wonder how many PMs are flying right now trying to figure out how to address this?

[Blade6119]

I'm with ya blade. I think it is one or the other. The key is obviously who to target today.
There is where im having my problems...hoops is my vote until i hear a better reason for barkeep.

I think hoops has been bad most of the game(night 2 in my mind), but even if you think not he revealed 2 days ago...he all but said he was guarding himself 2 nights ago, and yesterday said he guarded himself...why, as a thing, would you not convert the bodyguard last night if you knew he was defenseless. That alone is off, and there are a million other reasons.

But barkeep has reasons too, stemming all the way back to the qwikshot kill(which i do believe was legit). So im on hoops until i hear better, but i firmly believe at least 1 is a thing...trick is which

[Swaggs]

Without going in-depth about reasons, hoops or barkeep is the way to go. The trick is which one...id bank my post count one is bad, just not 100% which...but king should not be the target today after his description fit what i was looking for

I agree.

Barkeep and hoopsguy are targets 1a and 1b to me. Although I understand this argument is useless if hoopsguy was converted early, I still think him throwing the bodyguard thing out there had to be at least somewhat of a deterrent to the Things. The Things want to grow in number so that they outnumber us, so I just think taking that risk is not a worthwhile risk for them. Again, if he got converted early, that is all out the window. I'm sticking on Barkeep for now. Hopefully we will get a chance to test them both today.

[Blade6119]

I'm up for whatever kind of debate people want to have here, but it isn't going to be Barkeep I'm trying to lynch unles it becomes a him or me scenario.

We have more than half of the people playing the game in the room right now, but no one besides Blade or I are talking about this Kingfc22. Hmm ... wonder how many PMs are flying right now trying to figure out how to address this?
You will not get me to vote kingfc today if you tortured me...for today, he is clean...i have spoken ;)

[Blade6119]

The Things want to grow in number so that they outnumber us, so I just think taking that risk is not a worthwhile risk for them.
Heres the flip side though...they dont convert him he has a very real chance to ruin their game, be it once or 5 times...they took the seer out after he revealed becuase he was a threat to their victory...hoops would be a threat as well, the only one unless barkeep could kill repeatedly which we have seen hasnt happened.

[st.cronin]

Heres the flip side though...they dont convert him he has a very real chance to ruin their game, be it once or 5 times...they took the seer out after he revealed becuase he was a threat to their victory...hoops would be a threat as well, the only one unless barkeep could kill repeatedly which we have seen hasnt happened.

That's what I think, too. Problem is, I think if we miss this vote, it's game over.

[Raiders Army]

I still don't see how the Things didn't convert you Blade. *grumble* :D

[Blade6119]

That's what I think, too. Problem is, I think if we miss this vote, it's game over.
While i think no matter what we should treat each day as doomsday, is it possible we are dealing with every other night conversions? We might not be at life or death yet...then again we might, just thinking out loud. If we are every night, the quiet players hold the key to our victory as at least 3-4 have to be things...

[kingfc22]

Since it looks like Hoops is after me as of right now.

VOTE HOOPS

This vote could change if I hear a valid reason to vote BK over Hoops.

[Raiders Army]

That's what I think, too. Problem is, I think if we miss this vote, it's game over.
The only good thing is that we have a better chance of hitting a Thing today than we did yesterday...and the day before that...and the day before that...

[Swaggs]

Heres the flip side though...they dont convert him he has a very real chance to ruin their game, be it once or 5 times...they took the seer out after he revealed becuase he was a threat to their victory...hoops would be a threat as well, the only one unless barkeep could kill repeatedly which we have seen hasnt happened.

Oh, I agree it is certainly a possibility. It is just my opinion, but it would take a pretty ballsy player to take that chance and risk it.

When you think about it from a Thing point of view, they risk a significant loss anytime they do not successfully convert, since they would not gain in number and they could possibly lose two people to testing in any given day.

Once again, I have no insider knowledge or insight, just trying to think logically on how they might operate to give themselves the best and safest chance to win.

[Blade6119]

I still don't see how the Things didn't convert you Blade. *grumble* :D
Hey, were even...i was wrong about you on day 2-3, you were wrong about me on 4-7 lol...granted, two more days, but whos counting. :D

[Raiders Army]

While i think no matter what we should treat each day as doomsday, is it possible we are dealing with every other night conversions? We might not be at life or death yet...then again we might, just thinking out loud. If we are every night, the quiet players hold the key to our victory as at least 3-4 have to be things...
I think we should think worst case scenario; however, it is a strong possibility that they can't convert every night due to the whiffs we've had.

[Blade6119]

Oh, I agree it is certainly a possibility. It is just my opinion, but it would take a pretty ballsy player to take that chance and risk it.

When you think about it from a Thing point of view, they risk a significant loss anytime they do not successfully convert, since they would not gain in number and they could possibly lose two people to testing in any given day.

Once again, I have no insider knowledge or insight, just trying to think logically on how they might operate to give themselves the best and safest chance to win.
Ok, if you want to assume hoops is good or went past two nights, that means you assume hoops was good night 3/4..then that means the things converted the seer on night 3, the day he revealed...i think we have proven they have balls. Question is whose balls are they.

[Blade6119]

The only good thing is that we have a better chance of hitting a Thing today than we did yesterday...and the day before that...and the day before that...
If we keep cycling through untesteds eventually we will hit a thing...likely 2-3...and we have our 2 biggest untesteds on display today...after him are people like cronin and tangle, but today is key

[hoopsguy]

Vote totals as of Post #2397:

Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), Raiders (2335), path (2342), King (2393)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350)

King - Hoopsguy (2360)

Not Voted: Barkeep, WVUFAN, Tanglewood

[Blade6119]

Interesting...hoops on king, barkeep not voting yet, and tangle(the guy they both tried to string up before) also out there. I have a feeling we will see that vote count get interesting(especially with kings double vote)

[Swaggs]

Ok, if you want to assume hoops is good or went past two nights, that means you assume hoops was good night 3/4..then that means the things converted the seer on night 3, the day he revealed...i think we have proven they have balls. Question is whose balls are they.

You have played in far more of these games than I have. Tell me who has the stones to pull risky moves off and maybe we have some more candidates.

I would say you, Barkeep, and hoopsguy, from my experience.

[Raiders Army]

From what I remember and know, Barkeep and hoops have GMed WW games on FOFC. I don't remember Blade doing one. That being said, I think there may be a trifecta there with Barkeep, hoops, and tangle. Throw in a silent partner or two and that may be all of the wolves.

[mckerney]

That's what I think, too. Problem is, I think if we miss this vote, it's game over.

I agree with this logic. I think there's a chance we miss with hoops, but I'm certain barkeep will burn when tested.

[hoopsguy]

Blade, cycling through untested is not in and of itself a winning strategy - as that number grows, it becomes more likely that the nightly convert is one of the people who has tested clear.

I'm all for going after someone who is untested, if they are the person I think is a Thing. I've stated that I'm playing percentages in many cases to try and get around the fact that trust lists are severely handicapped in this game. So I'm more inclined to trust someone who has been shown to be clear. But when that strategy is announced and agreed upon it becomes easier for them to play against.

[Blade6119]

You have played in far more of these games than I have. Tell me who has the stones to pull risky moves off and maybe we have some more candidates.

I would say you, Barkeep, and hoopsguy, from my experience.
Hoopsguy, dubb(who quit), Raiders, i dont know about barkeep, alan t isnt playing, and neither is sndvls...id say in this game, hoops/raiders/myself/ and maybe cronin...barkeep might, i just havent seen it in awhile from him...but he is a calculated player, as is hoops...and with it becoming quite clear the things converted quiet players i see only hoops and barkeep making that move...so by elimination i think hoops...

And if hoops, the bodyguard was never a threat(like how he hasnt done anything all game...not one hit)...he "missed" on what night to guard.

If barkeep, he just expected hoops to go night 4(which i would expect hoops to do to)...so its tricky

[hoopsguy]

Going back to look up all of our vote counts ... time to see if there was one where Dubb/King should have changed the outcome based on his double vote.

I know off the top of my head that he would not have changed the Saldana vote on Day 2 because he left it on me instead of going with one of the leading candidates (Saldana vs Barkeep).

[Blade6119]

From what I remember and know, Barkeep and hoops have GMed WW games on FOFC. I don't remember Blade doing one. That being said, I think there may be a trifecta there with Barkeep, hoops, and tangle. Throw in a silent partner or two and that may be all of the wolves.
I have not, they have...as for things, that was my list yesterday...

[Blade6119]

Blade, cycling through untested is not in and of itself a winning strategy - as that number grows, it becomes more likely that the nightly convert is one of the people who has tested clear.

I'm all for going after someone who is untested, if they are the person I think is a Thing. I've stated that I'm playing percentages in many cases to try and get around the fact that trust lists are severely handicapped in this game. So I'm more inclined to trust someone who has been shown to be clear. But when that strategy is announced and agreed upon it becomes easier for them to play against.
Exactly, smoke and mirrors are key. I trusted king from the second he announced his role power, not his description. I merely asked you to reveal and him for smoke and mirrors to see how you would play it. You bit exactly like i expected..i gave you a possible out, and you ran with it. Im not saying its damning, but you of all people should know a lot of my comments are smoke-screens for alterior methods

[hoopsguy]

Blade, as far as I know I had not tipped my hand at all about being the bodyguard until well into Day 5. If someone did suspect I had that role before then I have not seen a comment in this thread about it. So I don't think that Barkeep (as your designated Thing, but the same holds true for any Thing) was "counting on me guarding on Night 4". They should have had to try and figure out what the average player would be doing on that night unless they had narrowed down the bodyguard role to a couple of players.

[Blade6119]

Blade, as far as I know I had not tipped my hand at all about being the bodyguard until well into Day 5. If someone did suspect I had that role before then I have not seen a comment in this thread about it. So I don't think that Barkeep (as your designated Thing, but the same holds true for any Thing) was "counting on me guarding on Night 4". They should have had to try and figure out what the average player would be doing on that night unless they had narrowed down the bodyguard role to a couple of players.
I agree, and the average player in my mind would have waited till night 4...just makes sense after some discussion about CW's protection that night...i agree you gave minimal hints

[hoopsguy]

Right, so by catching a player in a lie I'm the one who is a Thing. Nice detective work there, Holmes :rolleyes:

If I had not guarded you last night I would be convinced (yet again) that you are playing for Team Thing. He has not contested the information that I have brought forward. The Things are continuing to play the silent strategy that has served them so well the last few days. Which may be effective, but it is stifling some of the fun of the game for me.

[Blade6119]

Right, so by catching a player in a lie I'm the one who is a Thing. Nice detective work there, Holmes :rolleyes:

If I had not guarded you last night I would be convinced (yet again) that you are playing for Team Thing. He has not contested the information that I have brought forward. The Things are continuing to play the silent strategy that has served them so well the last few days. Which may be effective, but it is stifling some of the fun of the game for me.
You didnt catch him in a lie, but you have done admirably as a thing or villager today. It was a genious catch, granted. But i contest the validity of your catch.

As for your idea on things, you say they are playing silent...barkeep is a silent as a log, yet here you are backing him...that seems rather ironic

[Swaggs]

hoops, why the confidence in Barkeep anyway?

[kingfc22]

I have to go to work. I'll try to get back online, but I can't guarantee it.

Down with the Things!

[path12]

We have more than half of the people playing the game in the room right now, but no one besides Blade or I are talking about this Kingfc22. Hmm ... wonder how many PMs are flying right now trying to figure out how to address this?

Just for the record, I've got the thread open and am trying to keep up with the discussion, but had a project handed to me this morning that's proving to be a bitch......so I'll keep observing but don't have the time to really pick through and debate right now.......suffice it to say my vote remains on hoops right now but I'm listening to all sides and am not locked anywhere.

[hoopsguy]

Swaggs, I already tried to answer why I think Barkeep is more likely to be human than most of the players in the game. It is in Post #2367. I would normally cut/paste it but it is a couple of paragraphs long and only one page back. I'll be happy to expand on it or answer any questions if you want to follow up on this.

I would love to argue for putting King and I in a tie today and see what happens (he has double votes, I should be tested, right?) but I'm worried that we lose the game if they convert every night. That said, if people are going to insist on testing me I would like for it to take place by clearing two of us at the same time.

Having a hard time finding the Day 3 votes but still working on this theory of reviewing King's votes (should be up in next few minutes):
Day 1: post #216
Day 2/1: post #417
Day 2/2: post #609

[Blade6119]

Voting king is a waste of time...you guys have all ignored me and my comments for 5 days now...dont not ignore this comment...for today, do not worry about king. His reveal cleared him for me, and it should for you as well...i repeat, for today

[hoopsguy]

Blade, I really want to know (either now or after the deadline) what it was about his reveal that cleared him for you.

I thought it was a well-crafted fake PM but without the magic words used by Dubb on Day 1 it doesn't hold up for me at all.

[Swaggs]

Voting king is a waste of time...you guys have all ignored me and my comments for 5 days now...dont not ignore this comment...for today, do not worry about king. His reveal cleared him for me, and it should for you as well...i repeat, for today

Agreed. I am not thinking about king today at all.

My vote is sitting on Barkeep and I am happy with it. As long as the final vote lands on Barkeep or hoops today, I think we are making a good move for today. Hopefully we can get both today.

I am out for awhile but will try to check back in before the deadline.

[Blade6119]

Blade, I really want to know (either now or after the deadline) what it was about his reveal that cleared him for you.

I thought it was a well-crafted fake PM but without the magic words used by Dubb on Day 1 it doesn't hold up for me at all.
I cant/wont say right now, but its in relation to game balancing...just trust me today, whether or not your a thing

[Blade6119]

well then, i think im out of here, maybe for the day...best of luck with the vote everyone, hang one of barkeep or hoops, and we have a shot...

[hoopsguy]

OK, going through each of the votes up to this point has not confirmed/denied the King "two-vote" ability:


Day 1 (post #216): Saldana (no impact: 4-2 Jeebs with four, many with two)
Day 2/1 (near post #417): Hoops (no impact: 5-4-2 Saldana-Barkeep)
Day 2/2 (post #609): Hoops (no impact: 5 for Dubb, two players tied with two)
Day 3 (post #1244): Coffee (leading vote getter)
Day 4 (post #1550, subtract Anxiety from Dubb): Anxiety (does not impact the vote)
Day 5 (post #1797): no vote, Dubb is out, King not yet in for him
Day 6/1 (last count #1965): no vote
Day 6/2 (post #2112, only vote switch after this was me to Jeeber): Barkeep (no impact: 7-3-2-1 were vote totals)
Day 7 (post #2244): Blade (no impact, runaway)


So the only day that there was a chance for him (in this case Dubb) to use the ability he chose not to do so. We know that Dubb was clean at this point in the game. We know that he was tested again when Jeebs invoked his Duke ability.

Color me a little less convinced than I was before, but I still don't get how Dubb comes out on Day 1 as simple/brilliant but King has a role description today that doesn't involve this at all. And it sounds like he isn't going to be around for the rest of the day to convince me otherwise.

[Raiders Army]

I'm leery of this pile on hoops and Barkeep's getting the bye. He may be out legitimately, but I'd like to hear something from him before the lynch tonight.

[Swaggs]

Anyone have the vote total handy?

[hoopsguy]

I still show the same info I had back at Post #2400:


Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), Raiders (2335), path (2342), King (2393)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350)

King - Hoopsguy (2360)

Not Voted: Barkeep, WVUFAN, Tanglewood

[st.cronin]

That's hardly a bandwagon on hoops. I think hoops is the best target, for a variety of reasons.

[mckerney]

I still show the same info I had back at Post #2400:


Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), Raiders (2335), path (2342), King (2393)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350)

King - Hoopsguy (2360)

Not Voted: Barkeep, WVUFAN, Tanglewood

It's likely the top two vote gettings are both things in my opinion, what concerns me is the closeness of the vote leaves it way to open to allowing the things to force a tie. Hell, with the risk of WVU and tangle not voting there could potentially be more things voting today than scientists, though if we're lucky at least one of those two is a thing. King could be the one to save us if he's able to decide between using one or two votes and avoid a tie though.

Even with the chance that king can save us, I do ask those voting hoops right now to consider switching your vote barkeep, because if we test barkeep today we'll still have a chance to test hoops on our second vote today. That I'm sure of.

[Raiders Army]

Hmmm...I'd rather not have king waste his ability at this point with a couple hours to go. Hopefully somebody will make the deciding vote or hoops will change his vote to Barkeep. At the very least we need to avoid a tie vote.

I would say that if Barkeep shows up, he'll vote for hoops (if not, he's a Thing since he wants a non-test). If hoops is a good guy, then he'll switch his vote to Barkeep to avoid the non-test. Those two votes will cancel each other out. The wildcards are WVUFan and Tanglewood. Unless one of them comes on soon, I'll have to stay online near the vote deadline so I can move my vote if necessary.

[Raiders Army]

There are a few different scenarios that I'm afraid might happen for a non-test:

1. king uses his ability to vote twice and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.
2. barkeep votes for hoops and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.
3. Tangle or WVU comes on and votes for hoops and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.

A lot of this is dependent on hoops and if he decides to leave his vote or changes it to barkeep. If he is good, then he's the only one who knows it and unless he is positive for barkeep, then he should switch his vote.

[mckerney]

Hmmm...I'd rather not have king waste his ability at this point with a couple hours to go.

I don't see it as being wasted if it's what keeps us from losing, though I also would prefer a situation where it didn't need to be used (thus my urging everyone to vote barkeep).

[mckerney]

There are a few different scenarios that I'm afraid might happen for a non-test:

1. king uses his ability to vote twice and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.
2. barkeep votes for hoops and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.
3. Tangle or WVU comes on and votes for hoops and hoops changes his vote to barkeep.

A lot of this is dependent on hoops and if he decides to leave his vote or changes it to barkeep. If he is good, then he's the only one who knows it and unless he is positive for barkeep, then he should switch his vote.

Hopefully the decision to use his ability could be made after the deadline, and he can inform schmidty to use it to avoid a tie.

[st.cronin]

I will be around at the deadline and will move my vote to avoid a tie. king, don't use your power.

[Blade6119]

A tie will not happen today if i can help it. Its 4 here, how many hours till the deadline?

[Blade6119]

I will be around at the deadline and will move my vote to avoid a tie. king, don't use your power.
King might as well, as tonight he should be a thing

[hoopsguy]

On the road home at this point, should be there for the deadline tonight.

Did King indicate somewhere that this power is one-time use? Because there are several posts here that seem to indicate this ...

[st.cronin]

King might as well, as tonight he should be a thing

I'm more worried about him accidentally using his power to FORCE a tie.

[Blade6119]

On the road home at this point, should be there for the deadline tonight.

Did King indicate somewhere that this power is one-time use? Because there are several posts here that seem to indicate this ...
He said in his original reveal he could twice a game vote worth two posts

[Blade6119]

I'm more worried about him accidentally using his power to FORCE a tie.
Both of his votes should fall to hoopsguy, so as long as people dont start swapping to barkeep it should be fine...with kings two, its 6-4 hoops...hoops swaps it 6-5, but barkeep should vote hoops making 7-6...i dont see a tie yet, maybe tangle will create(WVU is not playing anymore im pretty sure)

[path12]

He said in his original reveal he could twice a game vote worth two posts

What if he was converted last night and can break a tie in the things favor?

[Blade6119]

What if he was converted last night and can break a tie in the things favor?
You can imagine that, i can only say i trust him 99.9999999% today

[Blade6119]

dola, you have to think for yourself...ive said for days i wanted hoops or barkeep(and tangle), and im doing everything i can to get hoops or barkeep tested...

[path12]

dola, you have to think for yourself...ive said for days i wanted hoops or barkeep(and tangle), and im doing everything i can to get hoops or barkeep tested...

And I agree with you that it should be one or the other. I just want to make sure it's the right one (though I'm about 60% convinced it's both).

[tanglewood]

Well, I'm not too sure what to make of the King pm thing. If we assume that dubb didn't have brilliant in his PM and then futher assume that he was therefore a Thing, then he would've been a Thing from the start. If we assume 2 starting Things and Quik being a Thing also then that's impossible, so I find the scenario that he's a Thing unlikely.

[tanglewood]

Well, I have been an advocate of testing Barkeep earlier in the game, and he seemed to clear himself in the CW lynch, but obvoiusly that is now a few days ago now. Hoops, well I kinda suspected him in the first few days, but then he was cleared and seemed to play more helpful to the scientists cause. However, I agree with those who have noticed him acting more suspiciously recently. TO be perfectly honest, I think we have already lost this game but even if we haven't we need to hit two wolves today and probably tomorrow to stand a chance of winning.

Vote Hoopsguy

[Raiders Army]

At this point we enter hazy territory. Depending on barkeep, we might have a tie at this point. Barkeep, hoops, and king's actions are the ones that may make the difference at this point. WVUFan is AWOL.

[hoopsguy]

Sigh ...

UNVOTE KINGFC22
VOTE BARKEEP

[hoopsguy]

I'm much more convinced that King is a Thing than I am about Barkeep. But the votes are putting me in a position where I have to try and preserve myself.

I'm beyond annoyed that people are just disregarding King's obvious discrepency today. I'm hoping that if there is a tomorrow that I'm able to be as restrained in my "I Told You So's" as Blade was today. All in all, I thought he was very classy about his test last night.

[tanglewood]

The big thing I'm trying to work out is how the Things are trying to manipulate this vote. Surely they'd be trying pretty much all-out to get a scientist tested, if they get one today they've pretty much won (might even have actually won, depending on numbers).

[tanglewood]

I'm hoping that if there is a tomorrow that I'm able to be as restrained in my "I Told You So's" as Blade was today. All in all, I thought he was very classy about his test last night.

Tru dat. Sorry Blade for going after you two votes running.

[hoopsguy]

Well, if they have already won then we would not be going through the vote today.

And I see them manipulating votes by leaving them on two scientists while ignoring King - whose explanation for the discrepancy was very thin.

I get that you guys want to test me. But I also know that it is going to really hurt our cause here today. Not only do we not get a Thing, but the obvious extension is that we don't have a chance for the two-for-one. So I'm going to keep trying to convince the non-Things here to move the vote. Preferably to King, but at this point I guess I can't afford to be picky.

[Blade6119]

Tru dat. Sorry Blade for going after you two votes running.
I have a horrid record this game, and i prob. would have voted myself if i was you. Lets just do our best to win from here on out. :)

[hoopsguy]

King, are you willing to comment further on your "role" before the deadline?

If you are playing as a scientist at this point in the game I would urge you to try and figure out who the Thing is, rather than just voting for me because I'm questioning posts that don't add up to me today.

[tanglewood]

Well, if they have already won then we would not be going through the vote today.

And I see them manipulating votes by leaving them on two scientists while ignoring King - whose explanation for the discrepancy was very thin.

I get that you guys want to test me. But I also know that it is going to really hurt our cause here today. Not only do we not get a Thing, but the obvious extension is that we don't have a chance for the two-for-one. So I'm going to keep trying to convince the non-Things here to move the vote. Preferably to King, but at this point I guess I can't afford to be picky.

Okay then, make a clear case for King over either you or Barkeep in 30 seconds or less. GO!

[hoopsguy]

Can I just quote an earlier post?

[Blade6119]

Can I just quote an earlier post?
15 seconds are up, 15 left...14...13

[hoopsguy]

Posts 2360 + 2367 = my answer.

[hoopsguy]

Post #2360:
Just to make sure I understand properly - you replaced Dubb, correct?

So how do the words simple and brilliant make their way into this role? I know that you are getting worked on here for something that was said by your predecessor (Dubb) but back on Day 1 he was adamant that the "brilliant" explanation that I offered up was not sufficient to show that I was a generic scientist. That I had ignored the word "simple" in bringing out the explanation to the masses.

I'll pull up post numbers if I need to do this, but this was a big enough topic of discussion early in the game that this should certainly jog people's memory.

UNVOTE MCKERNEY
VOTE KINGFC22


Post #2367:
Swaggs, because I think the window of days for Barkeep to have been converted, as compared to most of the other players in the game, is pretty small.

The fact that Blade checked out means that Coffee Warlord was clearing at least some villagers. The idea that makes the most sense for a turned seer is to clear villagers every day rather than get cute and slip in a Thing. I don't know if that is what they did, but I think CW is a smart enough player to realize this.

Once I make that inductive leap, I then think that there are only three nights for Barkeep to have been converted. And he has been under fire the entire time ... a position that I can definitely sympathize with. Finally, I've played enough games with Barkeep that I'm going to make some decisions based on gut instinct. Which tells me that at least as of yesterday he was playing as a scientist and not a Thing.

Now, if I'm not going to vote for myself or Barkeep, then where do I go with my vote? Well, how about to someone who has been applying pressure to two guys that are pretty high on my trust list for today (Cronin and Barkeep)? Who has been attacking him for several days now and vehemently trying to make the case that he is a Thing?

That said, I would rather go after someone who appears to have screwed up with a needless role reveal (Kingfc22) than follow my suspicion. Going for the 95% play instead of the 75% play. That is my explanation for the earlier vote as well as my current vote.

[hoopsguy]

If this was Day 1 or Day 2 I wouldn't sit here and fight this hard. But if the Things convert every night then we lose here.

[Blade6119]

And you would rather us vote king...if we do, we lose here...

[hoopsguy]

Blade, I'm completely unclear on why you think King is not a Thing. Partly because you won't post your reasons for thinking this.

I know you aren't a Thing today, Blade. Which is part of what makes this frustrating ... I don't think the Things need much help on the vote today and the one guy I know is not a Thing is fixated on me and completely at odds with what I see as pretty open/shut BS role reveal.

[Blade6119]

Blade, I'm completely unclear on why you think King is not a Thing. Partly because you won't post your reasons for thinking this.

I know you aren't a Thing today, Blade. Which is part of what makes this frustrating ... I don't think the Things need much help on the vote today and the one guy I know is not a Thing is fixated on me and completely at odds with what I see as pretty open/shut BS role reveal.
Rules are in place in this game that prevent me doing what you want. So either you vote tangle who i might follow you onto or you pick yourself or barkeep...those are my 3

[hoopsguy]

Out of those three I would go Tangle - have him rated significantly higher risk than Barkeep.

[Raiders Army]

So we're tied right now?

[hoopsguy]

This is what I show for votes right now:


Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), Raiders (2335), path (2342), King (2393), Tangle (2445)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350), Hoopsguy (2447)

Not Voted: Barkeep, WVUFAN

[hoopsguy]

So I'm on the block right now - not sure if it is one or two votes. Depends on if King is telling the truth (Blade thinks he is, I call BS).

[Raiders Army]

Dang, WVUFan was online today and he posted in the Wrestling Spirit thread but declined to even vote in this one!

[hoopsguy]

No matter how this plays out, the WVUFAN factor has played a role in this game. Wish it wasn't the case, but it is.

[Raiders Army]

UNVOTE HOOPSGUY
VOTE BARKEEP49

Ah well, somebody's gotta do it.

[Barkeep49]

Vote Hoopsguy

I know I'm not a shitface.

[Barkeep49]

Raiders please switch back. I'm not a bad guy.

[tanglewood]

oh christ...

[mckerney]

Raiders please switch back. I'm not a bad guy.

Don't do it Raiders. I'm sure we'll get one in barkeep, let someone else make the move over and vote for him.

[Barkeep49]

Also I have read exactly 3 posts, the first two after I left and the one with the vote tally.

[Blade6119]

raiders...you were already 4th on my list, but barely...that didnt help...but then again, barkeep showing up at the exact second didnt either

[Barkeep49]

Don't do it Raiders. I'm sure we'll get one in barkeep, let someone else make the move over and vote for him.
I'm glad you're sure. It'll give you less crediblity in future games after you've been so sure and yet you come out so wrong.

[tanglewood]

Ok, how much do we trust King is a tiebreaker? Is it worth breaking a tie just to make 100% sure?

[hoopsguy]

6-6 right now as of post #2471 with WVUFAN not here.

If there is a tie, then King should be able to move it if he wasn't lying about his role.

[Barkeep49]

raiders...you were already 4th on my list, but barely...that didnt help...but then again, barkeep showing up at the exact second didnt either
Right. See I coach baseball. I was at baseball. It ended. See my dynasty if you don't believe that I coach baseball. I said I wasn't going to be around because normally our games run late. We got killed so I barely make it home in time.

[Blade6119]

it should be 7-6, not 6-6

[mckerney]

Ok, how much do we trust King is a tiebreaker? Is it worth breaking a tie just to make 100% sure?

It'd be worth it if you broke the tie.

[Barkeep49]

What's this about king?

[hoopsguy]

By all means, check my numbers:

Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), path (2342), King (2393), Tangle (2445), Barkeep (2470)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350), Hoopsguy (2447), Raiders (2469)

Not Voted: WVUFAN

[mckerney]

What's this about king?

As far as king, I'd be happy if he switched his vote too.

[path12]

UNVOTE HOOPS
VOTE BARKEEP

[mckerney]

UNVOTE HOOPS
VOTE BARKEEP

Thank you.

[Barkeep49]

Path you're wrong. That's what it is. I am a good guy. 100%. GAH! I can't believe we're about to lose the game.

[tanglewood]

What's this about king?

King said he's a tiebreaker, vilage unsure RE: credibility.

[path12]

Path you're wrong. That's what it is. I am a good guy. 100%. GAH! I can't believe we're about to lose the game.

I don't know. But a tie loses it for sure.

[Barkeep49]

King said he's a tiebreaker, vilage unsure RE: credibility.
Thanks. Better to have a tie then vote for me cause even if he's not telling the truth the outcome is the same.

[Blade6119]

King said he's a tiebreaker, vilage unsure RE: credibility.
Hes not a tie-breaker, he has two votes...but he has to be around to submit it to schmidty...if its tied now, you guys are soooooooo maddening

[mckerney]

We got him!

[Barkeep49]

Whatever. It's been a nice game. Interesting concept. Can't wait to see the roles and their writeups.

[Barkeep49]

We got him!
Yes you things got me. WTG.

[Blade6119]

Its tied, isnt it...sweet mother of god...you guys GAH!!!!!

[tanglewood]

Deadline gone. Well, I think it's now game over but you never know....

Maybe we got a few bodyguard blocks or the Things can't convert every night. I suppose if it is the latter then it would go someway to explaining why we haven't been coming up with many hits.

[Barkeep49]

Its tied, isnt it...sweet mother of god...you guys GAH!!!!!
Assuming hoops was counting right I'm pretty sure I'm toast.

[Barkeep49]

Deadline gone. Well, I think it's now game over but you never know....

Maybe we got a few bodyguard blocks or the Things can't convert every night. I suppose if it is the latter then it would go someway to explaining why we haven't been coming up with many hits.
True, I guess.

[tanglewood]

Yes you things got me. WTG.

Sarcasm or admission of defeat?

[hoopsguy]

Here is what I show for votes - wish it had switched to King or Tanglewood, but so be it.

Hoopsguy - Blade (2324), Cronin (2327), King (2393), Tangle (2445), Barkeep (2470)

Barkeep - mckerney (2332), Jeeber (2338), Anxiety (2344), Swaggs (2350), Hoopsguy (2447), Raiders (2469), path (2487)

Not Voted: WVUFAN